Re: [Bloat] [Ecn-sane] [iccrg] Fwd: [tcpPrague] Implementation and experimentation of TCP Prague/L4S hackaton at IETF104

2019-03-18 Thread Greg White
On 3/18/19, 11:35 PM, "Jonathan Morton" wrote: From my standpoint, the major objection to L4S is that it is not incrementally deployable, because DCTCP starves conventional TCPs unless run through an isolated queue. This is something we quickly realised when L4S was first announced.

Re: [Bloat] [Ecn-sane] [iccrg] Fwd: [tcpPrague] Implementation and experimentation of TCP Prague/L4S hackaton at IETF104

2019-03-18 Thread Jonathan Morton
> • SCE will only work if the bottleneck link implements fq. Some > bottleneck network gear will not be able to implement fq or will not > implement it due to its undesirable side effects (see section 6 of RFC 8290). > SCE leverages a paragraph in a draft that describes a first guess

Re: [Bloat] [Ecn-sane] [iccrg] Fwd: [tcpPrague] Implementation and experimentation of TCP Prague/L4S hackaton at IETF104

2019-03-18 Thread Greg White
That is ridiculous. You clearly haven’t read the drafts, and so are speaking from a position of ignorance. Please get informed before making statements like this. There is *absolutely* nothing cable-specific or “private” about L4S. It is being developed in an open forum, the IETF!! Yes,

Re: [Bloat] [Ecn-sane] [iccrg] Fwd: [tcpPrague] Implementation and experimentation of TCP Prague/L4S hackaton at IETF104

2019-03-18 Thread Dave Taht
On Tue, Mar 19, 2019 at 2:07 AM Bob Briscoe wrote: > > David, > > On 17/03/2019 18:07, David P. Reed wrote: > > Vint - > > > > BBR is the end-to-end control logic that adjusts the source rate to match the > share of the bolttleneck link it should use. > > > > It depends on getting reliable

Re: [Bloat] [Ecn-sane] [iccrg] Fwd: [tcpPrague] Implementation and experimentation of TCP Prague/L4S hackaton at IETF104

2019-03-18 Thread Bob Briscoe
David, On 17/03/2019 18:07, David P. Reed wrote: Vint - BBR is the end-to-end control logic that adjusts the source rate to match the share of the bolttleneck link it should use. It depends on getting reliable current congestion information via packet drops and/or ECN. So the proposal

Re: [Bloat] My (controversial) position paper on TCP

2019-03-18 Thread David Collier-Brown
Hey Dave, are you available for consulting gigs in Canada? In my latest incarnation, I'm doing on-line auctions in < 120 milliseconds, with at least one round trip to ~10 bidders, and I suspect we never get out of slow start. I wonder if I can make a case that this is significant, and if you

[Bloat] My (controversial) position paper on TCP

2019-03-18 Thread Dave Taht
I'm sure this would be controversial, and at the moment I'm focused on testing some sce.h +fq_codel code for freebsd. I'll slam it into the ecn-sane website at some point. ... TCP is done. It's baked. It's finished. There is very little left we can do to improve it, and we should move on to

[Bloat] A good book for the plane flight: Open Standards and the Digital Age: History, Ideology, and Networks

2019-03-18 Thread Dave Taht
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00JXII4SK/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_d_asin_title_o01?ie=UTF8=1 Particularly... the chapter (pp 230-260 or so) on how events led up to the end of OSI (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/OSI_model#Layer_4:_Transport_Layer) and to IPv4 with the IETF ROAD working group creating