[ccp4bb] Problem with splitting nucleotides into multiple TLS groups in REFMAC

2010-07-15 Thread Huw Jenkins
Hi, I am currently refining some reasonably high (1.4-1.6 Å) resolution protein:RNA complex structures and was trying the approach described in Schwartz et al. Nat. Struct. Biol. 8 (2001) 761-765 where they divided each nucleotide into three TLS groups – the ribose, the phosphorus atom plus

Re: [ccp4bb] Problem with splitting nucleotides into multiple TLS groups in REFMAC

2010-07-15 Thread Tim Gruene
Hello Huw, what happens when you remove the period '.' in the residue range description, i.e., replace RANGE 'B 3.' 'B 3.' P with RANGE 'B 3' 'B 3' P ? Tim On Thu, Jul 15, 2010 at 03:54:45PM +0100, Huw Jenkins wrote: Hi, I am currently refining some reasonably high

Re: [ccp4bb] Problem with splitting nucleotides into multiple TLS groups in REFMAC

2010-07-15 Thread Martyn Winn
Hi, Yes, zero origin is a sure sign that it hasn't identified the atoms in the TLS group. There is presumably some problem matching atom names, but am not sure what. If you send me the files, I can have a play. However, you might have problems with the group definitions anyway. I seem to

Re: [ccp4bb] Problem with splitting nucleotides into multiple TLS groups in REFMAC

2010-07-15 Thread Huw Jenkins
On 15 Jul 2010, at 16:24, Tim Gruene wrote: what happens when you remove the period '.' in the residue range description, i.e., replace RANGE 'B 3.' 'B 3.' P with RANGE 'B 3' 'B 3' P No difference unfortunately. Thanks, Huw -- Dr Huw Jenkins Astbury Centre for

Re: [ccp4bb] Problem with splitting nucleotides into multiple TLS groups in REFMAC

2010-07-15 Thread Huw Jenkins
On 15 Jul 2010, at 16:28, Martyn Winn wrote: Yes, zero origin is a sure sign that it hasn't identified the atoms in the TLS group. There is presumably some problem matching atom names, but am not sure what. If you send me the files, I can have a play. I thought that too but if I change the

Re: [ccp4bb] Problem with splitting nucleotides into multiple TLS groups in REFMAC

2010-07-15 Thread Ethan Merritt
On Thursday 15 July 2010, Huw Jenkins wrote: Hi, I am currently refining some reasonably high (1.4-1.6 Å) resolution protein:RNA complex structures and was trying the approach described in Schwartz et al. Nat. Struct. Biol. 8 (2001) 761-765 where they divided each nucleotide into three

Re: [ccp4bb] Problem with splitting nucleotides into multiple TLS groups in REFMAC

2010-07-15 Thread Huw Jenkins
On 15 Jul 2010, at 17:06, Ethan Merritt wrote: My gut feeling is that the best TLS description would be each base (or base pair) in its own group, the use TLSMD to analyse and assign groups for the backbone atoms. But again I have no actual experience with this, so it's only a suggestion.

Re: [ccp4bb] Problem with splitting nucleotides into multiple TLS groups in REFMAC

2010-07-15 Thread Tim Gruene
Dear Huw, at 1.4-1.6A resolution I would actually try anisotropic refinement and tighten the restraints a little in case the resolution is not quite high enough. You can do this with refmac5, phenix.refine, and shelxl and you would not have to worry about TLS groups anymore. Cheers, Tim On

Re: [ccp4bb] Problem with splitting nucleotides into multiple TLS groups in REFMAC

2010-07-15 Thread Daniel Anderson
Refinement with rigid-base TLS parameterization has been previously explored: Holbrook, Dickerson, Kim (1985) Acta Cryst B41, 255-262. (the photocopy is located in the pile of dust that I maintain adjacent to my desk) Ethan Merritt wrote: On Thursday 15 July 2010, Huw Jenkins wrote: Hi,

Re: [ccp4bb] Problem with splitting nucleotides into multiple TLS groups in REFMAC

2010-07-15 Thread Ethan Merritt
On Thursday 15 July 2010 09:18:33 am Huw Jenkins wrote: On 15 Jul 2010, at 17:06, Ethan Merritt wrote: My gut feeling is that the best TLS description would be each base (or base pair) in its own group, then use TLSMD to analyse and assign groups for the backbone atoms. But again I