On Jan 26, 2016, at 10:07 PM, Fred Cisin wrote:
>>> 82901A and the HP 9121D now work great. Quite low capacity (270k?) due to
>>> the weird LIF formatting, formats 35 tracks but uses only 33, out of the
>>> 40. I wonder why.
>> Partially because the original 5.25" drives (Shugart SA400) were 35
On 01/27/2016 02:07 PM, Eric Smith wrote:
The double-density RX02 data fields are in a modifed MFM, which is
what M2FM or MMFM stands for. It doesn't use the same encoding
rules as are most commonly used for M2FM, though.
...and that was exactly my objection. This becomes a case of the Monty
On Wed, Jan 27, 2016 at 9:49 AM, Chuck Guzis wrote:
> That's exactly what I was asking. But you implied that the RX02 was MMFM,
> which, in my experience is not the case.
The double-density RX02 data fields are in a modifed MFM, which is
what M2FM or MMFM stands for. It doesn't use the same enc
On 01/26/2016 09:07 PM, Eric Smith wrote:
On Tue, Jan 26, 2016 at 7:04 PM, Chuck Guzis
wrote:
You've lost me there. Both HP and Intel were true MMFM;
There's more to it than the basic channel code.
IBM 3740 and Ohio Scientific 8-inch both use "true FM" for the
channel code, but they aren't
On Tue, 26 Jan 2016, Chuck Guzis wrote:
So did Intel on the MDS. I don't recall if there was any significant
difference between Intel and HP MMFM encoding, however.
The initial CRC value ($ vs. $) and the header (six vs. four
bytes) are different, but the encoding was quite identical.
82901A and the HP 9121D now work great. Quite low capacity (270k?) due to
the weird LIF formatting, formats 35 tracks but uses only 33, out of the
40. I wonder why.
Partially because the original 5.25" drives (Shugart SA400) were 35 track (#0
- #34), not 40.
I don't even remember, . . .
Does
On Tue, 26 Jan 2016, CuriousMarc wrote:
You make me feel lucky. I have all 3 (almost, I have the low density HP
9121 rather than an HD 9122 so I can use it on my HP 85)... Haven't
restored or even powered up the recently acquired HP 9895 yet, but the
HP 82901A and the HP 9121D now work great. Q
--
From: cctalk [mailto:cctalk-boun...@classiccmp.org] On Behalf Of Eric Smith
Sent: Tuesday, January 26, 2016 2:48 PM
To: General Discussion: On-Topic and Off-Topic Posts
Subject: Re: Substituting DSHD for DSDD disks (or DS2D if you prefer)
On Tue, Oct 27, 2015 at 7:47 AM, Paul Berger wrote:
> I woul
On Tue, Jan 26, 2016 at 7:04 PM, Chuck Guzis wrote:
> You've lost me there. Both HP and Intel were true MMFM;
There's more to it than the basic channel code.
IBM 3740 and Ohio Scientific 8-inch both use "true FM" for the channel
code, but they aren't compatible.
The HP 9895 M2FM and Intel M2FM
On 01/26/2016 05:27 PM, Eric Smith wrote:
Entirely different. As was DEC RX02.
You've lost me there. Both HP and Intel were true MMFM; the RX02 was
single-density headers and a somewhat modified MFM (probably to avoid
false FM address mark triggering on MFM sequences.
--Chuck
On Tue, Jan 26, 2016 at 5:59 PM, Chuck Guzis wrote:
> On 01/26/2016 02:48 PM, Eric Smith wrote:
>
>> I was surprised to learn that the 9895, while it supports standard
>> IBM 3740 single-density format, uses an HP-proprietary M2FM
>> double-density format.
>
>
> So did Intel on the MDS. I don't r
On 01/26/2016 02:48 PM, Eric Smith wrote:
I was surprised to learn that the 9895, while it supports standard
IBM 3740 single-density format, uses an HP-proprietary M2FM
double-density format.
So did Intel on the MDS. I don't recall if there was any significant
difference between Intel and HP
On 2016-01-26 6:48 PM, Eric Smith wrote:
On Tue, Oct 27, 2015 at 7:47 AM, Paul Berger wrote:
I would really
like to get a HP 9895 8" drive but they seem to be few and far between.
Same here. And I'd like to get an 82901M 5.25" drive, and a 9122C HD 3.5".
I was surprised to learn that the 9895
On Tue, Oct 27, 2015 at 7:47 AM, Paul Berger wrote:
> I would really
> like to get a HP 9895 8" drive but they seem to be few and far between.
Same here. And I'd like to get an 82901M 5.25" drive, and a 9122C HD 3.5".
I was surprised to learn that the 9895, while it supports standard IBM
3740 si
On 2015-10-27 10:53 AM, Jerome H. Fine wrote:
>Paul Berger wrote:
>On 2015-10-26 11:38 AM, Jules Richardson wrote:
>On 10/24/2015 09:14 PM, Fred Cisin wrote:
Are we really running short of "720K" floppies?
I went around all the local places that I could think of a couple of
years ago and
>Paul Berger wrote:
>On 2015-10-26 11:38 AM, Jules Richardson wrote:
>On 10/24/2015 09:14 PM, Fred Cisin wrote:
Are we really running short of "720K" floppies?
I went around all the local places that I could think of a couple of
years ago and bought up whatever stock of floppies that I co
>
> Yes, the Sony OA-D32 drives. Single-sided 600 RPM. One *could* argue,
> that, given the data rate, it's already "high density" (of a sort). I
I would say it's normal double density (the spacing of the flux transitions
on the disk is the same as on a PC 720K disk) but a high data rate due
t
Chuck good to know we probably need some - I do not think we have
any good clean ones new here... will check
Ed#
In a message dated 10/26/2015 9:50:44 A.M. US Mountain Standard Time,
ccl...@sydex.com writes:
On 10/26/2015 01:04 AM, couryho...@aol.com wrote:
> and the firs
On 10/26/2015 01:04 AM, couryho...@aol.com wrote:
and the first hp-150 drive set, the hp-9121, was single sided
double density SS/DD discs (270Kb).
sure was glad when the 9122 came out!
I supsect that the Sony SMC-70 may have been among the first systems to
come out with the things.
On Mon, 26 Oct 2015, Jules Richardson wrote:
On 10/24/2015 09:14 PM, Fred Cisin wrote:
Are we really running short of "720K" floppies?
I've never had any luck finding used disks anywhere locally; people are a bit
too concerned about data theft these days, and all of that seems to go
straig
On 2015-10-26 11:38 AM, Jules Richardson wrote:
On 10/24/2015 09:14 PM, Fred Cisin wrote:
Are we really running short of "720K" floppies?
I went around all the local places that I could think of a couple of
years ago and bought up whatever stock of floppies that I could find
(and picking sur
On 10/24/2015 09:14 PM, Fred Cisin wrote:
Are we really running short of "720K" floppies?
I went around all the local places that I could think of a couple of years
ago and bought up whatever stock of floppies that I could find (and picking
sure were slim). Quite a few boxes of 3.5" HD, a few
and the first hp-150 drive set, the hp-9121, was single sided double
density SS/DD discs (270Kb).
sure was glad when the 9122 came out!
Always looking for more HP-150 stuff for our display... any one have a
monarch butterfly advertising poster?
Ed# _www.smecc.org_ (http://www.sm
On 10/25/2015 11:12 PM, tony duell wrote:
Not always! The original Sony full-height drives (the 600rm ones)
have a disk-inserted sensor positioned exactly where that hole is. So
if you insert an HD disk the drive doesn't detect it. It is rumoured
this was deliberate (positioning of the HD hole)
[HD 3.5" disks and the density-select hole]
> Of course, on a DD-only drive, the drive is blind to the extra hole.
Not always! The original Sony full-height drives (the 600rm ones) have a
disk-inserted sensor positioned exactly where that hole is. So if you insert
an HD disk the drive doesn't
On 10/25/2015 09:19 PM, Eric Christopherson wrote:
Also, do I always need to cover one hole on a 3.5" HD disk when using
it in an HD-capable drive? Or does the disk or the OS notice it's
been formatted as DD and then treat it accordingly?
In *most* applications, the extra hole in the HD floppy
On Sun, Oct 25, 2015 at 3:05 PM, Eric Christopherson <
echristopher...@gmail.com> wrote:
> On Sun, Oct 25, 2015, Joseph Lang wrote:
> > This list seems to me to be populated with "build your own" types, so
> make your own degausser.
> > Decades ago I repaired the tape eraser at the TV station I wo
On 10/25/2015 01:36 PM, Fred Cisin wrote:
3 years ago, when I stayed at my mother's house taking care of her,
it took me a month to find out that she did not have unlimited local
calling! Adding DSL on the phone account reduced the phone bill a
lot.
That house is now mine. AT&T DSL here sucks.
On 10/25/2015 01:07 PM, Eric Christopherson wrote:
Actually, in many areas of the US, they had local dialup numbers
that connected to their service through Tymnet and/or Telenet, so
long distance didn't apply. Maybe in rural areas those access points
were still long distance, though. But AOL its
On Sun, 25 Oct 2015, Eric Christopherson wrote:
Actually, in many areas of the US, they had local dialup numbers that
connected to their service through Tymnet and/or Telenet, so long
distance didn't apply. Maybe in rural areas those access points were
still long distance, though. But AOL itself
On Sun, Oct 25, 2015, ben wrote:
> On 10/25/2015 1:03 PM, Fred Cisin wrote:
>
> >
> >Blaming the medium for the content?
> >Or, . . .
> >if you were putting something like that onto disks,
> >would you spring the money for high quality ones?
> >
> I suspect the reason they failed was not service
>
On Sun, Oct 25, 2015, Joseph Lang wrote:
> This list seems to me to be populated with "build your own" types, so make
> your own degausser.
> Decades ago I repaired the tape eraser at the TV station I worked at. Once I
> saw how it was built I built my own. Take a transformer (something about 10
On 10/25/2015 1:03 PM, Fred Cisin wrote:
Blaming the medium for the content?
Or, . . .
if you were putting something like that onto disks,
would you spring the money for high quality ones?
I suspect the reason they failed was not service
but a) PC's had games b) Ma Bell wanted a arm and a leg
Are we really running short of "720K" floppies? I thought that AOHell
had sent out enough snail spam with disks to supply us forever!
Indeed, but the quality of those diskettes was dreadful.
On Sun, 25 Oct 2015, ben wrote:
More the Service provided from the disk.?
Blaming the medium for the
On 10/25/2015 7:07 AM, Steven Hirsch wrote:
On Sat, 24 Oct 2015, Fred Cisin wrote:
Are we really running short of "720K" floppies? I thought that AOHell
had sent out enough snail spam with disks to supply us forever!
Indeed, but the quality of those diskettes was dreadful.
More the Service
> -Original Message-
> From: cctalk [mailto:cctalk-boun...@classiccmp.org] On Behalf Of Steven
> Hirsch
> Sent: 25 October 2015 13:08
> To: General Discussion: On-Topic and Off-Topic Posts
>
> Subject: Re: Substituting DSHD for DSDD disks (or DS2D if you prefer)
>
On Sat, 24 Oct 2015, Fred Cisin wrote:
Are we really running short of "720K" floppies? I thought that AOHell
had sent out enough snail spam with disks to supply us forever!
Indeed, but the quality of those diskettes was dreadful.
--
This list seems to me to be populated with "build your own" types, so make your
own degausser.
Decades ago I repaired the tape eraser at the TV station I worked at. Once I
saw how it was built I built my own. Take a transformer (something about 100
watt or more) pull the laminations out (the ha
On 10/24/2015 09:06 PM, Eric Christopherson wrote:
Fascinating -- I didn't know there were AC and DC magnetic fields.
How strong is "very strong", and would the library device I mentioned
count toward "an AC erase"? Should I assume that just doing an AC
erase would be insufficient?
The AC uni
On Sat, Oct 24, 2015 at 9:14 PM, Fred Cisin wrote:
> On Sat, 24 Oct 2015, Eric Christopherson wrote:
>
>> I know Chuck Guzis has written about this, but I don't see that he's done
>> so publicly in the last few years, so I thought I'd ask here about his and
>> others' views on the perennial quest
On 10/24/2015 06:59 PM, Eric Christopherson wrote:
I know Chuck Guzis has written about this, but I don't see that he's done
so publicly in the last few years, so I thought I'd ask here about his and
others' views on the perennial question of whether (some) 3.5" DSHD disks
can be reliably used in
On Sat, 24 Oct 2015, Eric Christopherson wrote:
I know Chuck Guzis has written about this, but I don't see that he's done
so publicly in the last few years, so I thought I'd ask here about his and
others' views on the perennial question of whether (some) 3.5" DSHD disks
can be reliably used in DS
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