RE: The TRS-80 Journey Continues

and Off-Topic Posts Subject: Re: The TRS-80 Journey Continues On Wed, 25 May 2022, Bill Gunshannon via cctalk wrote: > Another question for the masters here. > I just tried to revive my Model III. More than half the keys don't > work anymore. What is the conventional wisdom on

Re: The TRS-80 Journey Continues

On Wed, 25 May 2022, Bill Gunshannon via cctalk wrote: Another question for the masters here. I just tried to revive my Model III. More than half the keys don't work anymore. What is the conventional wisdom on cleaning these old TRS-80 keyboards? Is compressed air usually enough? Can I spray

Re: The TRS-80 Journey Continues

On Wed, May 25, 2022 at 2:07 PM Bill Gunshannon via cctalk wrote: > > > Another question for the masters here. > > I just tried to revive my Model III. More than half the > keys don't work anymore. What is the conventional wisdom > on cleaning these old TRS-80 keyboards? Is compressed air >

Re: The TRS-80 Journey Continues

Another question for the masters here. I just tried to revive my Model III. More than half the keys don't work anymore. What is the conventional wisdom on cleaning these old TRS-80 keyboards? Is compressed air usually enough? Can I spray the switches with something like DeOxit safely? I

Re: The TRS-80 Journey Continues

On 5/11/22 21:07, Bill Degnan via cctalk wrote: Was it SYSGEN? As near as I can tell SYSGEN only modifies a file (or two) but does not copy any files to a new location. Bill No, SYSGEN is the CP/M command to initialize a blank, formatted disk with the CP/M system: “The SYSGEN transient

Re: The TRS-80 Journey Continues

On 5/11/22 21:05, Fred Cisin via cctalk wrote: In the meantime (as a proof of concept?), you can manually read and write sectors with SUPERZAP  ? On Wed, 11 May 2022, Bill Gunshannon via cctalk wrote: Wow, SuperZAP.  Time do build a System with NEWDOS80.  :-) Well, it's a good one to have.

Re: The TRS-80 Journey Continues

> >>Was it SYSGEN? > > > >As near as I can tell SYSGEN only modifies a file (or two) but > >does not copy any files to a new location. > > > >Bill > > > > No, SYSGEN is the CP/M command to initialize a blank, formatted disk with the > CP/M system: > > “The SYSGEN transient command allows

Re: The TRS-80 Journey Continues

In the meantime (as a proof of concept?), you can manually read and write sectors with SUPERZAP  ? On Wed, 11 May 2022, Bill Gunshannon via cctalk wrote: Wow, SuperZAP. Time do build a System with NEWDOS80. :-) Well, it's a good one to have. There are lots of alternatives to SUPERZAP,

Re: The TRS-80 Journey Continues

On 5/11/22 19:51, Fred Cisin via cctalk wrote: On Wed, 11 May 2022, Bill Gunshannon via cctalk wrote: That's the way I have always known it to be. Thus why I said if I work on a project to build boot floppies from hard disk systems I will have to have a collection of BOOT Code for the various

Re: The TRS-80 Journey Continues

On Wed, 11 May 2022, Bill Gunshannon via cctalk wrote: That's the way I have always known it to be. Thus why I said if I work on a project to build boot floppies from hard disk systems I will have to have a collection of BOOT Code for the various OSes and know how they use it. I guess the first

Re: The TRS-80 Journey Continues

On 5/11/22 10:34, Mike Katz wrote: I don't know about TRS-DOS but a lot of early floppy disk format programs had an option to make the formatted disk bootable or not. This would copy the bootloader to the appropriate location on the floppy, copy the OS to the floppy and update any necessary

Re: The TRS-80 Journey Continues

On 5/11/22 17:54, Wayne S wrote: Have you seen this post? https://www.nightfallcrew.com/15/04/2012/tandy-radio-shack-trs-80-model-4p-dos-boot-disk/ I've seen that. Again, that is not building a boot

Re: The TRS-80 Journey Continues

On 5/11/22 16:23, Fred Cisin via cctalk wrote: are you running montezuma CP/M? On Wed, 11 May 2022, Bill Gunshannon via cctalk wrote: Among others. TRS-DOS,, LDOS, LS-DOS, DOSPLUS, NEWDOS. I could probably do CPM but at the moment the others are the question. I, also, thought that you were

Re: The TRS-80 Journey Continues

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=XoxpnZ__w5Q On Wed, 11 May 2022, Bill Gunshannon via cctalk wrote: That's a Tandy 2000. Not a TRS-80 at all and it was never called that by Radio Shack. There are hundreds of YouTube videos on making MSDOS bootable floppies. Being as all it really took was the

Re: The TRS-80 Journey Continues

are you running montezuma CP/M? On Wed, 11 May 2022, Bill Gunshannon via cctalk wrote: Among others. TRS-DOS,, LDOS, LS-DOS, DOSPLUS, NEWDOS. I could probably do CPM but at the moment the others are the question. I, also, thought that you were asking for Montezuma Micro when I mentioned

Re: The TRS-80 Journey Continues

On 5/11/22 14:51, Robert Feldman via cctalk wrote: Date: Wed, 11 May 2022 06:24:38 -0400 From: Bill Gunshannon To: Fred Cisin , "General Discussion: On-Topic and Off-Topic Posts" Subject: Re: The TRS-80 Journey Continues On 5/10/22 22:33, Fred Cisin wrote: On Tue, 10 May

Re: The TRS-80 Journey Continues

> >Date: Wed, 11 May 2022 06:24:38 -0400 >From: Bill Gunshannon >To: Fred Cisin , "General Discussion: On-Topic and Off-Topic Posts" >Subject: Re: The TRS-80 Journey Continues > >>On 5/10/22 22:33, Fred Cisin wrote: >>On Tue, 10 May 2022, Bill Gun

Re: The TRS-80 Journey Continues

So, the bad news is no way found so far to make bootable floppies. Maybe not bad news as it gives me another fun project to work on. Further good news, however, is that I have revived my M3SE, MISE and 2 FreHD's so I now have hard disks for pretty much all my old systems. Just have to build

Re: The TRS-80 Journey Continues

On 5/11/22 13:40, Wayne S wrote: There’s some utube videos on making bootable floppies. Maybe one of them will give you some ideas. Here’s one that looks promising. https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=XoxpnZ__w5Q That's a Tandy 2000. Not a TRS-80 at

Re: The TRS-80 Journey Continues

I don't know about TRS-DOS but a lot of early floppy disk format programs had an option to make the formatted disk bootable or not. This would copy the bootloader to the appropriate location on the floppy, copy the OS to the floppy and update any necessary pointers to the OS on the floppy.

Re: The TRS-80 Journey Continues

> > Based on the results of my last attempt, I doubt it would work. > Looks like there is a need to figure out how to install a boot > block and what files need to be copied to make usable floppies > for all the OSes. Yet another task to work on. > > I still can't believe there is no documented

Re: The TRS-80 Journey Continues

On 5/11/22 09:32, Bill Degnan wrote: Each OS has its own process. PIP to copy the rest of the files if you're using CP/M Trsdos 6. (I think) FORMAT :0 BACKUP $:x :1 (SYS,INV) Where x is your hard drive letter. Depends how much is on your hard drive. If possible use a floppy to make a boot

Re: The TRS-80 Journey Continues

> > > > > > Each OS has its own process. PIP to copy the rest of the files if > > you're using CP/M > > > > Trsdos 6. (I think) > > FORMAT :0 > > BACKUP $:x :1 (SYS,INV) > > > > Where x is your hard drive letter. > > > > Depends how much is on your hard drive. If possible use a floppy to > >

Re: The TRS-80 Journey Continues

On 5/11/22 07:11, Bill Degnan wrote: On Wed, May 11, 2022, 6:24 AM Bill Gunshannon via cctalk mailto:cctalk@classiccmp.org>> wrote: On 5/10/22 22:33, Fred Cisin wrote: > On Tue, 10 May 2022, Bill Gunshannon via cctalk wrote: >> DDensity.  I thought there was a single command

Re: The TRS-80 Journey Continues

On Wed, May 11, 2022, 6:24 AM Bill Gunshannon via cctalk < cctalk@classiccmp.org> wrote: > On 5/10/22 22:33, Fred Cisin wrote: > > On Tue, 10 May 2022, Bill Gunshannon via cctalk wrote: > >> DDensity. I thought there was a single command to make the system > >> part and then you just added the

Re: The TRS-80 Journey Continues

On 5/10/22 22:33, Fred Cisin wrote: On Tue, 10 May 2022, Bill Gunshannon via cctalk wrote: DDensity.  I thought there was a single command to make the system part and then you just added the Utilities you wanted. Was it SYSGEN? As near as I can tell SYSGEN only modifies a file (or two) but

Re: The TRS-80 Journey Continues

On 5/10/22 21:45, Bill Degnan wrote: are you running montezuma CP/M? Among others. TRS-DOS,, LDOS, LS-DOS, DOSPLUS, NEWDOS. I could probably do CPM but at the moment the others are the question. bill

Re: The TRS-80 Journey Continues

[TRS-80 Model 4P] > If it will do it with a blank disk, then the statements that it "doesn't > have ROMs" are more faulty. It obviously has SOME ROMs, to start up enough > to try to boot. But, this would tend towards disproving the statements > that it doesn't have BASIC in ROM. > And, if it has

Re: The TRS-80 Journey Continues

On Tue, 10 May 2022, Bill Gunshannon via cctalk wrote: DDensity. I thought there was a single command to make the system part and then you just added the Utilities you wanted. Was it SYSGEN?

Re: The TRS-80 Journey Continues

are you running montezuma CP/M? On Tue, May 10, 2022 at 9:39 PM Bill Gunshannon via cctalk wrote: > > > > Well, I hope this doesn't sound too stupid but I have searched all > the manuals I have and the web as well with no luck. > > How do I make a bootable floppy from a running hard disk system?

Re: The TRS-80 Journey Continues

Well, I hope this doesn't sound too stupid but I have searched all the manuals I have and the web as well with no luck. How do I make a bootable floppy from a running hard disk system? Not copy an image to a floppy but build a bootable floppy disk on a real running system. I know it can be

Re: The TRS-80 Journey Continues

Sorry, to pester with irrelevant details, . . . On Mon, 9 May 2022, Bill Gunshannon via cctalk wrote: Not pestering. I appreciate you taking the time to answer my questions. I'm enjoying "going back to those days". But, I got out of TRS80 whenthe PC was introduced. When the model4 came

Re: The TRS-80 Journey Continues

On 5/9/22 17:08, Fred Cisin via cctalk wrote: On Mon, 9 May 2022, Bill Gunshannon via cctalk wrote: I "duplicated" getting the prompts that I don;t think should be there. All I have to do is try to boot from a bad disk.  ie. Hit reset while holding the "1" key with a non-bootable disk in drive

Re: The TRS-80 Journey Continues

On Mon, 9 May 2022, Bill Gunshannon via cctalk wrote: I "duplicated" getting the prompts that I don;t think should be there. All I have to do is try to boot from a bad disk. ie. Hit reset while holding the "1" key with a non-bootable disk in drive 0:. Sorry, to pester with irrelevant details,

Re: The TRS-80 Journey Continues

On 5/9/22 14:39, Kelly Leavitt wrote: *From:* cctalk on behalf of Bill Gunshannon via cctalk *Sent:* Monday, May 9, 2022 1:10 PM *To:* cctalk@classiccmp.org *Subject:* Re: The TRS-80 Journey Continues On 5/9/22 13

Re: The TRS-80 Journey Continues

From: cctalk on behalf of Bill Gunshannon via cctalk Sent: Monday, May 9, 2022 1:10 PM To: cctalk@classiccmp.org Subject: Re: The TRS-80 Journey Continues On 5/9/22 13:410 Bill via cctalk wrote: > Just took some time to duplicate it. Answered the &q

Re: The TRS-80 Journey Continues

On 5/7/22 13:48, Fred Cisin via cctalk wrote: On Sat, 7 May 2022, Bill Gunshannon via cctalk wrote: On another note, at one point my 4P failed to read from a floppy.  The "Cass?" prompt showed up followed by the "Memory" prompt.  I'm confused.  I thought the 4P didn't have any ROM in it. 

Re: The TRS-80 Journey Continues

You can image them with Dave Dunfield's 765 utilities; GreaseWeazel hardware isn't necessary. On Sat, 7 May 2022, Bill Gunshannon via cctalk wrote: Image them with what hardware? A PC or one of my TRS-80's? Yes. Either can do it. If you can find a PC with a floppy drive, "normal" FDC

Re: The TRS-80 Journey Continues

On 5/7/22 13:48, Fred Cisin via cctalk wrote: On Sat, 7 May 2022, Bill Gunshannon via cctalk wrote: I had forgotten just how much fun the TRS-80's could be. At least for the moment I am giving up on trying to get a TEAC 55GFR to work and just grabbed a par of disks from one of my COCOs to work

Re: The TRS-80 Journey Continues

On Sat, 7 May 2022, Bill Gunshannon via cctalk wrote: I had forgotten just how much fun the TRS-80's could be. At least for the moment I am giving up on trying to get a TEAC 55GFR to work and just grabbed a par of disks from one of my COCOs to work with. I think one of the things I need to do

Re: The TRS-80 Journey Continues

I had forgotten just how much fun the TRS-80's could be. At least for the moment I am giving up on trying to get a TEAC 55GFR to work and just grabbed a par of disks from one of my COCOs to work with. I think one of the things I need to do is try to move all of my old 5.25" disks to 3.5" disks

Re: The TRS-80 Journey Continues

On Thu, 5 May 2022, Fred Cisin via cctalk wrote: Although TRS-DOS didn't (until 6.0?, when TRS-DOS became rebranded LDOS), the after-market OS's supported DS and 80 track. I don't remember how you needed to tell the OS that you had DS or 80 track. But, once the OS knows, then the 55GFR,

Re: The TRS-80 Journey Continues

To test the suspect drive, you could connect it to a PC; with DS1 jumpered (instead of DS0), it should work as a "180K" (single sided "360K"). a PC with a floppy controller? Wow, is that ever retro. Besides FDC (especially for PCI :-), current Windoze doesn't seem to even know about single

Re: The TRS-80 Journey Continues

The Teac FD-55GFR is a 96tpi drive.?? It can replace a 55G (1.2M), or a 55F (720K) depending on controller, but it still has a narrow head for doing 80 tracks. It will have to be jumpered to run at 300RPM, not 360. On Thu, 5 May 2022, Bill Gunshannon via cctalk wrote: It has a jumper that

Re: The TRS-80 Journey Continues

On 5/5/22 17:12, Fred Cisin via cctalk wrote: Double sided drives in 4P shouldn't require anything more than software patches, to tell the OS (TRS-DOS, CP/M, etc.) that you have and want to use the other side. The Model 3 and 4 disk controller (did the 4P use the same one??) supports double

Re: The TRS-80 Journey Continues

On 5/5/22 16:50, Mike Katz via cctalk wrote: If you use a 80 track (96 TPI) 5 1/4" drive to read 40 track (48 PTI) floppies that will work but if you write onto them they will not be readable in a 40 track drive any more.   The reason for this is that the had is half the width and when the 80

Re: The TRS-80 Journey Continues

On 5/5/22 16:28, Fred Cisin via cctalk wrote: Next step... Apparently mu original Tandon floppy has bought the farm. Does anyone know what the jumper setting are for a TEAC FD-55GFR-149 for the TRS-80 4P? I tried the usual (like for a DEC RX-33) but that didn't fly.  Every sector fails verify

Re: The TRS-80 Journey Continues

On Thu, 5 May 2022, Bill Gunshannon via cctalk wrote: On 5/5/22 13:34, Mike Loewen via cctalk wrote: On Thu, 5 May 2022, Bill Gunshannon via cctalk wrote: Next step... Apparently mu original Tandon floppy has bought the farm. Does anyone know what the jumper setting are for a TEAC

Re: The TRS-80 Journey Continues

Double sided drives in 4P shouldn't require anything more than software patches, to tell the OS (TRS-DOS, CP/M, etc.) that you have and want to use the other side. The Model 3 and 4 disk controller (did the 4P use the same one??) supports double sided and uses pin32 as side select (as deity

Re: The TRS-80 Journey Continues

If you use a 80 track (96 TPI) 5 1/4" drive to read 40 track (48 PTI) floppies that will work but if you write onto them they will not be readable in a 40 track drive any more.   The reason for this is that the had is half the width and when the 80 track drives writes to a 40 track written

Re: The TRS-80 Journey Continues

Next step... Apparently mu original Tandon floppy has bought the farm. Does anyone know what the jumper setting are for a TEAC FD-55GFR-149 for the TRS-80 4P? I tried the usual (like for a DEC RX-33) but that didn't fly.  Every sector fails verify after a format.  I am sure it's a jumper thing.

Re: The TRS-80 Journey Continues

On 5/5/22 13:34, Mike Loewen via cctalk wrote: On Thu, 5 May 2022, Bill Gunshannon via cctalk wrote: Next step... Apparently mu original Tandon floppy has bought the farm. Does anyone know what the jumper setting are for a TEAC FD-55GFR-149 for the TRS-80 4P? I tried the usual (like for a

Re: The TRS-80 Journey Continues

On Thu, 5 May 2022, Bill Gunshannon via cctalk wrote: Next step... Apparently mu original Tandon floppy has bought the farm. Does anyone know what the jumper setting are for a TEAC FD-55GFR-149 for the TRS-80 4P? I tried the usual (like for a DEC RX-33) but that didn't fly. Every sector

Re: The TRS-80 Journey Continues

Next step... Apparently mu original Tandon floppy has bought the farm. Does anyone know what the jumper setting are for a TEAC FD-55GFR-149 for the TRS-80 4P? I tried the usual (like for a DEC RX-33) but that didn't fly. Every sector fails verify after a format. I am sure it's a jumper

Re: The TRS-80 Journey Continues

that's great news. Bill On Wed, May 4, 2022 at 8:23 PM Bill Gunshannon via cctalk wrote: > > > > My thanks for all the help. I now have CP/M 2.2 booting and running > from a hard disk on a TRS-80 Model 4P, Now back to my PL/M. > > bill

Re: The TRS-80 Journey Continues

My thanks for all the help. I now have CP/M 2.2 booting and running from a hard disk on a TRS-80 Model 4P, Now back to my PL/M. bill

Re: The TRS-80 Journey Continues

On Wed, 4 May 2022, Bill Gunshannon via cctalk wrote: On 5/4/22 14:35, Bill Degnan wrote: Bill, I searched for "montezuma 2.2 hard drive install" on Google: https://oldcomputers.dyndns.org/public/pub/manuals/montezuma_micro_hard_disk_support_for_cpm_2-2.pdf I have been through the

Re: The TRS-80 Journey Continues

On 5/4/22 15:10, Bill Degnan wrote: Bill, Sorry, I understand now. Assuming you have the confirmed ability to make a disk from DSK image you found a corrupted DSK file. Gotcha. I am kind of busy at the moment, but I do have the disk you need, the actual disk. If you find no other source I

Re: The TRS-80 Journey Continues

Bill, Sorry, I understand now. Assuming you have the confirmed ability to make a disk from DSK image you found a corrupted DSK file. Gotcha. I am kind of busy at the moment, but I do have the disk you need, the actual disk. If you find no other source I could image mine for you. Otherwise

Re: The TRS-80 Journey Continues

On 5/4/22 14:35, Bill Degnan wrote: Bill, I searched for "montezuma 2.2 hard drive install" on Google: https://oldcomputers.dyndns.org/public/pub/manuals/montezuma_micro_hard_disk_support_for_cpm_2-2.pdf I have been through the process a few times, it's pretty straight-forward if you use these

Re: The TRS-80 Journey Continues

Bill, I searched for "montezuma 2.2 hard drive install" on Google: https://oldcomputers.dyndns.org/public/pub/manuals/montezuma_micro_hard_disk_support_for_cpm_2-2.pdf I have been through the process a few times, it's pretty straight-forward if you use these directions. Bill On Wed, May 4,

The TRS-80 Journey Continues

Utterly amazed at how much I have forgotten. Even more amazed at how much information seems to have been lost since the days of the TRS-80. So, I am no trying to get CP/M going again. I have been able to get floppy systems working but can not find any information on how to build hard disk