On Sat, Sep 20, 2008 at 2:33 AM, denstar wrote:
> Or I could just be full of a particular brand of shit, ya know? Like,
> so what if Bruce Willis* routinely defeated terrorist plots without
> the aid of an All Seeing Eye, that was before 9/11, right?
> *shameful admission: I haven't seen the late
On Fri, Sep 19, 2008 at 5:25 PM, Robert Munn wrote:
> On Fri, Sep 19, 2008 at 4:05 PM, denstar wrote:
>> On Thu, Sep 18, 2008 at 12:12 AM, Robert Munn wrote:
> Do I think that an existential threat to our
>>> civilization merits a "special circumstances" exception? Absolutely.
>>
>> An existentia
On Fri, Sep 19, 2008 at 8:12 PM, Gruss wrote:
> Dude was hangin' wit da Teds
That might mean something where you live, but in San Diego that's just
gibberish.
~|
Adobe® ColdFusion® 8 software 8 is the most important and dramati
> RoMunn wrote:
> As for Tim McVeigh:
>
> 1. He was not part of an organization.
Oh, he was an organization, and I ain't talking about the Boy Scouts.
Dude was hangin' wit da Teds
~|
Adobe® ColdFusion® 8 software 8 is the most i
Non-state actors refers to organizations, not individuals:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Non-state_actor
As for Tim McVeigh:
1. He was not part of an organization.
2. He didn't act across national boundaries.
3. He committed a crime in the US, so he was subject to US criminal justice.
On Fri, Se
> RoMunn wrote:
> Al Qaeda has specifically said their goal is to destroy Western
> civilization
How about that T McVeigh?
He was out to get lots o folk too, right? And, uh, didn't he commit
mass murder too? And he's a non-state actor. And he didn't even have
to cross borders to do it.
And ju
> RoMunn wrote:
> KSM doesn't have to be prosecuted.
FSM is REAL! But you have to have faith.
FSM created the dinosaurs.
~|
Adobe® ColdFusion® 8 software 8 is the most important and dramatic release to
date
Get the Free Trial
On Fri, Sep 19, 2008 at 4:05 PM, denstar wrote:
> On Thu, Sep 18, 2008 at 12:12 AM, Robert Munn wrote:
Do I think that an existential threat to our
>> civilization merits a "special circumstances" exception? Absolutely.
>
> An existential threat? Dude, you have gone Stockholm.
Al Qaeda has spec
On Thu, Sep 18, 2008 at 12:12 AM, Robert Munn wrote:
> I agree, torture is not OK. Am I sorry they did it to KSM? Nope. The
> guy hates us, hates everything about us, he wants to destroy our
> entire civilization. Fairness and justice are great ideals, just be
> clear that Al Qaeda does not believe
KSM doesn't have to be prosecuted. Al Qaeda can have him back the day
that they sign surrender documents.
Going back to Gitmo, I've changed my mind in one respect. If we want
to change our image abroad in respect to Gitmo, we need to close it.
>From a practical standpoint, that is the only thing t
::listens to crickets:::
By the way, I heard an interview with Maher Arar today ... apparently
he originally got named as a possible terrorist by somone who was
subjected to extraordinary rendition was tortured by the Syrian
military intelligence branch. Since I know you have not been paying
atten
ok so. I very much disagree, but moving on ... what about the other
documented instances of torture?
On Wed, Sep 17, 2008 at 10:24 PM, Robert Munn <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> On Wed, Sep 17, 2008 at 9:21 PM, Dana wrote:
>> you keep saying that. If it is ok for him then it is ok for anyone,
>
> na
I agree, torture is not OK. Am I sorry they did it to KSM? Nope. The
guy hates us, hates everything about us, he wants to destroy our
entire civilization. Fairness and justice are great ideals, just be
clear that Al Qaeda does not believe in fairness, and their sense of
justice is killing everyone
On Wed, Sep 17, 2008 at 5:53 PM, Robert Munn wrote:
> Perception is reality, right? So why does the Left (and I'm not
> talking about you, Maureen) continue to drive the perception that
> Gitmo is a den of horrors? The answer goes back to why we are debating
> this election - it is a partisan
On Wed, Sep 17, 2008 at 9:21 PM, Dana wrote:
> you keep saying that. If it is ok for him then it is ok for anyone,
nah, only for mass-murderers.
> and just think, perhaps he would have preferred two in the head, hmm?
without doubt. sucks to be him.
~~
you keep saying that. If it is ok for him then it is ok for anyone,
and just think, perhaps he would have preferred two in the head, hmm?
On Wed, Sep 17, 2008 at 9:47 PM, Robert Munn <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> I agree torture not OK, that was what I meant about what they did to
> him being for r
I agree torture not OK, that was what I meant about what they did to
him being for revenge. AFAIK they don't use waterboarding any longer.
Like I said before, I don't especially care about what they did to
KSM. Two in the back of the head would have been fine with me.
On Wed, Sep 17, 2008 at 7:52
We talked about him a long time age. it ended up the Canadian
Government was responsible. How easily you forget.
On Wed, Sep 17, 2008 at 7:52 PM, Dana <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> no he is not, that's the thing.
>
> Khadr because he is a child and a Canadian citizen. What about Maher
> Arar? Agai
http://foia.fbi.gov/guantanamo/detainees.pdf
On Wed, Sep 17, 2008 at 8:52 PM, Dana <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> no he is not, that's the thing.
>
> And I reject the idea that torture is ok if it is only one guy.
> Torture is torture. What about the people they waterboared? Is that ok
> because the
no he is not, that's the thing.
And I reject the idea that torture is ok if it is only one guy.
Torture is torture. What about the people they waterboared? Is that ok
because they only admit to doing it to three people? Note, we only
know about Kahtani because someone leaked the logs. We only know
On Wed, Sep 17, 2008 at 6:25 PM, Dana wrote:
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Omar_Khadr
>
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mohamed_al-Kahtani
> http://www.nytimes.com/2005/06/21/opinion/21lewis.html
Khadr is a weird case. Why doesn't Canada want him back?
Kahtani was one of the hijackers, but could
you know what they say about assume.the fact that the media does
not cover it does not mean that it is not there. Consider who owns the
media.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Omar_Khadr
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mohamed_al-Kahtani
http://www.nytimes.com/2005/06/21/opinion/21lewis.html
that's
Some of them are still there, yes, but how are they being treated? Is
it the abusive place it was before? I can find nothing in the news
about continuing abuse at Guantanamo.
I did some poking around and the best information I could find was
that the really abusive stuff happened early on- as we a
continuing drama? Because THOSE PEOPLE ARE STILL THERE
sheesh
talk about unclear on the concept
On 9/17/08, Robert Munn <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> for which lots of people have been punished. so why the continuing drama?
>
> On Wed, Sep 17, 2008 at 5:02 PM, Dana wrote:
>> I dunno. Might have
for which lots of people have been punished. so why the continuing drama?
On Wed, Sep 17, 2008 at 5:02 PM, Dana wrote:
> I dunno. Might have something to do with the stuff about not letting
> people sleep, telling them that they need to be trained like a dog
> before they can be around humans, "a
I dunno. Might have something to do with the stuff about not letting
people sleep, telling them that they need to be trained like a dog
before they can be around humans, "aggressive" interrogation
techniques, lack of access to family memebers and to legal help...
On 9/17/08, Robert Munn <[EMAIL PR
On Wed, Sep 17, 2008 at 4:29 PM, denstar wrote:
>> But that's exactly the problem I was referring to. Americans throw
>> around words like "haul me off to Gitmo", and then people in other
>> countries read that stuff and take it seriously, which goes a long way
>> to explaining why people in other
On Wed, Sep 17, 2008 at 4:19 PM, Robert Munn wrote:
> But that's exactly the problem I was referring to. Americans throw
> around words like "haul me off to Gitmo", and then people in other
> countries read that stuff and take it seriously, which goes a long way
> to explaining why people in other
I suspect the the f-ed up view of the US has a lot more to do with
bombing innocents and behaving like imperialists than any words I
might use.
On Wed, Sep 17, 2008 at 3:19 PM, Robert Munn <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> But that's exactly the problem I was referring to. Americans throw
> around word
> Judah wrote:
> I'd argue that the f-ed up view is more reasonably attributable to the f-ed
> up things that our country does, like hauling people off to Gitmo.
>
Or fighting for de-regulation and then blaming the people who agreed with you.
~~
I'd argue that the f-ed up view is more reasonably attributable to the f-ed
up things that our country does, like hauling people off to Gitmo.
On Wed, Sep 17, 2008 at 3:19 PM, Robert Munn <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> But that's exactly the problem I was referring to. Americans throw
> around word
But that's exactly the problem I was referring to. Americans throw
around words like "haul me off to Gitmo", and then people in other
countries read that stuff and take it seriously, which goes a long way
to explaining why people in other countries have such an f-ed up view
of the United States.
O
yes she is. Been there, explored that. True.
On Wed, Sep 17, 2008 at 9:58 AM, Larry Lyons <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> At this point I probably won't pack up and leave, yet. Too many encumbrances.
> That said, I'm in a good position because of my Canadian citizenship, what's
> even better is tha
I was using GITMO mostly as a metaphor but I should have known someone
would spin it, and simply said hauled off to jail.
The United States has a long history of arresting those whose views
deviate from the current government - the House Committee on
UnAmerican Activities, arrests of Civil rights,
This tangent is boring the shit out of me. Why not start a thread
about stupid Americans thinking they're to perfect to change?
On Wed, Sep 17, 2008 at 10:04 AM, Vivec
> Do you think other countries have any systems of governance, or social
> methods and programs,or perspectives on Foreign Policy
Do you think other countries have any systems of governance, or social
methods and programs,or perspectives on Foreign Policy
that America can learn from?
2008/9/17 Sam <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Not true, he always complains America is not as good as most other
> countries and should be more like Can
Not true, he always complains America is not as good as most other
countries and should be more like Canada, or most European countries.
I'm saying if you prefer the other countries go there and stop moaning
about being here.
On Wed, Sep 17, 2008 at 9:42 AM, G Money
> Those who decry the injustic
You really need to keep you delusions about who I am to yourself.
It's annoying to be psychoanalyzed by someone schooled from an awful pop writer
On Wed, Sep 17, 2008 at 9:36 AM, G Money <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> This bit of delusion.gives an interesting insight into how you see and
> inte
America doesn't need to do anything other than live up to it's potential by
adhering to it's founding principles.
Those who decry the injustices and disasters of the last 5 or 10 years are
NOT begging America to become another countryindeed, they are begging
for the exact opposite.
On Wed, Se
"Begging for America to change into any other country except what it
is, that's truly sad."
Isn't that exactly what America has done?
Gone from a backward slave owning 'wild west' territory to what it is today?
What's wrong with using the example set by other countries?
Or is there an arrogance w
On Wed, Sep 17, 2008 at 11:30 AM, Sam <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Begging for America to change into any other country except what it
> is, that's truly sad.
This bit of delusion.gives an interesting insight into how you see and
interpret people.
One thing I've always loved about Stephen K
Striving and hoping is what the rest of us do.
Begging for America to change into any other country except what it
is, that's truly sad.
On Wed, Sep 17, 2008 at 9:23 AM, G Money <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> It is remarkable to me, in the 21st century, that working and striving and
> hoping and ex
It is remarkable to me, in the 21st century, that working and striving and
hoping and expecting a little bit more out of the greatest country in the
history of the planet...can still be dismissed as "Oh you just hate
America"
Remarkable probably isn't the right word.."sad" works.
On Wed,
I can deal with oversea haters, it's the ones that move here and hate
America that bother me. Just saying :)
On Wed, Sep 17, 2008 at 9:07 AM, Charlie Griefer
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> they've got the Internet in Canada now, Sam. so even if he did, you two
> would still be able to carry on your
>they've got the Internet in Canada now, Sam. so even if he did, you two
>would still be able to carry on your little... whatever it is you guys call
>your special relationship :)
>
My own opinion is as spoken by the Ambassador to the French king in
Shakespeare's Henry V:
Scorne and defiance,
>What if I say PLEASE?
>
>Please.
>
I am glad I only post through the web archive, so I don't know who replied.
Probably for the best, because after that I probably could not think any less
of you.
~|
Adobe® ColdFusion® 8 soft
they've got the Internet in Canada now, Sam. so even if he did, you two
would still be able to carry on your little... whatever it is you guys call
your special relationship :)
On Wed, Sep 17, 2008 at 9:04 AM, Sam <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> What if I say PLEASE?
>
> Please.
>
> > At this point
What if I say PLEASE?
Please.
> At this point I probably won't pack up and leave, yet.
~|
Adobe® ColdFusion® 8 software 8 is the most important and dramatic release to
date
Get the Free Trial
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At this point I probably won't pack up and leave, yet. Too many encumbrances.
That said, I'm in a good position because of my Canadian citizenship, what's
even better is that I recently found out that my daughter Alexis is
automatically a Canadian. So if we have to leave, then no problem.
>Well
On Tue, Sep 16, 2008 at 10:09 PM, Robert Munn <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> I don't see even the tiniest, remotest possibility of that happening
> in the US. Here are a few thoughts:
>
> - The War on Drugs is a waste of time, money, and resources, but no
> one has ever ended up in Gitmo because of
On Tue, Sep 16, 2008 at 9:14 PM, Judah wrote:
> I believe that Maureen said she'd stay here "until she's hauled off to
> Gitmo" for helping people think. Which I took to mean, its not there yet but
> sure does look like its heading that direction, *insert diety here* hope we
> don't get there. And
I believe that Maureen said she'd stay here "until she's hauled off to
Gitmo" for helping people think. Which I took to mean, its not there yet but
sure does look like its heading that direction, *insert diety here* hope we
don't get there. And I don't think we are there yet. But I'd agree that the
GG's heading to China because the infrastructure is so nice. So's the
government:)
On Tue, Sep 16, 2008 at 5:24 PM, Vivec <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Well,
> I don't know about pakcing up and leaving.
>
> You have to admit that despite its troubles, America is one of the better
> places in the wo
Being hauled off to Gitmo for exercising your First Amendment rights.
On Tue, Sep 16, 2008 at 5:16 PM, Maureen wrote:
> I am not now, nor have I ever been a liberal. And just what about my
> statement do you find not factual?
~
I mostly stick to what I know- tech and energy.
On Tue, Sep 16, 2008 at 6:55 PM, Maureen wrote:
> You are aware that a lot of the mutual funds are heavily invested in
> Freddie and Fannie, aren't you? Be sure yours aren't among them, or
> you may find yourself taking a serious loss. I have a goo
You are aware that a lot of the mutual funds are heavily invested in
Freddie and Fannie, aren't you? Be sure yours aren't among them, or
you may find yourself taking a serious loss. I have a good friend who
is invested in Legg Mason Value Trust. Last July it was at 80 dollars
a share. It has si
I was being cheeky with Gruss. ;-)
I mostly have money in mutual funds that I ride as long-term
investments. I don't really have any interest in direct investing.
On Tue, Sep 16, 2008 at 5:32 PM, Maureen wrote:
> The whole key to making money in investments is to buy low and sell
> high, so this
> tBone wrote:
> A lot of people are voting the way they are because we really fear what
> would happen with this guy, he's made a lot of mistakes, has a ton of
> shady friends, has said a lot of funky things, comes from one of the
> most corrupt political machines in the country.
>
And voting Oba
> Mo wrote:
> The whole key to making money in investments is to buy low and sell
> high, so this is exactly the kind of market in which you should
> invest.
MO! SHUSH. UP.
This is NOT the market Robert should put money in.
~|
Does the paragraph below refer to McCain or Obama?
On Tue, Sep 16, 2008 at 5:49 PM, Loathe <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> A lot of people are voting the way they are because we really fear what
> would happen with this guy, he's made a lot of mistakes, has a ton of
> shady friends, has said a lot
You're wrong.
There are major ideological differences between the camps at this point.
I'm not a republican, nor am I a christian. I'm not even pro-life.
What I am is a person that believes in the 2nd amendment, that wants us
to stay in Iraq until it is able to secure itself, that cannot all
The whole key to making money in investments is to buy low and sell
high, so this is exactly the kind of market in which you should
invest. When the Dow drops 400 points, buy at the bottom. When it
goes back up, which it will always do, then you sell and take the
profit.
I bought a lot of stock
> Gel wrote:
> I mean only the really northern countries : Switzerland, Norway,
The Swiss keep a pretty tight lid on immigrants. With their gun laws
as they are they'd be full of Yosemite Sams in no time if they
weren't.
BTW, I live in Minnesota and was in Sweden in Feb; 40^F warmer! Toasty!
B
> RoMunn wrote:
> lol, not my money, i spend everything i make, you think i'd invest in
> this market? :-D
>
No, I wouldn't expect that you would invest in this market.
~|
Adobe® ColdFusion® 8 software 8 is the most important and
> Erika wrote:
> How many of you would leave if you could? Unencumbered ... and live
> elsewhere? That gladly welcomed US expats ...
>
But rich people don't "leave". They get dual citizenship and keep
pied a terres in the US.
London seems fairly popular, but the Scandinavian and Benelux
countrie
Well,
I don't know about pakcing up and leaving.
You have to admit that despite its troubles, America is one of the better
places in the world to live regarding standard of living.
And it's even better if you are well off, white, and christian ;-)
The thing about the dollar, the US experienced t
lol, not my money, i spend everything i make, you think i'd invest in
this market? :-D
On Tue, Sep 16, 2008 at 5:14 PM, Gruss wrote:
>> RoMunn wrote:
>> bye bye, don't let the door hit you in the ass on the way out.
>>
>
> Oh, no worries. The bag of your money I'm dragging behind me will
> protec
I am not now, nor have I ever been a liberal. And just what about my
statement do you find not factual?
On Tue, Sep 16, 2008 at 5:05 PM, Robert Munn <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> See, that's just the kind of factually incorrect and careless
> statement that gives people a false impression of the U
> RoMunn wrote:
> bye bye, don't let the door hit you in the ass on the way out.
>
Oh, no worries. The bag of your money I'm dragging behind me will
protect me from harm.
Thanks for the concern though.
BTW - if you need a loan, I'd be happy to give you competitive rate.
~~~
See, that's just the kind of factually incorrect and careless
statement that gives people a false impression of the United States.
Liberals throw out these kinds of false and incendiary statements like
candy, then they blame Republicans when the rest of the world thinks
that sort of thing actually
Amen to that. My family has been here since before it was a country and been
in Oregon since before it was a state. We're settled in, we've paid our dues
and will keep fighting to have the country we dream America to be. And you
can bet that's how my daughter will grow up (6th generation born in O
Not me. This is my country and I refuse to abandon it to the minions.
I'll fight to the bitter end, right up to the day they haul me to
Gitmo for inciting people to think.
On Tue, Sep 16, 2008 at 4:51 PM, Erika L. Walker <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> How many of you would leave if you could? Unen
bye bye, don't let the door hit you in the ass on the way out.
On Tue, Sep 16, 2008 at 4:44 PM, Gruss wrote:
> Not only do I hear this all of the time externally, I hear it
> internally. 8 years ago it was a joke, now people are not joking -
> they're physically planning on leaving.
~~~
Can you overdose on Kool-aid?
On Tue, Sep 16, 2008 at 4:44 PM, Gruss Gott <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>> Dana wrote:
>> That's true and I hear this from people I know outside the United
>> States all the time. They want to know if I have travel documents, and
>> if I have a plan to get out. As thou
How many of you would leave if you could? Unencumbered ... and live
elsewhere? That gladly welcomed US expats ...
On Tue, Sep 16, 2008 at 7:44 PM, Gruss Gott <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> They're already gone or have one foot out the door.
>
>
~~
> Dana wrote:
> That's true and I hear this from people I know outside the United
> States all the time. They want to know if I have travel documents, and
> if I have a plan to get out. As though this were 1938 in Germany, and
> I were Jewish.
>
Not only do I hear this all of the time externally,
That's true and I hear this from people I know outside the United
States all the time. They want to know if I have travel documents, and
if I have a plan to get out. As though this were 1938 in Germany, and
I were Jewish.
I do think those people are wrong. But I also think it is telling that
more
I think Americans need to sit back and really look at their country.
There seems to be one fringe group of forward thinking people, and a huge
majority of backward thinking, just got off the boat Pilgrims.
In my view, the mere fact that a McCain/Palin ticket is viable and can win
the elections say
Eve Ensler, the American playwright, performer, feminist and activist best
known for "The Vagina Monologues", wrote the
following about Sarah Palin:
Drill, Drill, Drill
I am having Sarah Palin nightmares. I dreamt last night that she was a
member of a club where they rode snowmobiles and wore th
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