Hi Autumn, You wrote something that I either passed over before, or maybe it was just not written with enough explanation.
She gets so worked up, pee happens. Yip yip yip oops. Sort of like people losing control of their bladder when they're frightened. I don't know about other breeds, but when a Chihuahua gets very excited, sometimes the pee just happens. I am not talking about an entire puddle, just a little puddle. Dolly is very 'proud' she won't even use the puppy pads in her area when I am gone. When I come home, she is excited to see me and she used to do the little pee thing when I got home. That happens and over time Dolly has been able to overcome that. But, when my neighbor comes over or someone else that she loves and has not seen in a while, she gets very excited and turns on her back (saying that she is submissive) and sometimes the little bit of pee does come out. Dolly is almost three, and I almost never see that happen in the last couple of months. When I come home, Dolly turns on her back to let me know that I am the Alpha of the house. She also turns over when I tell her that I want to tickle her tummy. I may have said that to her a few times in the past (can't really remember), so her little routine is something that has developed over time. I got Dolly when she was 8 weeks old, she learned what my patterns were. I don't know where the tummy tickles thing started or the picking her up and giving her a kiss when I get home, but it was not something that Dolly demanded. When I get home and open her x-pen, the routine begins. Now, if Dolly were to go to another home where the people didn't know that this was something that me and Dolly shared, they may think that she is demanding attention or something because they don't know me, they don't know about the little things that we do together. My neighbor, Judy, got Mandy from a shelter. No matter what she did, Mandy would not play with any toys. She had the basket with the toys in it, and they just sat there. Mandy would just sit in her bed, and sit next to Judy & Tony, but she did not play. I didn't know Judy real well at that time. She said she didn't know why Mandy did not play, and she did not touch a thing when she was alone in the house. About 6 months after we became neighbors, I was going over to her house to feed Mandy when they went to visit their son. I thought she had peed on the carpet, but when cleaning it up, it was granular because she had actually vomited. After a few more times of vomiting, Judy asked me to take her to the vet because there was apparently something wrong. Mandy had some serious digestive system problems similar to humans when we are worried too much. She was vomiting the stomach acids. Well, I told the vet that when she calls Judy to tell her that I would keep her at my house when she was released from the Animal Hospital. So, I brought her home and she pretty much slept a lot the first couple of days, but my 6-month old Dolly wanted to play. Dolly would walk around Mandy's bed and push her nose into Mandy's legs, or face. A few days later, I noticed that Dolly was bringing her toys over to Mandy. And later that day, Mandy was playing with the toys. I didn't know Judy very well, and I was afraid that Judy would be mad because her house was so neat and Mandy didn't touch a thing. When she got back, I told her that I was sorry but Dolly tried to get Mandy to play and she was playing with the toys. Judy was sooooo happy. Judy wanted to play with Mandy, but Mandy wouldn't because she probably wasn't allowed to in her first home. Now.you say what is the point to this story. Some people train their dogs to just sit around and exist while they go about their day. They may pet the dog a few times during the day and feed it, but that is about it. That is what that first owner wanted out of Mandy. But, then Mandy went to a home that wanted a dog that plays and would run around and they didn't have it. It was just by bad luck that Mandy was staying at my house and then she just picked up the art of playing. I think Mandy must have been an only dog and so she didn't even know how to play with a dog. It doesn't have to be holding the dog on your lap all day, but the habits you teach when they are young are the habits that hold true unless someone else comes along and the rules are different. Now, the dog is confused because they cannot reason why one way that they lived is different from the next house that they lived. From: Chihuahuas@yahoogroups.com [mailto:Chihuahuas@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of freddyscribbles Sent: Saturday, May 14, 2011 10:07 AM To: Chihuahuas@yahoogroups.com Subject: [Chihuahuas] Re: Advice please - spoiled doggy tantrums - clarification Apologies... As always, for those who've offered support and advice, I thank you. I really, really do. Many of your suggestions have helped the both of us tremendously. And things are definitely better. Not perfect, but better. Please let me clarify. I think the indoor house-soiling is a byproduct of spoiled behavior. Sort of like dogs that do the submissive peeing. She gets so worked up, pee happens. Yip yip yip oops. Sort of like people losing control of their bladder when they're frightened. I do not believe she's trying to 'get my attention' by peeing on something other than a piddle pad - I am well aware that dogs live in the now and that their actions aren't premeditated to 'get back' at their humans. She has NEVER been punished for peeing in the house because it's always happened when I wasn't looking, and all I could do would be to try and correct (not punish) anyway. She's NEVER been intentionally punished at all. I say intentionally, because I reckon some of the events in the past (bathroom doggy) might have been perceived as punishment. I do not hit dogs. I do not react in anger - I will get online and vent later, but I won't take my frustration out on an animal. As trying as this little one has been, I have never struck her or yelled at her. Ever. I have gently corrected but not punished. As a general request to those following the Pia saga, please stop telling me 'Pet your dog more! Pick her up and hug her!' This is not a solution. And it's getting to the point where I'm beginning to find it offensive the implication being - I don't hug my dog, therefore I am a bad person. Seriously? Pia does get attention. She gets quite a lot of it throughout the day since that is one of the luxuries of working from home at the moment. I will be the first to admit that I have done a lot of things wrong with this dog, but I've been here as well as all over the internet trying to figure out how to do the RIGHT things for both of us. Will I always get it right? No. Does that make me a bad person? No. Does that mean Pia needs pity as she tolerates an inexperienced owner? No. Could we both use help from time to time? Absolutely. My priority, at the moment, is to get her healthy and hopefully avoid the exacerbation of any behavioral problems. Explaining the 'Spoiled' thing By spoiled I mean exhibiting signs of 'small dog syndrome'. And I am aware that a lot of you are going to disagree with me here. But I do not treat small dogs any differently than I'd treat larger dogs. Other than to take their size into consideration - she's a lot lower on the food chain than the big dog, so I am definitely more vigilant when we're outside, and I bought her a sweater because chihuahuas get cold. But, the bottom line is that she is a dog. And while I am aware that there are lots of people who treat their dogs like children, small dogs especially so, I am not one of those people. For those who do, if you can do that and enjoy it and still have a well mannered dog, awesome. But as dogs are different, so are people. This is not my approach nor has it ever been. It is not cruel. It is just different. That being said, there are certain behaviors that I don't find acceptable and practices that I don't participate in - Jumping on me, demanding (DEMANDING <-- this is the important distinction) attention would not be tolerated in a large dog, particularly some of the more powerful breeds that I've cared for in the past. It is also unacceptable in a small dog. Just because the dog says NOW doesn't mean she gets what she wants when she wants it. - No big 'velcro' dogs. No small velcro dogs. - She has four legs of her own. Unless there is a reason to do so, I generally avoid picking her up. Just because I can pick up a 4.5lb dog, doesn't mean I should or will. I am perfectly capable of providing ample amounts of love and affection without her being physically on my body or in my arms. Will I in the future? Possibly. Right now, however, holding her has only resulted in worse behavior. I am tentatively classifying the howling, at least in some part, as spoiled brat behavior because Pia is perfectly capable of going hours without human interaction quietly - as any dog should. Humans work, humans are out of the house. Humans have friends that they want to visit without the dog. Humans have errands. And keeping a dog in the car while you run into a store for an hour to get food for both of you is not really an option in sunny, hot California. Also, I never let dogs loose in a car. It is dangerous for the driver and it is dangerous for the dog. As Pia's not particularly fond of her carrier, she stays home. Most places outside of the home are less than dog friendly. So she stays home. In other words, for this reason or that reason, people are often just gone. Although, while we're establishing a routine, I've been home. Home home home. I have not left except to get groceries or run errands. Thankfully, I have understanding friends who don't mind being jilted for the dog. Since, believe it or not, working towards a well adjusted, happy dog is a priority. But that doesn't mean she gets her way. Anyway, right now I can move into different rooms. Most days I can leave the house entirely for a few minutes. Now that she's settled down and started to realize I do come home and spend time with her, she's stopped following me with her eyes. She sleeps more peacefully during the day. Since I have her tethered in the house while I'm working, she's also A LOT more calm. The tether will become an ex-pen when it comes. This is a very gentle way of providing boundaries and limitations - think of it as a cageless den for now. I can't have a small dog underfoot while I'm working. I can't worry about where she is when I'm working. If I don't work, we don't eat. It's that simple. She has also stopped demanding attention when I work because she can't get to me physically. And that has also curbed some of her 'anxious' energy. She also seems more content because there's no need to 'patrol' the house - she has a space that is clearly defined as hers. It is part of our routine. Further more, now that she's a lot more sedate during the day, her kennel cough is recovering much faster. I am bringing that up because it demonstrates that she's perfectly capable of entertaining herself quietly for hours at a time. She does receive love and affection intermittently through the day. Any time I take a break. Any time we come in from a walk. Head scratches, belly rubs, fetch. This is not a neglected dog. But there are rules. Again, I'm going to use a human child to illustrate a point because it is the closest analogy I can come up with. A mother takes her child into a grocery store. The child sees something it wants - a piece of candy, a toy. The mother says no. Not now. The child begins to throw a tantrum. It gets louder and louder. The ONLY time I now see Pia exhibiting the howling that was absolutely destroying me mentally is when she wants to get to me but she can't - when she wants attention on her terms - the I want what I want when I want it which is NOW. And she can be very vocal about this. Surely high pitched, ear splitting, headache inducing howling is not a behavior that should be encouraged especially when it is related to a DEMAND for attention. It's not cute. Nor is it acceptable. My guess is that her previous owners gave in when ever she started her serenade. And it got to the point where she was howling whenever her people weren't around. And then it became a security issue - I can't see my pack. If I start howling, they'll come back. And that may be part of the reason she ended up at Downey in the first place. So demands, very specific word there, for attention are ignored. That does not mean affection is withheld. It does not mean her needs are not met. It does not mean that I am cruel or neglectful foster parent - ignorant, yes. Purposefully cruel or neglectful? Absolutely not. What it does mean is that there are a couple of potentially very troublesome behavioral problems that I am dealing with. Is my method perfect? Probably not. Is it working? Yes. We seem to have formed a mutual respect and understanding for one another in terms of what is acceptable and what is not. There have been compromises. On both sides. If you can call it that. As I said, I'll admit that a lot (A LOT) of things were done wrong initially, and we've both paid the price for that. But, we're learning. I am learning. I am trying, and we will get there. As I said, this story will have a happy ending. If there are people out there who dislike me because of the way I've handled this and pity the dog...was the shelter really a better option? Surely the temporary aggravation of dealing with an inexperienced, stupid human is better than being euthanized. So yes...spoiled dog. Chihuahua wants attention when she wants it - she howls (demands) it - when she gets worked up, her control over her bladder deteriorates. Simple. Nix the spoiled behavior. Nix the worst of the house breaking problem. --- In Chihuahuas@yahoogroups.com <mailto:Chihuahuas%40yahoogroups.com> , "dasha" <dasha48@...> wrote: > > People need to remember that dogs think different from us and they don't do > logic like humans. They don't "get back" at you. I agree it was not Brat > mode > > _____ > > From: Chihuahuas@yahoogroups.com <mailto:Chihuahuas%40yahoogroups.com> [mailto:Chihuahuas@yahoogroups.com <mailto:Chihuahuas%40yahoogroups.com> ] On > Behalf Of Joan Croft > Sent: Saturday, May 14, 2011 3:26 AM > To: Chihuahuas@yahoogroups.com <mailto:Chihuahuas%40yahoogroups.com> > Subject: RE: [Chihuahuas] Advice please - spoiled doggy tantrums > > > > > > I think that the peeing incident is not 'brat mode.' It is caused by you > not paying attention to you, so then she does something that will get your > attention. > > I guess I may be accused of spoiling my dogs if it means that they want to > spend some time with me.they want to feel some love, me petting them and > talking to them calmly. I am not really sure that is what you mean, because > if Pia was a wild dog, then it would not be normal for her to want your > attention; but Pia is a pet and that means that the owner and the dog have a > relationship where they do interact with each other. I do hold my dogs; I > do cover them with their blankets at night; when I come home, they turn over > so that I can tickle their bellies, then give them a kiss and send them out > to go potty. If I only had one dog, there would be nothing else to interact > with if they were not to interact with you. > > Maybe I just didn't understand what you were writing about being spoiled and > being a brat. > > > > From: Chihuahuas@yahoogroups.com <mailto:Chihuahuas%40yahoogroups.com> [mailto:Chihuahuas@yahoogroups.com <mailto:Chihuahuas%40yahoogroups.com> ] On > Behalf Of freddyscribbles > Sent: Friday, May 13, 2011 4:44 PM > To: Chihuahuas@yahoogroups.com <mailto:Chihuahuas%40yahoogroups.com> > Subject: [Chihuahuas] Advice please - spoiled doggy tantrums > > > > > > Remember when I said that she was mostly house broken? > > I still think this is true. I know that she can go at least 6-7 hours > without peeing in the house. I also know that she knows how and when to use > piddle pads. > > But when she goes into 'brat' mode, she's likely to squat and pee where ever > she is. It's like she gets herself so worked up about not getting her way > that she can't control her bladder. I guess it's a little like the child > that has such bad tantrums they throw up. Bad analogy, but it's the closest > I can think of. > > I think crate training her will help significantly with a number of the > problems we're still dealing with. > > But has anyone here ever dealt with an excessively spoiled dog? I know she > can be on her own without freaking out. My midday snooze was spent in > another room away from the dog where she couldn't see me. Not a peep. > Earlier, I repeated this morning's experiment - I went to another room at > lunch time to read/eat for 40 minutes. Again, not a peep out of her. > > I am in the process of stopping her from jumping up on her hind legs and > pawing/scratching at you until you pet her. That has helped already. If > nothing else, it means that she's calmer when she does get pet and cuddles. > The spoiled/dominant behavior is also why I stopped napping with her on my > stomach. > > Just wish I could fix the random blips in house breaking. And maybe nip the > tantrums in the bud since these two things seem to be inter-related. > > Thoughts, help, advice? Been ignoring the howling. Been ignoring the > jumping/pawing. It's not cute. When she gets down, she receives affection - > lots and lots of head scritching which seems to a favorite. >
