Hi Ingo,
Thanks, yes I see it is good to keep it simple to begin with, not least,
to encourage entrants that it is not a big hurdle.
Due to the lack of definite answer to "what epsilon?" the core idea was
simply that if you keep epsilon small, then the restriction you made
about only displac
Hello Raffles,
> ... Since this is based on a real world variant of Go, why not base epsilon
> on that? ...
In "true Frisbee Go" many more aspects may be taken into account:
* During the first moves one may learn how good the throwing skills of the
opponent are...
* weather (and wind) may p
Hi Josef,
> ... I think that we do not need to ensure that the stone cannot land
> diagonally
> by small epsilon, since ingo defined it s.t. it cannot.
Exactly. "Frisbee Go Simulation" is not meant a realistic simuilation of
true Frisbee Go, but as an abstract testbed for a Go variant with r
.
Ingo.
Gesendet: Samstag, 14. November 2015 um 04:55 Uhr
Von: fotl...@smart-games.com
An: computer-go@computer-go.org
Betreff: Re: [Computer-go] Frisbee Go Simulation
Attached is a frisbee go game 9x9 between me and a Chines 5-dan amateur. 50%
chance of playing in the intended spot. When a
Attached is a frisbee go game 9x9 between me and a Chines 5-dan
amateur. 50% chance of playing in the intended spot. When a
connection is required, it is just up to chance who wins the fight.
It's a little silly, but was a lot of fun to play.
David
On Wed, 11 Nov 2015 23:13:51 +0100, "Ingo A
>
> (effectively) zero. Therefore epsilon should be pretty tiny. It must be
> large enough that there is a chance of the frisbee being at least 50% over
> the line (i.e. epsilon > 0), but small enough that the chance of it going
> 70.7% over the line is vanishingly small (otherwise we would be allo
If this catches on, perhaps the rules will be referred to as the
Ingo rules ;-)
Since this is based on a real world variant of Go, why not base
epsilon on that? The fact that the limit of displacement from the
intended position is limited to the immediately
lympiad in Leiden.
One of the two volunteers is reserved for David.
Gesendet: Freitag, 13. November 2015 um 02:15 Uhr
Von: fotl...@smart-games.com
An: computer-go@computer-go.org
Betreff: Re: [Computer-go] Frisbee Go Simulation
Yesterday I modified Many Faces to play Frisbee go an played a few
Yesterday I modified Many Faces to play Frisbee go an played a few
games with some other people at the Beijing Computer go tournament.
It's a very strange game. If there is interest I can make an
installer and make it available for free.
Josef Moudrik is also writing a program.
David
On Thu
On Thu, Nov 12, 2015 at 9:07 AM, Nick Wedd wrote:
> I was thinking about the ko rule for frisbee ko, and realised it leads to
> problems.
>
> 1. Black takes a ko, White tries to make a ko threat, but accidentally
> retakes the ko. What should happen?
This was already covered by having any ill
ean, that you could even use
>> an existing engine without change. You just add the additional step
>> generating the random noise on the moves.
>>
>> Or is this orthogonal to the envisioned game?
>>
>> Best regards,
>> David Peters
>>
>> *Gesendet:
mber 2015 um 10:24 Uhr
> *Von:* "Darren Cook"
> *An:* computer-go@computer-go.org
> *Betreff:* Re: [Computer-go] Frisbee Go Simulation
> > If one or two of these cells are outside the board the
> > move will count as a pass. If the landing cell is occupied by another
Best regards,
David Peters
Gesendet: Donnerstag, 12. November 2015 um 10:24 Uhr
Von: "Darren Cook"
An: computer-go@computer-go.org
Betreff: Re: [Computer-go] Frisbee Go Simulation
> If one or two of these cells are outside the board the
> move will count as a pass. If
> If one or two of these cells are outside the board the
> move will count as a pass. If the landing cell is occupied by another
> stone the move is also counted as a pass. Illegal moves are also counted
> as pass moves.
Alternatively, the probability could be adjusted for the number of legal
mov
I was thinking reg_genmove. Make the bot support one way to do it to
make the referee simpler.
David
On Thu, 12 Nov 2015 03:22:23 +, Josef Moudrik wrote:
Frisbee go sounds fun.How do you plan to use the GTP protocol to
support this? I think that the randomization should be handled
Frisbee go sounds fun.
How do you plan to use the GTP protocol to support this? I think that the
randomization should be handled by the server, so the bot needs to get
feedback about the move actually carried out. So maybe
genmove + undo & play
or reg_genmove + play
depending on what do the bots su
> Oh! You can have a continuous handicap control by giving the players
> different epsilons. :)
Right. You have "the same" in human-played Frisbee Go by having arbitrary
distances from which the players have to throw their frisbees. (You may
even change the distance during the game )
Ingo.
Hmm.
> >> Would the game end after two unintentional passes?
>
> > Good point. In principle I would say so.
>
> That makes little sense to me.
> IMO, the principled rule is that two consecutive intentional passes
> end the game.
We should have some test games to see how long a game would be
"t
Oh! You can have a continuous handicap control by giving the players
different epsilons. :)
On Wed, Nov 11, 2015 at 2:25 PM, John Tromp wrote:
> >> Would the game end after two unintentional passes?
>
> > Good point. In principle I would say so.
>
> That makes little sense to me.
> IMO, the pr
>> Would the game end after two unintentional passes?
> Good point. In principle I would say so.
That makes little sense to me.
IMO, the principled rule is that two consecutive intentional passes
end the game.
To make sure that infinitely long games have 0 probability,
we must then require that
> Would the game end after two unintentional passes?
Good point. In principle I would say so.
To avoid problems with final counting, after 2 passes the game should
be completed in traditional mode (without Frisbee simulation elements).
One might say that such a final should be executed only after
Would the game end after two unintentional passes?
> On Nov 11, 2015, at 11:39 AM, Ingo Althöfer <3-hirn-ver...@gmx.de> wrote:
>
> Hello,
>
> the next Computer Olympiad has been dated.
> It will take place in Leiden (NL), from June 27, 2016 to July 03, 2016.
>
> I want to propose a new Go varia
1/5 also seems natural (equal chance of hitting each the 5 possible points).
Álvaro.
On Wed, Nov 11, 2015 at 10:08 AM, John Tromp wrote:
> > By the way: It would also be necessary to decide about
> > the eps for the event. Natural candidates would be
> > eps=0.1 or eps=0.125.
>
> I would say
> By the way: It would also be necessary to decide about
> the eps for the event. Natural candidates would be
> eps=0.1 or eps=0.125.
I would say the 2 most interesting choices are 1/8 or 1/4.
The latter guarantees you miss your aim by distance 1,
while the former gives you an even chance to hit i
Hi David,
> I won't be able to be at the congress,
participants need one person representing the bot at the event.
This need not to be the main programmer.
> but I think it would be pretty easy to modify MCTS to play this game.
The crucial point will be playing strength.
> Do you plan to
I won't be able to be at the congress, but I think it would be pretty
easy to modify MCTS to play this game. Do you plan to modify a gtp
server to handle these rules? If you get enough interest and are will
ing to take submissions from people not present, I could be persuaded
to submit an entry.
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