There are 25 messages in this issue.
Topics in this digest:
1.1. Re: OT: Grave accent as opening quote (was Re: Elision
From: Calculator Ftvb
1.2. Re: OT: Grave accent as opening quote (was Re: Elision
From: Matthew Turnbull
2a. Re: "Fiat lingua" in your conlang(s)
From: Lars Finsen
2b. Re: "Fiat lingua" in your conlang(s)
From: Herman Miller
2c. Re: "Fiat lingua" in your conlang(s)
From: Daniel Bowman
2d. Re: "Fiat lingua" in your conlang(s)
From: Matthew Turnbull
2e. Re: "Fiat lingua" in your conlang(s)
From: Scott Hlad
3. First LCS Journal nearing completion; publishing template, art, lett
From: Language Creation Society
4a. Dictionary software
From: Nathan Unanymous
4b. Re: Dictionary software
From: Richard Littauer
4c. Re: Dictionary software
From: Gary Shannon
4d. Re: Dictionary software
From: Nathan Unanymous
4e. Re: Dictionary software
From: Daniel Bowman
4f. Re: Dictionary software
From: Matthew Turnbull
5a. Re: OT Facebook False Friends
From: Jim Henry
5b. Re: OT Facebook False Friends
From: Lee
6a. Re: Romance language forum (google-groups)
From: Daniel Hollande
7a. Re: nouns inflecting for anticipated pronouns
From: Daniel Bowman
7b. Re: nouns inflecting for anticipated pronouns
From: Daniel Bowman
8a. Re: Path vs. Manner Languages
From: Daniel Bowman
8b. Re: Path vs. Manner Languages
From: Eric Christopherson
8c. Re: Path vs. Manner Languages
From: vii iiix
8d. Re: Path vs. Manner Languages
From: David Peterson
9a. Re: Future Englishes
From: Matthew Turnbull
9b. Re: Future Englishes
From: Vincent Pistelli
Messages
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1.1. Re: OT: Grave accent as opening quote (was Re: Elision
Posted by: "Calculator Ftvb" i...@futuramerlin.com
Date: Sun Aug 22, 2010 5:44 pm ((PDT))
On 12 August 2010 23:06, MorphemeAddict <lytl...@gmail.com> wrote:
> But of course, "quote" is also a noun.
>
> Hmmm? What context? I've only heard it as a verb (to quote someone).
> stevo
>
> On Thu, Aug 12, 2010 at 10:55 PM, Calculator Ftvb <i...@futuramerlin.com
> >wrote:
>
> > Hmm, for me the apostrophe is the leftmost key on the row above the home
> > row. (Dvorak...) Also it irks me when people use 'quote' for 'quotation
> > mark', because 'quote' is a verb, not a noun. ;-)
> >
> > On 8 August 2010 02:07, Carsten Becker <carb...@googlemail.com> wrote:
> >
> > > Ditto. I see people using ´ instead of the apostrophe on the internet
> > > frequently. It hurts my aesthetics. Also: the accent key – in the
> numbers
> > > row, to the left of the backspace key – is much further away from the
> > > letters area of the keyboard than the apostrophe key, which is on the
> > home
> > > row, to the left of the enter key on standard keyboards here. It's more
> > > inconvenient, still people prefer it, probably because ´ looks more
> like
> > ’
> > > (9) than '. On the other hand, hardly anyone seems to use ,, ´´ for
> > "proper"
> > > quotes, as a replacement for „“, or >><< instead of »«.
> > >
> > > Carsten
> > >
> > >
> > > Am 08.08.2010 01:32 schrieb Eugene Oh:
> > >
> > >> Opinion generally seconded. It is even more irritating when sometimes
> > you
> > >> catch such errors on big media/news sites.
> > >>
> > >> Eugene
> > >>
> > >>
> > >
> >
>
Messages in this topic (29)
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1.2. Re: OT: Grave accent as opening quote (was Re: Elision
Posted by: "Matthew Turnbull" ave....@gmail.com
Date: Sun Aug 22, 2010 8:38 pm ((PDT))
> Hmmm? What context? I've only heard it as a verb (to quote someone).
Ex : ...and a famous qoute from William Shakespeare, "To be or not to be".
definatly a noun in that context, it has an article.
Messages in this topic (29)
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2a. Re: "Fiat lingua" in your conlang(s)
Posted by: "Lars Finsen" lars.fin...@ortygia.no
Date: Sun Aug 22, 2010 6:04 pm ((PDT))
Den 23. aug. 2010 kl. 00.52 skreiv Francois Remond:
> Language : Neo-Gaulish
> Type : Indo-European, Celtic
Wow, interesting, is Neo-Gaulish a evolved form of Gaulish up to the
present day, or perhaps to some earlier time? Is the θ a digamma? And
do you have a website?
Sincerely,
LEF
Messages in this topic (18)
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2b. Re: "Fiat lingua" in your conlang(s)
Posted by: "Herman Miller" hmil...@io.com
Date: Sun Aug 22, 2010 7:15 pm ((PDT))
Language Creation Society wrote:
> We'd like to have the Language Creation Society make some cool conlanger
> schwag.
>
> One idea is to have our motto, "Fiat ingua", in a large number of
> conlangs, composed into an image - somewhat like the LJ conlangs
> userpic (http://l-userpic.livejournal.com/2027814/350076) - and put on
> various things like ties, mugs, shirts, etc.
>
> If you'd like to help, please post or email us a translation into your
> conlang(s) (or conlangs you like) of:
> 1. "Fiat lingua!"
> 2. "conlangs"
> 3. [friendly greeting]
How to translate this in Tirelat... Language is one of the few things
you can define into existence by merely speaking, so I'm tempted to use
the "definition" suffix -na (which otherwise doesn't get much use):
something like "gavinan sy łat". But I don't think that works in general
for translating something like "let there be light" or "let there be
guitars". Perhaps an imperative like "gavik eh łat" (exist, O
language!), but I think the deontic mood might be better than trying to
give an order to an inanimate thing that doesn't yet exist.
gavitan sy łat "a language should exist"
gavitan sy łaž "a light should exist"
gavitan sy sarahn "a guitar should exist"
Such a statement can be interpreted as a command given the appropriate
context; in any case, nothing else comes close.
"Conlangs" could be "saj teptałat" (nominative plural), an ordinary
compound of "tepta" (construct) and "łat" (language). If you want
accusative plural that would be "maj teptałat" (plurality is marked on
the article).
"Isah" is a common greeting.
The only other language that I've been much active with lately is Minza.
I think the best way to express "fiat lingua" is with a simple command
"luno šyŋga", even though that might be interpreted as a command to an
unseen listener "cause language to exist". Minza doesn't need to be as
literal and precise as Tirelat tends to be. So, for Minza I've got:
1. Luno šyŋga!
2. Šyŋga žazevi / "žazišyŋga"
3. Šiŋas veni (roughly "good to see you", literally "happy meeting")
> If they have a native orthography, please include a link to an
> in-orthography version - preferably as text + font, so we can scale /
> color it as needed. Aim for translations that would be natural
> in-culture (e.g. if there were an LCS there, what would our
> doppelgangers say?) more than literalistic.
Here's a link to the Kjaginic font used in Tirelat, and a text version
to be displayed with the Kjaginic font:
http://teamouse.googlepages.com/Kjaginic.ttf
1. gavitan sɨ ɬat
2. saj tɛptaɬat
3. isaː
Minza uses the Latin alphabet, as it's something along the lines of a
personal language (but borrowing features and vocabulary from numerous
Azirian languages); its name "Minza" is from the Tirelat word "minża"
meaning "bridge".
> Please include the conlang name, a URL of its home page (if any), and
> what name you want to be credited by. Contributors will be credited on
> the LCS website, but we don't have enough margin to be able to give
> you a cut of the (very small) profits*.
Some information on Tirelat is at
http://www.io.com/~hmiller/lang/Tirelat/index.html; Minza is at
http://www.io.com/~hmiller/lang/Minza/index.html. Both of these are
quite out of date; I notice the Minza page includes the phoneme /ð/
which had allophones of [j] before front vowels and [G] before back
vowels. That was one of the last vestiges of a long series of
phonological revisions that I ultimately abandoned. I really ought to
update those pages. The Tirelat pages are somewhat more up to date.
> As a reminder, a great-looking cloissoné conlang flag lapel pin is a
> token of LCS membership (http://conlang.org/members.php - the photo
> doesn't do it justice). And we're still gathering enough people to do
> another group buy of full-size, real-cloth conlang flags
> (http://conlang.org/flag.php).
>
> If you want either, you have ideas for other cool stuff that you'd
> want to have, or you have good skill in Photoshop and can help compose
> the results artfully, please let us know.
>
> Thanks,
> Sai Emrys
> LCS President
>
> * For reference, our total profit on schwag sold since 2006 is only
> ~$40, most of which went towards expenses for the Language Creation
> Conference.
>
>
Messages in this topic (18)
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2c. Re: "Fiat lingua" in your conlang(s)
Posted by: "Daniel Bowman" danny.c.bow...@gmail.com
Date: Sun Aug 22, 2010 7:40 pm ((PDT))
Angosey, by Daniel Bowman
1. Fiat lingua: Souanaya tha angos
2. conlangs: tha angos amaleta
3. [friendly greeting]: Zira
A note on "fiat lingua":
Angosey doesn't have a word that captures the generic 'to exist'. I read
over the discussions on this thread on the meaning of "fiat" and took what I
could from that. So I made a bit of an unusual choice, but I think it fit's
Angosey's character as well as the meaning of the phrase. Literally,
"souanaya tha angos" means "let language be embodied as a positive thing" or
"let language be loved as the essence of something good". In a sense we
could say "let language be brought forth, and it will be a good thing."
The "-aya" suffix denotes the emotive mood, meaning that the statement is
emotionally significant to the speaker.
Messages in this topic (18)
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2d. Re: "Fiat lingua" in your conlang(s)
Posted by: "Matthew Turnbull" ave....@gmail.com
Date: Sun Aug 22, 2010 8:55 pm ((PDT))
So a Jorayn speaker would probably use French for fiat lingua the same way
we English speakers use Latin, but what the hey
fiat lingua - <vriisoblarromé ayn>
[vri.so.bla.ʀoː.me<http://vri.so.bla.xn--o-j3a5v.me>aːjn]
/vr-iso-bl<a>ʀ-o-me ajn/ - it is implored that language comes to exist
change-exist-make<sg>DUR-3-IMP language
conlang - <vriisoblarrolm ayn> [vrisoblaʀoːlm aːjn]
/vrisoblaʀoː-m-l ajn/ - language that was made
create.3sg-PAST-REL language
hello - <swãakko> - [swãːakʼʷ] - roughly "how are you"
/swãːa-kʼʷ/
QUES.2sg-ADV
the imperative -mé is a general imperative, imploring for it to just happen,
instead of asking someone to do it. There is a native writing system, but it
has no font cause I suck at making them and can't figure out how to make a
caracter descend down a line and stay there but have the next word start at
the same place as the last one, which is an odd feature that the system has.
Messages in this topic (18)
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2e. Re: "Fiat lingua" in your conlang(s)
Posted by: "Scott Hlad" scott.h...@telus.net
Date: Sun Aug 22, 2010 9:47 pm ((PDT))
Pilovese:
1. Qu'elh si la lengua
(let there be language - I so love the subjunctive!!!)
2. (la) lengua artefecila
3. bon journ
-----Original Message-----
From: Constructed Languages List [mailto:conl...@listserv.brown.edu] On Behalf
Of Language Creation Society
Sent: August 22, 2010 2:48 AM
To: conl...@listserv.brown.edu
Subject: "Fiat lingua" in your conlang(s)
We'd like to have the Language Creation Society make some cool conlanger schwag.
One idea is to have our motto, "Fiat ingua", in a large number of
conlangs, composed into an image - somewhat like the LJ conlangs
userpic (http://l-userpic.livejournal.com/2027814/350076) - and put on
various things like ties, mugs, shirts, etc.
If you'd like to help, please post or email us a translation into your
conlang(s) (or conlangs you like) of:
1. "Fiat lingua!"
2. "conlangs"
3. [friendly greeting]
If they have a native orthography, please include a link to an
in-orthography version - preferably as text + font, so we can scale /
color it as needed. Aim for translations that would be natural
in-culture (e.g. if there were an LCS there, what would our
doppelgangers say?) more than literalistic.
Please include the conlang name, a URL of its home page (if any), and
what name you want to be credited by. Contributors will be credited on
the LCS website, but we don't have enough margin to be able to give
you a cut of the (very small) profits*.
As a reminder, a great-looking cloissoné conlang flag lapel pin is a
token of LCS membership (http://conlang.org/members.php - the photo
doesn't do it justice). And we're still gathering enough people to do
another group buy of full-size, real-cloth conlang flags
(http://conlang.org/flag.php).
If you want either, you have ideas for other cool stuff that you'd
want to have, or you have good skill in Photoshop and can help compose
the results artfully, please let us know.
Thanks,
Sai Emrys
LCS President
* For reference, our total profit on schwag sold since 2006 is only
~$40, most of which went towards expenses for the Language Creation
Conference.
Messages in this topic (18)
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3. First LCS Journal nearing completion; publishing template, art, lett
Posted by: "Language Creation Society" l...@conlang.org
Date: Sun Aug 22, 2010 6:36 pm ((PDT))
PRE-ORDER: http://bit.ly/dDzLzQ
The upcoming Journal of the Language Creation Society, _Fiat Lingua_,
is nearing completion and on track to be ready in about a month or so.
Included in the first issue (~80 pages total):
H.S. Chapman - León Bollack and his forgotten project
Fredrik Ekman - Glossopoeia on the Silver Screen
Paul Hartzer - Exolang Phonology: Vixzrinddyig
Jim Henry - Review of Sarah L. Higley's _Hildegard of Bingen's Unknown
Language: An Edition, Translation and Discussion_
Roger F. Mills - The Battle of the Sexes (two Kash poems)
Roger F. Mills - The Birth of a Planet (and three languages)
Matt Pearson - Case Marking and Event Structure: One Conlanger’s Investigations
John Quijada - Analyzing Nudes on the Kalmykian Steppe: The Russian
Obsession with “Ifkuil”
LETTERS TO EDITOR & ARTICLES
If you have something you'd like to put in a letter to the editor -
perhaps a short anecdote, comment, question, or the like - email us.
If you could contribute an article, essay, poem, review, etc. for the
next edition of the Journal, please see our Call for Papers:
http://conlang.org/fiat_lingua.php
LAYOUT DESIGN & ART
We need a designer to create a great-looking template for the journal
- that is, everything but the article texts. This includes everything
from a well-styled nameplate and logo to footnotes and font choices to
masthead layout. Basically, everything needed such that we can drop in
the final article text, titles, etc for this issue (and all issues to
come) and it'll look awesome.
Here's the full spec: http://bit.ly/bHj0tn
We're also looking for good art to include on the cover and elsewhere.
Either your own work if you're an artist, or something good you've
found online that is licensed to allow commercial re-use.
If either of these sounds like something you or someone you know could
help us with, please let us know.
All email about the Journal should be directed to
publishing-edit...@conlang.org.
Our Librarian, Donald Boozer, is the current primary managing editor
(thanks, Don!).
To pre-order your copy (and help us figure out our costs and volume),
please visit http://bit.ly/dDzLzQ
Thanks,
Sai Emrys
LCS President
Messages in this topic (1)
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4a. Dictionary software
Posted by: "Nathan Unanymous" nathanms...@gmail.com
Date: Sun Aug 22, 2010 6:42 pm ((PDT))
Is there any good dictionary software out there? Something that would have:
posadus, n. judge; leader of community and presider over trials
Of course, if nothing like that exists, posadus=judge would do.
I searched the archives and saw Shoebox recommended in 1998; if that's still
the
best could anyone tell a not-technical person how to use it? I'ts confusing.
Messages in this topic (6)
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4b. Re: Dictionary software
Posted by: "Richard Littauer" richard.litta...@gmail.com
Date: Sun Aug 22, 2010 7:06 pm ((PDT))
I have that working for the Na'vi, Dothraki, and my own Llárriésh
Dictionaries. It's Latex, run through a MySQL database using Perl. I don't
know if it's open for more dictionaries, as in a downloadable program, since
it is entirely run by my coder, but I could ask him if it's possible to make
one in such a way.
On Sun, Aug 22, 2010 at 9:40 PM, Nathan Unanymous <nathanms...@gmail.com>wrote:
> Is there any good dictionary software out there? Something that would have:
>
> posadus, n. judge; leader of community and presider over trials
>
> Of course, if nothing like that exists, posadus=judge would do.
>
> I searched the archives and saw Shoebox recommended in 1998; if that's
> still the
> best could anyone tell a not-technical person how to use it? I'ts
> confusing.
>
Messages in this topic (6)
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4c. Re: Dictionary software
Posted by: "Gary Shannon" fizi...@gmail.com
Date: Sun Aug 22, 2010 7:08 pm ((PDT))
http://www.lexiquepro.com/index.htm
It's a free download. I haven't used it myself, but others have
recommended it to me.
--gary
On Sun, Aug 22, 2010 at 6:40 PM, Nathan Unanymous <nathanms...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Is there any good dictionary software out there? Something that would have:
>
> posadus, n. judge; leader of community and presider over trials
>
> Of course, if nothing like that exists, posadus=judge would do.
>
> I searched the archives and saw Shoebox recommended in 1998; if that's still
> the
> best could anyone tell a not-technical person how to use it? I'ts confusing.
>
Messages in this topic (6)
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4d. Re: Dictionary software
Posted by: "Nathan Unanymous" nathanms...@gmail.com
Date: Sun Aug 22, 2010 7:47 pm ((PDT))
Thanks! It works.
Messages in this topic (6)
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4e. Re: Dictionary software
Posted by: "Daniel Bowman" danny.c.bow...@gmail.com
Date: Sun Aug 22, 2010 7:48 pm ((PDT))
Eventually I hope to publish my own python-based interactive dictionary.
I'll notify the list when I get that up and running, and I'll be looking for
beta testers!
On Sun, Aug 22, 2010 at 9:40 PM, Nathan Unanymous <nathanms...@gmail.com>wrote:
> Is there any good dictionary software out there? Something that would have:
>
> posadus, n. judge; leader of community and presider over trials
>
> Of course, if nothing like that exists, posadus=judge would do.
>
> I searched the archives and saw Shoebox recommended in 1998; if that's
> still the
> best could anyone tell a not-technical person how to use it? I'ts
> confusing.
>
--
Ayryea zakayro al Gayaltha
Messages in this topic (6)
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4f. Re: Dictionary software
Posted by: "Matthew Turnbull" ave....@gmail.com
Date: Sun Aug 22, 2010 8:58 pm ((PDT))
Shoebox is old, toolbox is the new version, and I find it works wonderfully
because of the export option that formats your lexicon for you into an .rtf
file. I just switched to it finally for my main project and am loving it. It
can be a bit confusing, but if all your using it for is a dictionary it
shouldn't be so hard.
http://www.sil.org/computing/catalog/show_software.asp?id=79
On Sun, Aug 22, 2010 at 8:40 PM, Nathan Unanymous <nathanms...@gmail.com>wrote:
> Is there any good dictionary software out there? Something that would have:
>
> posadus, n. judge; leader of community and presider over trials
>
> Of course, if nothing like that exists, posadus=judge would do.
>
> I searched the archives and saw Shoebox recommended in 1998; if that's
> still the
> best could anyone tell a not-technical person how to use it? I'ts
> confusing.
>
Messages in this topic (6)
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5a. Re: OT Facebook False Friends
Posted by: "Jim Henry" jimhenry1...@gmail.com
Date: Sun Aug 22, 2010 6:51 pm ((PDT))
On Sun, Aug 22, 2010 at 1:08 PM, <deinx nxtxr> <deinx.nx...@sasxsek.org> wrote:
> It's not a bad way to keep in touch with friends and relative as well as
> connect with people that share a common interest, but I don't trust their
There are so many of my kinfolks who are on Facebook and only on
Facebook (i.e., scarcely use the Internet in any other way -- to the
extent that they'll reply to a Facebook message but not to a regular
email) that it seems like a necessary evil. I try to keep my profile
information to a minimum, information I don't mind having public
because I don't trust FB to keep it private and which is hopefully
sufficient for my relatives and friends to be sure they've found the
Jim Henry they know and not some homonymous person.
--
Jim Henry
http://www.pobox.com/~jimhenry/
Messages in this topic (16)
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5b. Re: OT Facebook False Friends
Posted by: "Lee" waywardwre...@yahoo.com
Date: Sun Aug 22, 2010 9:10 pm ((PDT))
No, at least not yet!
--- On Sat, 8/21/10, Philip Newton <philip.new...@gmail.com> wrote:
From: Philip Newton <philip.new...@gmail.com>
Subject: Re: OT Facebook False Friends
To: conl...@listserv.brown.edu
Date: Saturday, August 21, 2010, 6:37 AM
On Fri, Aug 20, 2010 at 7:59 PM, Lee <waywardwre...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> Facebook = evil
Now we need a conlang where /fesbuk/ means "evil" :)
ObConlang: does /fesbuk/ _vel sim_ mean anything in your conlang?
Cheers,
Philip
--
Philip Newton <philip.new...@gmail.com>
Messages in this topic (16)
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6a. Re: Romance language forum (google-groups)
Posted by: "Daniel Hollande" dkholla...@yahoo.com
Date: Sun Aug 22, 2010 7:02 pm ((PDT))
I've now signed up to Romconlang.
I also let th
Thank you, David.
I've now signed up to Romconlang.
I also let the others on my grouping know the existence of this Yahoo group.
At the same time I'll keep my Romance language forum open for all, as it
probably compliments perfectly Romconlang. Romconlang catering for Romance
constructed languages with a dash of natural Romance languages and the Romance
Language Forum catering for natural Romances with a hint of Romance conlangs.
Cheers
Daniel Hollande
________________________________
From: David McCann <da...@polymathy.plus.com>
To: conl...@listserv.brown.edu
Sent: Sat, 21 August, 2010 17:03:20
Subject: Re: Romance language forum (google-groups)
On Fri, 2010-08-20 at 20:38 -0700, Daniel Hollande wrote:
> Several months ago I set up a Google-group Romance language forum, but I
>haven't
>
> had the time to plug it previously. That ends here.
For some reason (probably because I belong to far too many groups ...)
I've never looked at the Google groups. There is a Yahoo group with the
same remit:
http://tech.groups.yahoo.com/group/romconlang/?yguid=316783960
"Romconlang is devoted to the hypothetical offspring of Latin, the
language of one of the most highly civilised people that Europe has ever
seen, and its sister languages ... Although the primary focus of this
group is constructed languages, in particular those made for artistic
reasons or just for pleasure, the discussion of Romance linguistics in
general (including historical and theoretical linguistics) is welcome
too."
> We currently have only five members, so
> please do sign up and participate if you're interested. We need the numbers!
The Yahoo group has been a bit quiet lately, but we do have 142 members,
so perhaps the five of you would like to join us?
Messages in this topic (5)
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7a. Re: nouns inflecting for anticipated pronouns
Posted by: "Daniel Bowman" danny.c.bow...@gmail.com
Date: Sun Aug 22, 2010 7:18 pm ((PDT))
Alright, I have implemented the new Angosey demonstrative pronoun system,
where a noun takes a prefix, and all following demonstrative pronouns also
have this prefix. There are three prefixes, allowing up to three nouns to
be 'stored in the language's memory'.
The three prefixes are:
pa [!\A]
qa [qA]
ma [ma]
So, for example:
Zira isa ay ngahashada *pa-*kata al *qa-*rragat *ma-*langana ndatsae. Zira
Jane ay ngahashada *q-*ey *pa-*ngey *ma-*eyna ndadh. Zira Sam ay
thera *ma*-ndey
*qa-*na ngatsa.
I saw the *pa*-cat chase the *qa*-squirrel up the *ma-*tree. Jane saw
*qa*chase
*pa *down *ma. *Sam saw *ma *fall onto *qa.*
So:
I saw the cat chase the squirrel up the tree. Jane saw it [the squirrel]
chase it [the cat] down it [the tree]. Sam saw it [the tree] fall onto it
[the squirrel].
Takes a little getting used to. But I like it-just tried it out on a
translation I'm doing.
Messages in this topic (19)
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7b. Re: nouns inflecting for anticipated pronouns
Posted by: "Daniel Bowman" danny.c.bow...@gmail.com
Date: Sun Aug 22, 2010 7:19 pm ((PDT))
Oops, [ma] is supposed to be [mA]
On Sun, Aug 22, 2010 at 10:16 PM, Daniel Bowman <danny.c.bow...@gmail.com>wrote:
> Alright, I have implemented the new Angosey demonstrative pronoun system,
> where a noun takes a prefix, and all following demonstrative pronouns also
> have this prefix. There are three prefixes, allowing up to three nouns to
> be 'stored in the language's memory'.
>
> The three prefixes are:
> pa [!\A]
> qa [qA]
> ma [ma]
>
> So, for example:
>
> Zira isa ay ngahashada *pa-*kata al *qa-*rragat *ma-*langana ndatsae.
> Zira Jane ay ngahashada *q-*ey *pa-*ngey *ma-*eyna ndadh. Zira Sam ay
> thera *ma*-ndey *qa-*na ngatsa.
>
> I saw the *pa*-cat chase the *qa*-squirrel up the *ma-*tree. Jane saw *qa
> * chase *pa *down *ma. *Sam saw *ma *fall onto *qa.*
>
> So:
>
> I saw the cat chase the squirrel up the tree. Jane saw it [the squirrel]
> chase it [the cat] down it [the tree]. Sam saw it [the tree] fall onto it
> [the squirrel].
>
> Takes a little getting used to. But I like it-just tried it out on a
> translation I'm doing.
>
--
Ayryea zakayro al Gayaltha
Messages in this topic (19)
________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________
8a. Re: Path vs. Manner Languages
Posted by: "Daniel Bowman" danny.c.bow...@gmail.com
Date: Sun Aug 22, 2010 7:46 pm ((PDT))
On Sun, Aug 22, 2010 at 5:27 PM, Gary Shannon <fizi...@gmail.com> wrote:
> I was thinking a sentence might have two verbs, one for path and one
> for manner arranged in an SVOV structure, with the tense marking
> auxiliary in front of the first verb: "He did run the room leave." or
> "He was running the room leaving." The manner verb would not be
> necessary with a non-path verb: "He will the book read." But it might
> still be optionally included: "He will walk the book read." if he
> intends to read the book while walking, as opposed to "He was sitting
> the book reading."
>
> Or maybe reverse the order of the two verbs: "He did leave the room
> run." "He was reading the book sitting." "He will read the book walk."
>
Wow. That's really cool. But I'm curious: couldn't you call one of your
verbs an adverb? Why make them both verbs?
For your first example, it would be something like "he leavingly ran the
room", or for the second example "he readingly walked"
>
> --gary
>
> On Wed, Aug 18, 2010 at 7:10 PM, vii iiix <v...@live.com.au> wrote:
> > Hey all,
> >
> > I was just wondering (I was sititing in my Semantics lecture and got
> bored and started to think) if i was possible and plausible to have a
> language which combined both Path and Manner?
> > What do you think, and I'm assuming you all know Path and Manner
> languages?
> >
>
--
Ayryea zakayro al Gayaltha
Messages in this topic (22)
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8b. Re: Path vs. Manner Languages
Posted by: "Eric Christopherson" ra...@charter.net
Date: Sun Aug 22, 2010 8:10 pm ((PDT))
On Aug 20, 2010, at 4:38 PM, Lars Finsen wrote:
> It seems to me that PIE must have had an interesting derivational system,
> judging by all those "extensions" we find so many of in etymological
> dictionaries. I once went through all the roots I could find and found some
> tendencies. I've got a long list in my papers. Possibly they are remains of a
> former morphological system.
>
> LEF
That would be cool to see, if you were to find it and put it online in the
future.
Messages in this topic (22)
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8c. Re: Path vs. Manner Languages
Posted by: "vii iiix" v...@live.com.au
Date: Sun Aug 22, 2010 10:18 pm ((PDT))
That is a very interesting concept, I was thinking of having path verbs with
optional motion suffixes but this idea is much more interesting and makes it
much easier instead of having even more suffixes in an affix-heavy language. ^^
vii
> I was thinking a sentence might have two verbs, one for path and one
> for manner arranged in an SVOV structure, with the tense marking
> auxiliary in front of the first verb: "He did run the room leave." or
> "He was running the room leaving." The manner verb would not be
> necessary with a non-path verb: "He will the book read." But it might
> still be optionally included: "He will walk the book read." if he
> intends to read the book while walking, as opposed to "He was sitting
> the book reading."
>
> Or maybe reverse the order of the two verbs: "He did leave the room
> run." "He was reading the book sitting." "He will read the book walk."
>
> --gary
Messages in this topic (22)
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8d. Re: Path vs. Manner Languages
Posted by: "David Peterson" deda...@gmail.com
Date: Sun Aug 22, 2010 10:22 pm ((PDT))
On Aug 22, 2010, at 2◊27 PM, Gary Shannon wrote:
> I was thinking a sentence might have two verbs, one for path and one
> for manner arranged in an SVOV structure, with the tense marking
> auxiliary in front of the first verb: "He did run the room leave." or
> "He was running the room leaving." The manner verb would not be
> necessary with a non-path verb: "He will the book read." But it might
> still be optionally included: "He will walk the book read." if he
> intends to read the book while walking, as opposed to "He was sitting
> the book reading."
This is similar to what happened in the history of Kamakawi. Kamakawi
began as a verb-framed language that made heavy use of serial
constructions (so instead of what you have glossed there, it'd be something
like "He ran left room" or "He left room ran"). Over time, many of the motion
verbs became prepositions as the former serial constructions became
prepositional constructions. This resulted in Kamakawi becoming a
satellite-framed language that can still use verb-framed constructions.
I discussed this whole thing in a recent Kamakawi Word of the Day post
which can be found here:
http://dedalvs.com/kamakawi/wotd/2010/08/olomo/
-David
*******************************************************************
"A male love inevivi i'ala'i oku i ue pokulu'ume o heki a."
"No eternal reward will forgive us now for wasting the dawn."
-Jim Morrison
http://dedalvs.com/
LCS Member Since 2007
http://conlang.org/
Messages in this topic (22)
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________________________________________________________________________
9a. Re: Future Englishes
Posted by: "Matthew Turnbull" ave....@gmail.com
Date: Sun Aug 22, 2010 8:36 pm ((PDT))
>Perhaps we should all develop our own Englishes (only if we want, and on
the back burner of >course) just to see how mutually unintelligible they
become.
I actually was considering doing a close up study of my dialect so that I
could diverge it from English. Unfortunatly other than Canadian Raising
there's not much going on around here (in winnipeg that is).
Mind you I probably could pull something out of that and also see if I
couldn't mix in some Ojibwe grammar by having there be a hypothetical
revival of the language followed by it's loss with a period with a large
minority of L2 English-L1 Ojibwe speakers in the population.
>
Messages in this topic (9)
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9b. Re: Future Englishes
Posted by: "Vincent Pistelli" pva...@gmail.com
Date: Sun Aug 22, 2010 9:00 pm ((PDT))
Perhaps we should all develop our own Englishes (only if we want, and on the
> back burner of course) just to see how mutually unintelligible they become.
>
> Great Idea! I am gonna be starting the pittsburgh language once I am back
in school. I work best on my conlangs during study hall.
--
Vincent Pistelli
Messages in this topic (9)
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