On May 13, Holger Levsen hol...@layer-acht.org wrote:
actually, while it has been brought up as a theoretical/wrong argument, that
we cannot switch our linux installation ship with $this init system, while
the
kfreebsd port uses $that init system, I'd say nobody is seriously saying this
On May 10, Marc Haber mh+debian-de...@zugschlus.de wrote:
Having the rescue image _this_ independent is not really desireable
since one would probably have to deal with outdated or non-existing
rescue tools in the independent image while the correct software in
the correct version is on the
On May 10, Marc Haber mh+debian-de...@zugschlus.de wrote:
Additional work necessary to satisfy upstream's bizarre ideas. Why not
keeping things the way they are now? They work. No need to waste
developer time.
Why make new releases? bo worked fine, there is no need for new features.
People
On May 09, Marc Haber mh+debian-de...@zugschlus.de wrote:
That's a hack which is acceptable for single-user home desktops. We're
talking about professional IT here.
Great, if this is the strongest objection you have then looks like it
can be done.
--
ciao,
Marco
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On May 09, Marc Haber mh+debian-de...@zugschlus.de wrote:
If you don't care about the companies that use Debian and you want
their sponsoring money to go elsewhere, yes, absolutely do this.
Actually I care a lot, since I happen to have a role in one which
manages quite a bit of Debian servers
On May 09, Bernhard R. Link brl...@debian.org wrote:
Or in other words: to make essential functionality not available if
/usr is broken.
Again: this is not we are discussing. Essential functionality is moving
to /usr anyway, no matter if /bin will become a symlink to /usr/bin.
Having a
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On May 08, The Wanderer wande...@fastmail.fm wrote:
The emergency tools side of it I'm less clear on. It's relatively
apt-get install grml-rescueboot
Which is way safer than relying on / working.
--
ciao,
Marco
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On May 08, Marc Haber mh+debian-de...@zugschlus.de wrote:
If we force a much bigger /, the chance of a broken / filesystem
increases. If / is fine, one has a chance to fix the system without
booting to rescue. So, a small / both decreases the probability of a
boot failure and makes fixing
On May 08, Marc Haber mh+debian-de...@zugschlus.de wrote:
How would that be done for a 200 MB filesystem holding /, no extra
/boot partition, and a multi-gigabyte /usr beyond the 2T barrier?
Let's assume that at this point there are no files in /{bin,sbin,lib}
which have the same name of a
On May 07, Thorsten Glaser t...@debian.org wrote:
My stated goal here is, indeed, to be able to run at least some useful
configurations of a Debian installation without *both* bash and dash
installed.
What is the point?
--
ciao,
Marco
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On May 07, Michael Biebl bi...@debian.org wrote:
I think I mentioned that before: imho it would be nice to clean up
/selinux on upgrades automatically *if* /selinux is not in use, ie. no
selinuxfs mounted there.
Agreed.
--
ciao,
Marco
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On May 07, Игорь Пашев pashev.i...@gmail.com wrote:
What about merging / and /usr ?
An ambitious plan.
I strongly support the everything in /usr scheme, but let's first
consolidate support for standalone /usr must be mounted by the
initramfs.
--
ciao,
Marco
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On May 07, Paul Tagliamonte paul...@debian.org wrote:
No please. We are good about making sure they each mean something
important, and there's no good reason.
Not really nowadays: more and more things needed at boot time are in
/usr and there are no plans to fix them.
We also support setups
On May 07, Paul Tagliamonte paul...@debian.org wrote:
everything in /usr actually means that supporting these devices is
much easier.
Not when you have a 500 meg internal storage that the firmware boots off
of, and using a multi-gig CF card to store the mega-awesome-app you're
using it
On May 07, Jonathan Dowland j...@debian.org wrote:
If we do this, I'd prefer to make /usr a symlink to / on new installs
I've always thought that myself, but it seems most folks who are pro
merge tend to propose going the other way. I've never understood why.
I was trying to not start a new
On May 07, Aurelien Jarno aurel...@aurel32.net wrote:
blocked in sid until eglibc is fixed on kfreebsd.
I see a simple solution to two problems here... :-)
--
ciao,
Marco
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On May 07, Marc Haber mh+debian-de...@zugschlus.de wrote:
What about merging / and /usr ?
So we really want to explicitly not offer an upgade path from wheezy
to jessie?
This causes no major issues on upgrades, Fedora did it.
The hard part is replacing with a symlink to the other one of every
On May 07, Matt Zagrabelny mzagr...@d.umn.edu wrote:
First, is there a consensus or quorum that believes that unnecessary
epochs is undesirable?
Among reasonable people, I'd say yes.
Epochs are like herpes: once you have one on your package it's going to
be around forever. So try to avoid them
On May 06, Christoph Anton Mitterer cales...@scientia.net wrote:
1) IMHO, services/daemons (e.g. apache, ejabberd, etc.) that listen per
default on the network (unless loopback only) shouldn't be started per
default, after being installed.
This has been discussed over and over, I think with a
On Apr 25, Michael Biebl bi...@debian.org wrote:
Please no. If libjpeg-turbo is the saner implementation, which reading
through the messages posted so far it seems like, let's switch to it fully.
Agreed.
--
ciao,
Marco
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On Jan 30, Federico Di Gregorio f...@dndg.it wrote:
NH City Center come sempre. Ti mando il mio cell in privato così
eventualmente possiamo sentirci per cene e affini.
OK, il mio è sempre il solito.
Ma tutti gli altri? Non leggete la lista o semplicemente vi sto sul
cazzo?
--
ciao,
Marco
On Dec 28, Roger Leigh rle...@debian.org wrote:
I've created a wiki page here for this proposed release goal for jessie:
http://wiki.debian.org/ReleaseGoals/MountUsrInInitramfs
Please remove the Mounting /etc in the initramfs part.
Even ignoring its merit, it has nothing to do with this and
On Nov 20, Ryan Finnie r...@finnie.org wrote:
Description : Build a Finnix bootloader stanza on GRUB 2 systems
I think that you should add one or two lines to explain what Finnix is.
At least, the word rescue would help a lot...
Note that there are certain restrictions regarding where
On Nov 09, Daniel Schepler dschep...@gmail.com wrote:
I've asked a couple people in private mail about this, and haven't
gotten any answer, so I thought I'd ask here for ideas. Where would
be a good place to upload what I have so far from bootstrapping an x32
port of Debian?
Nowhere, until
On Nov 02, Don Armstrong d...@debian.org wrote:
Seems like the right solution is to wait for the network device to be
fully up in the init script with a sleep loop... though that's
certainly not optimal.
Maybe for the time being it will be easier and safer to have ifupdown
wait until DAD is
On Oct 11, Hideki Yamane henr...@debian.or.jp wrote:
apt-fast is a shellscript wrapper for apt-get that can drastically improve
apt
download times by downloading packages in parallel, with multiple
connections
per package.
well, isn't it huge load for repository servers?
As a mirror
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On Sep 18, Amit amit.ut...@gmail.com wrote:
This is main problem. Both the drivers try and control the device. The
only work around I could come up with was to pass a usbhid quirks to
ignore this specific board and then load the custom driver.
Actually there is a different solution:
# stop
On Sep 17, Bernd Zeimetz be...@bzed.de wrote:
So we shall drop things like automatic configuration of postfix? It
actually even asks the user if the config file should be modified. That
is just one example of a lot others that jump into my mind.
/etc/postfix/{main,master}.cf are not conffiles,
On Sep 17, Bernd Zeimetz be...@bzed.de wrote:
To cite http://release.debian.org/wheezy/rc_policy.txt:
Packages' /etc/default scripts must be treated as configuration files.
Which are not the same things as conffiles.
--
ciao,
Marco
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On Sep 16, Julien Cristau jcris...@debian.org wrote:
I think the advice should be to reconsider whether symlinking the doc
directories is really a good idea.
I think it really is, since it saves space with minimal effort.
It only becomes an issue when you switch a package to a symlinked
On Sep 13, Wolodja Wentland deb...@babilen5.org wrote:
The main problem I see is that there seem to be essentially two types of
packages in non-free right now, namely those that contain firmware/microcode
(etc) and are crucial for correctly working hardware and the rest.
Yes, this was duly
On Sep 14, Michael Tokarev m...@tls.msk.ru wrote:
Well, in that case we can ship alot more .bin files from qemu
sources too, and build these on corresponding architecturs like
already mentioned (to verify the result is still the same).
Additional x86 ROMs, sparc ROMs, this PPC ROM, ...
The
On Sep 10, Henrique de Moraes Holschuh h...@debian.org wrote:
I'd like to see it recommend the instalation of (or just install by default)
system processor microcode update packages when non-free is enabled on a x86
arch (i386 or amd64) and the running processor is either Intel or AMD
(easily
On Sep 03, Serge sergem...@gmail.com wrote:
* ability to easily edit content of root partition and put some additional
software to mount /usr
Can you show some actual real life examples?
(much easier than making changes to initramfs)
And anyway, adding programs to the initramfs is as
On Aug 31, Thomas Goirand z...@debian.org wrote:
If I need to have /usr mounted before init starts, then I'm more
or less dead, and I'll have to get a recovery CD / USB.
If this is a concern to you, you can install the grml-rescueboot
package and/or a similar on-disk rescue image which will
On Aug 29, Guillem Jover guil...@debian.org wrote:
I thought this was already the consensus, and the only dissenting
opinion was that the base system should still be using gzip so that
foreign non-Debian systems can unpack it w/o requiring to build or
install xz beforehand.
I am not sure if
On Aug 30, Michael Biebl bi...@debian.org wrote:
The obvious way is to not use a separate /usr anymore or simply mount
/usr via the initramfs.
Wasn't there a patch for initramfs-tools floating around doing that?
Yes, there is one but the maintainer has not applied or rejected it
so far.
On Aug 30, Russ Allbery r...@debian.org wrote:
And yet, when we discussed this just a little bit ago, several people
asked to keep the distinction because, for them, it provides value.
A few people ask for silly things all the time, but this in itself is
not a good enough reason to satisfy
On Aug 28, Michael Biebl bi...@debian.org wrote:
We don't have the infrastructure though, to do such hardware based
installation requests, i.e. a system service which constantly monitors
newly plugged in devices, has a database of devices mapping to packages,
and a service running in the user
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On Aug 25, Ben Finney ben+deb...@benfinney.id.au wrote:
Upholding the social contract – that Debian, as distributed by the
Debian project, remain 100% free – is sufficient reason to remove these
files without corresponding source.
As I said, this is a religious argument.
It's OK, billions of
On Aug 20, Thomas Goirand z...@debian.org wrote:
If it's that hard to produce a minified version, then shouldn't
we use the normal version? How much speed-up do we really
No.
get anyway (my wild guess: not much...)?
Very important, anybody who deals with web scalability knows that
javascript
On Aug 20, Stephan Seitz stse+deb...@fsing.rootsland.net wrote:
On Mon, Aug 20, 2012 at 01:08:53PM +0200, Bjørn Mork wrote:
Never mind wireless lan where you've got a well defined kernel API. Try
to configure a modern 3G/LTE modem using ifupdown, and you will see the
Is this something
On Aug 20, Wouter Verhelst w...@uter.be wrote:
But some sites accept file uploads with arbitrary names, perhaps
expected to be a JPEG image, but actually named bar.php.jpeg and
containing malicious server-side PHP which they could execute from the
browser.
Don't Do That Then(TM).
I see
On Aug 19, Marc Haber mh+debian-de...@zugschlus.de wrote:
IPv6 people say renumbering is easy, which is only the case if SLAAC
This is between wishful thinking and an urban legend, so people who
actually know about IPv6 have not been saying this much in the last
years.
--
ciao,
Marco
On Aug 19, Henrique de Moraes Holschuh h...@debian.org wrote:
But still, I agree that we should have a better way to signal to user
space when an interface is ready. Not just for IPv6, but also more
We need better userspace glue, then. Because the netlink interface to
the kernel network
On Aug 19, Christoph Anton Mitterer cales...@scientia.net wrote:
Where do I see the main problems of NM?
NM, as a design goal, is not supposed to be able to manage every
possible configuration.
I see no reason do /discourage/ it use: it has important use cases where
it works well, the problem
On Aug 19, Charles Plessy ple...@debian.org wrote:
- PHP scripts can be executed by Apache httpd through libapache2-mod-php5 or
php5-cgi. Debian recommends libapache2-mod-php5, but there are still
This is another issue which concerns me, since mod_php forces the use of
preforking apache,
On Aug 18, Marc Haber mh+debian-de...@zugschlus.de wrote:
Because Debian prides itself in being Universal regarding ports and
architectures.
Does it? Who said so?
But even if this were true, it does not automatically justify dumbing
down the OS which people in the real world use for the sake
On Aug 18, Marc Haber mh+debian-de...@zugschlus.de wrote:
Anything that uses IPv6 and cannot deal with dynamic changes on the host
addresses is critically broken.
That includes bind, radvd and apache, and, IIRC, sshd.
BIND definitely looks for new IP addresses:
options {
interface-interval
On Aug 18, Aron Xu happyaron...@gmail.com wrote:
For yourself, they might be toy ports, but please don't speak on
behalf of others from time to time when nobody authorized you to do
so.
I am not, but I understand that arguing about this is much easier than
arguing that incomplete ports used
Maintainer: Marco d'Itri m...@linux.it
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libudev-dev - libudev development files
On Aug 16, Vincent Bernat ber...@debian.org wrote:
I know this is tedious but what others think about this matter?
This is another case in which the DFSG has become a religion to be
followed in a literalist interpretation instead of a tool to be used
for the purpose of advancing software
On Aug 13, Thomas Goirand z...@debian.org wrote:
Isn't forking udev something similar to working on mdev? How many people
No, you just have to look at the code bases and features set to
understand why.
At many level, udev has been really annoying, breaking upgrades and so on.
I can't help
On Aug 12, Carlos Alberto Lopez Perez clo...@igalia.com wrote:
Yes, udev on non-systemd systems is in our eyes a dead end, in case you
haven't noticed it yet. I am looking forward to the day when we can drop
that support entirely - Lennart Poettering (lists.freedesktop.org)
If this will become
On Aug 12, Roger Leigh rle...@codelibre.net wrote:
Not good. Time to look a bit more seriously at mdev then?
Waste of time, mdev lacks critical features like modules autoloading so
it is laughable to argue that it is a credible udev replacement for
any use case except (some) embedded systems.
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On Aug 11, Thomas Goirand z...@debian.org wrote:
Exactly! And in this particular case, the vendor is RedHat, and
the programs are systemd and udev. If we can have an alternative,
using OpenRC and mdev, then I really welcome it! Choosing systemd
just because it *seem* to look better *now*,
On Aug 11, Thomas Goirand z...@debian.org wrote:
the programs are systemd and udev. If we can have an alternative,
^^
Please stop saying we. *You* are not Debian. Thanks.
Pot. Kettle. Black.
--
ciao,
Marco
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On Aug 10, Philip Hands p...@hands.com wrote:
Now that they've done the bulk of the effort, do you really expect them
to simply discard their work because you tell them to?
I really do not care about what the openrc developers will do, my
interest is in what Debian developers will do.
So,
On Aug 10, Martin Wuertele m...@debian.org wrote:
http://www.redhat.com/archives/rhl-devel-list/2008-January/msg00861.html
And that really explains why there is a choice for core functions like
kernel event handler: udevd, hotplug2, mdev
c library: glibc, eglibc, dietlibc
They exist, and
Please do not bother.
openrc was recently discussed on debian-devel@ and there was a large
consensus that it is not a credible alternative to upstart and systemd.
We do not need to be able to choose among multiple init implementations.
--
ciao,
Marco
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On Aug 09, The Fungi fu...@yuggoth.org wrote:
So I would assume this ITP is merely an outcome of that debian-devel
discussion,
I think that the outcome of that discussion was that openrc would be too
little too late for Debian, and that it is proven that trying to support
well multiple init
On Aug 10, Roger Leigh rle...@codelibre.net wrote:
In the case of OpenRC, it has the potential to be a drop-in replacement
for sysv-rc (note that it uses base sysvinit still underneath that).
So do the other init systems.
The point is what they can do which sysvinit (and openrc) cannot.
--
On Aug 08, Arno Töll a...@debian.org wrote:
historic, rather. ifconfig and route were around already when everyone
insisted on the separation of /bin and /sbin. /bin/ip is slightly newer
and supposed to replace ifconfig/route some day entirely.
Just for the records, iproute entirely replaced
On Aug 08, Russ Allbery r...@debian.org wrote:
Sure, certainly true. But, assuming that we have a consensus that the
distinction no longer matters and just causes extra work (something that
I'm inclined to agree with but that I don't think we can assume we've
decided on yet), I hate to see
On Aug 08, Ulrich Dangel u...@spamt.net wrote:
Changing the default PATH for normal users to include /sbin, /usr/sbin as
well as
/usr/local/sbin would be a great thing for simplifying command line usage for
normal users.
Fedora did it a few months ago, so probably we should do it as well to
On Aug 06, Jakub Wilk jw...@debian.org wrote:
gearmand: gearman-job-server gearman-server
These are two implementation of the same protocol.
tcpd: tcm tcpd
I hope it is obvious that we cannot rename the real tcpd. :-)
--
ciao,
Marco
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libudev-dev - libudev development files
On Jul 22, Neil Williams codeh...@debian.org wrote:
Bitter experience. My main problem is that I don't want to follow the
direction set out by GNOME3 with the shell and lack of usable panels,
You don't have to. I use gnome applications and the panel with fvwm.
--
ciao,
Marco
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On Jul 09, Vincent Bernat ber...@debian.org wrote:
OK, I misunderstood the problem. I thought the difficulty was to fire
the screensaver on the behalf of the active user. Isn't the information
about running a power management software available through DBus?
The whole point of this discussion
On Jun 28, Roger Leigh rle...@codelibre.net wrote:
While we could expend the time and effort to do this, I do have to
question why. What would be the point of this? No one is using
those numbers, so why retain them?
Agreed.
--
ciao,
Marco
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Date: Fri, 29 Jun 2012 01:51:17 +0200
Source: inn
Binary: inn
Architecture: source i386
Version: 1:1.7.2q-41
Distribution: unstable
Urgency: low
Maintainer: Marco d'Itri m...@linux.it
Changed-By: Marco d'Itri m...@linux.it
Description
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Date: Fri, 29 Jun 2012 02:02:31 +0200
Source: inn2
Binary: inn2 inn2-lfs inn2-inews inn2-dev
Architecture: source i386
Version: 2.5.3-1
Distribution: unstable
Urgency: low
Maintainer: Marco d'Itri m...@linux.it
Changed-By: Marco d'Itri m
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Date: Fri, 29 Jun 2012 03:27:17 +0200
Source: binkd
Binary: binkd
Architecture: source i386
Version: 0.9.11-1
Distribution: unstable
Urgency: low
Maintainer: Marco d'Itri m...@linux.it
Changed-By: Marco d'Itri m...@linux.it
Description
On Jun 27, Bernhard R. Link brl...@debian.org wrote:
I'd prefer to get this fixed in acpi-support-base, but I think you
have made your point very clear that the only purpose of that package is
to not do anything if some power manager is running and that to detect this
perfectly you are
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Date: Mon, 25 Jun 2012 02:31:17 +0200
Source: tin
Binary: tin
Architecture: source i386
Version: 1:2.1.1-1
Distribution: unstable
Urgency: low
Maintainer: Marco d'Itri m...@linux.it
Changed-By: Marco d'Itri m...@linux.it
Description:
tin
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Date: Mon, 25 Jun 2012 02:48:38 +0200
Source: kmod
Binary: kmod module-init-tools libkmod2 libkmod-dev libkmod2-udeb
Architecture: source i386 all
Version: 9-1
Distribution: unstable
Urgency: medium
Maintainer: Marco d'Itri m...@linux.it
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Date: Mon, 25 Jun 2012 03:34:36 +0200
Source: whois
Binary: whois
Architecture: source i386
Version: 5.0.17
Distribution: unstable
Urgency: medium
Maintainer: Marco d'Itri m...@linux.it
Changed-By: Marco d'Itri m...@linux.it
Description
On Jun 23, Russ Allbery r...@debian.org wrote:
We've frequently required users to upgrade specific packages to newer
versions prior to the general dist-upgrade to resolve various issues, such
as for the udev transition.
FWIW, what we required was to upgrade the kernel and udev at the same
On Jun 22, Goswin von Brederlow goswin-...@web.de wrote:
Step 1: upgrade/dist-upgrade with ia32-libs (wine, ...) held back
Step 2: dpkg --add-architecture i386 apt-get update
Step 3: dist-upgrade (ia32-libs, wine, ... is now installable)
Maybe this is easier?
1: upgrade dpkg and apt
2: dpkg
On Jun 21, Lars Wirzenius l...@liw.fi wrote:
The other aspect, however, is that Hangout and Skype are not free.
It is not unacceptable for those developing Debian to use non-free
software, or non-free services, but it gets problematic if it's
I do not remember the social contract discussing
On Jun 21, Lars Wirzenius l...@liw.fi wrote:
While some people understandably do not like to use proprietary online
services managed by third parties, there is no consensus that using them
for Debian purposes is inappropriate.
I believe there is a consensus that having the project
On Jun 15, Matthew Grant matthewgra...@gmail.com wrote:
Just wondering how busy he is. Just that it would be good to have Bind
Probably a lot.
Did you ask him if he would like the help of a co-maintainer?
Did you try sending patches for open bugs?
Uploading a new release is the easy part of the
On May 20, Ben Hutchings b...@decadent.org.uk wrote:
No, keep i386 userland only. Though we might consider reducing even
that to a 'partial architecture' that has only libraries (similar to
ia32-libs today, only cleaner).
Don't you believe in x32?
--
ciao,
Marco
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