On 11/25/05, Phillip J. Eby <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> At 10:28 AM 11/25/2005 -0500, Phillip J. Eby wrote:
> >Actually, I'm increasingly tempted to PEP the idea of a
> >name-version.pkg-info file being installed alongside the code as a standard
> >Python distutils feature. This discussion has ma
At 05:04 PM 11/25/2005 +0100, Janusz A. Urbanowicz wrote:
Opt out is evil in any circumstances, it should be always opt in, and not
too easy to do so.
Um, running setup.py or easy_install *is* opting in. I was just pointing
out that there are ways to restrict what you're opting in *to*, and t
On 11/25/05, Phillip J. Eby <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> At 11:34 AM 11/25/2005 +, Paul Moore wrote:
> >- what would happen if I downloaded the TurboGears egg and just put it
> >on sys.path - no easy_install or whatever?)
>
> You could import stuff from it, but it might or might not work. Wher
At 10:28 AM 11/25/2005 -0500, Phillip J. Eby wrote:
Actually, I'm increasingly tempted to PEP the idea of a
name-version.pkg-info file being installed alongside the code as a standard
Python distutils feature. This discussion has made it clearer (even to
me!) how useful such a thing would be, an
On Fri, Nov 25, 2005 at 10:37:51AM -0500, Phillip J. Eby wrote:
> At 04:22 PM 11/25/2005 +0100, Janusz A. Urbanowicz wrote:
> >On Fri, Nov 25, 2005 at 09:23:04AM -0500, Phillip J. Eby wrote:
> >> Now, it's possible for an individual coder to write an application or
> >> library that invokes easy_in
At 04:22 PM 11/25/2005 +0100, Janusz A. Urbanowicz wrote:
On Fri, Nov 25, 2005 at 09:23:04AM -0500, Phillip J. Eby wrote:
> Now, it's possible for an individual coder to write an application or
> library that invokes easy_install itself, but anybody can write bad code
> and that's what you have a
At 03:30 PM 11/25/2005 +0100, Vincenzo Di Massa wrote:
Alle 15:05, venerdì 25 novembre 2005, Phillip J. Eby ha scritto:
> It seems to me like the simpler solution is just to have the packages
> install the .egg-info, and nobody has to maintain a mapping database
> because the setup.py's the .debs
On Fri, Nov 25, 2005 at 09:23:04AM -0500, Phillip J. Eby wrote:
> At 01:07 PM 11/25/2005 +0100, Janusz A. Urbanowicz wrote:
> >On Fri, Nov 25, 2005 at 10:29:56AM +, Donovan Baarda wrote:
> >> On Fri, 2005-11-25 at 01:33 -0500, Phillip J. Eby wrote:
> >> [... long informative explanation of egg.
At 01:39 PM 11/25/2005 +, Paul Moore wrote:
On 11/25/05, Donovan Baarda <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Sorry... that's what I meant; don't deb an egg... install it as an egg,
> outside of the Debian package management system. As an egg, it is under
> development and not ready for release as a d
At 01:52 PM 11/25/2005 +0100, Josselin Mouette wrote:
It could do it by simply trying to import the module.
Python's import mechanism is fragile in the presence of failed imports that
aren't explicitly trapped, and in Python 2.3 it's even more fragile because
only the *first* attempt to impor
At 01:07 PM 11/25/2005 +0100, Janusz A. Urbanowicz wrote:
On Fri, Nov 25, 2005 at 10:29:56AM +, Donovan Baarda wrote:
> On Fri, 2005-11-25 at 01:33 -0500, Phillip J. Eby wrote:
> [... long informative explanation of egg...]
> In particular, will an egg wrapped inside a Debian package magicall
At 11:34 AM 11/25/2005 +, Paul Moore wrote:
On 11/25/05, Donovan Baarda <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> On thing about this worried me;
>
> If TurboGears depends on an "egg'ed" ElementTree, what happens if a
> system has ElementTree installed as a non-egg package? Does installing
> TurboGears as
At 11:54 AM 11/25/2005 +0100, Vincenzo Di Massa wrote:
Alle 11:04, venerdì 25 novembre 2005, David Arnold ha scritto:
> But, if compatible versions of those dependencies are already installed
> as Debian packages *without* egg metadata, will these be ignored?
Yes, they will.
> Even if it was po
At 10:29 AM 11/25/2005 +, Donovan Baarda wrote:
On Fri, 2005-11-25 at 01:33 -0500, Phillip J. Eby wrote:
[... long informative explanation of egg...]
So it sounds like egg duplicates much of the functionality of the Debian
Package manager, but also extends it slightly in python-specific ways
Alle 13:52, venerdì 25 novembre 2005, hai scritto:
> Le vendredi 25 novembre 2005 à 11:54 +0100, Vincenzo Di Massa a écrit :
> > Alle 11:04, venerdì 25 novembre 2005, David Arnold ha scritto:
> > > But, if compatible versions of those dependencies are already installed
> > > as Debian packages *wit
On 11/25/05, Donovan Baarda <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Sorry... that's what I meant; don't deb an egg... install it as an egg,
> outside of the Debian package management system. As an egg, it is under
> development and not ready for release as a deb. When the software is
> ready for release, stri
On 11/25/05, Vincenzo Di Massa <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > To me, this sucks. Sorry, Philip, I know *why* you can't introspect a
> > non-egg ElementTree well enough to avoid this, but it still sucks.
>
> Please read
> http://mail.python.org/pipermail/distutils-sig/2005-November/005520.html
> htt
At 09:04 PM 11/25/2005 +1100, David Arnold wrote:
-->"Phillip" == Phillip J Eby <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
Phillip> I would like to clarify the phrase "shipped as an egg",
Phillip> though. To me, that would mean that the developer is
Phillip> distributing a binary .egg file, and I'm assum
On Fri, 2005-11-25 at 13:04 +0100, Vincenzo Di Massa wrote:
> Alle 12:34, venerdì 25 novembre 2005, Paul Moore ha scritto:
> > On 11/25/05, Donovan Baarda <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
[...]
> Please read
> http://mail.python.org/pipermail/distutils-sig/2005-November/005520.html
> http://mail.python.
On Fri, 2005-11-25 at 13:07 +0100, Janusz A. Urbanowicz wrote:
> On Fri, Nov 25, 2005 at 10:29:56AM +, Donovan Baarda wrote:
> > On Fri, 2005-11-25 at 01:33 -0500, Phillip J. Eby wrote:
[...]
> > If you ever want to install stuff that is not in a Debian package, it
> > should be installed outs
Le vendredi 25 novembre 2005 à 11:54 +0100, Vincenzo Di Massa a écrit :
> Alle 11:04, venerdì 25 novembre 2005, David Arnold ha scritto:
> > But, if compatible versions of those dependencies are already installed
> > as Debian packages *without* egg metadata, will these be ignored?
>
> Yes, they w
On Fri, Nov 25, 2005 at 10:29:56AM +, Donovan Baarda wrote:
> On Fri, 2005-11-25 at 01:33 -0500, Phillip J. Eby wrote:
> [... long informative explanation of egg...]
> In particular, will an egg wrapped inside a Debian package magically
> install other bits of software not from Debian packages?
Alle 12:34, venerdì 25 novembre 2005, Paul Moore ha scritto:
> On 11/25/05, Donovan Baarda <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > On thing about this worried me;
> >
> > If TurboGears depends on an "egg'ed" ElementTree, what happens if a
> > system has ElementTree installed as a non-egg package? Does insta
On Thu, Nov 24, 2005 at 11:46:58AM -0500, Phillip J. Eby wrote:
> At 04:20 PM 11/24/2005 +0100, Josselin Mouette wrote:
> >Le jeudi 24 novembre 2005 ? 10:14 -0500, Phillip J. Eby a écrit :
> >> At 01:44 PM 11/24/2005 +0100, Josselin Mouette wrote:
> >> >They only introduce more complexity, instead
On Thu, Nov 24, 2005 at 01:05:14PM -0500, Phillip J. Eby wrote:
>
> What you're saying is, you want TurboGears to be able to blindly trust that
> its dependencies are installed. This doesn't help users, though, because
> it keeps the package author from being able to provide *end-user support*
On 11/25/05, Donovan Baarda <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> On thing about this worried me;
>
> If TurboGears depends on an "egg'ed" ElementTree, what happens if a
> system has ElementTree installed as a non-egg package? Does installing
> TurboGears as an egg inside a Debian package require also insta
I forgot to add that doing what I propose will make *all* debian python
packages become valid eggs *without* touching them at all: it would be
setuptools code tha becomes able to interpret a deb package meaning,
considering it as if it were a real egg package.
So the Debian policy, the filesist
Alle 11:04, venerdì 25 novembre 2005, David Arnold ha scritto:
> But, if compatible versions of those dependencies are already installed
> as Debian packages *without* egg metadata, will these be ignored?
Yes, they will.
> Even if it was possible for Debian to extend this downloading mechanism
>
On Fri, 2005-11-25 at 01:33 -0500, Phillip J. Eby wrote:
[... long informative explanation of egg...]
So it sounds like egg duplicates much of the functionality of the Debian
Package manager, but also extends it slightly in python-specific ways.
I can under stand the Debian packagers asking thems
-->"Phillip" == Phillip J Eby <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
(btw Phillip, thanks muchly for your patience with this thread)
Phillip> If you unpack this as-is, but rename EGG-INFO to
Phillip> foobar.egg-info (today) or foobar-1.2.egg-info (when I
Phillip> release 0.6a9 of setuptools), and the
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