On Wednesday 03 September 2014 06:56:53 Erwan David wrote:
On Wed, Sep 03, 2014 at 07:25:19AM CEST, Lisi Reisz lisi.re...@gmail.com
said:
On Wednesday 03 September 2014 06:19:15 Doug wrote:
OK, guys. What is the best way to communicate with developers, not just
in the Debian crew, but
On 09/03/2014 01:19 AM, Doug wrote:
On 09/03/2014 12:50 AM, Zenaan Harkness wrote:
On 9/3/14, Lisi Reisz lisi.re...@gmail.com wrote:
On Tuesday 02 September 2014 17:06:58 Steve Litt wrote:
So, Lisi, is it your contention that the developers don't look at this
list, and don't care what's
Doug wrote:
On 09/03/2014 12:50 AM, Zenaan Harkness wrote:
On 9/3/14, Lisi Reisz lisi.re...@gmail.com wrote:
On Tuesday 02 September 2014 17:06:58 Steve Litt wrote:
So, Lisi, is it your contention that the developers don't look at this
list, and don't care what's written on it?
By and large,
On Wed 03 Sep 2014 at 07:54:25 +0200, Erwan David wrote:
On Tue, Sep 02, 2014 at 11:14:52PM CEST, Martin Read zen75...@zen.co.uk
said:
On 02/09/14 19:55, Jimmy Johnson wrote:
Erwan David wrote:
aptitude remove systemd - downgrade almost everything to stable...
Ok no program present
On 03/09/14 06:54, Erwan David wrote:
lauching systemd-logind (which they do) is actually requiring it, no ?
Point. (I find myself instinctively reading requiring systemd as
requiring systemd as PID 1, so I tend to say requiring a component of
the systemd suite when talking about things that
On Wed, Sep 03, 2014 at 07:25:21AM +0100, Lisi Reisz wrote:
On Wednesday 03 September 2014 06:56:53 Erwan David wrote:
On Wed, Sep 03, 2014 at 07:25:19AM CEST, Lisi Reisz lisi.re...@gmail.com
said:
On Wednesday 03 September 2014 06:19:15 Doug wrote:
OK, guys. What is the best way to
Dan Ritter dsr at randomstring.org writes:
Reading:
http://0pointer.net/blog/revisiting-how-we-put-together-linux-systems.html
systemd's upstream is explicitly interested in taking over all
Linux distros, not in the minor sense of being supported on
every system but in the major sense of
On Tue, Sep 02, 2014 at 07:22:48AM +, KD wrote:
Dan Ritter dsr at randomstring.org writes:
Reading:
http://0pointer.net/blog/revisiting-how-we-put-together-linux-systems.html
systemd's upstream is explicitly interested in taking over all
Linux distros, not in the minor sense of
On Tue, 2 Sep 2014 23:44:49 +1200
Chris Bannister cbannis...@slingshot.co.nz wrote:
On Tue, Sep 02, 2014 at 07:22:48AM +, KD wrote:
Dan Ritter dsr at randomstring.org writes:
Reading:
http://0pointer.net/blog/revisiting-how-we-put-together-linux-systems.html
systemd's
On Tuesday 02 September 2014 14:52:46 Joe wrote:
On Tue, 2 Sep 2014 23:44:49 +1200
Chris Bannister cbannis...@slingshot.co.nz wrote:
On Tue, Sep 02, 2014 at 07:22:48AM +, KD wrote:
Dan Ritter dsr at randomstring.org writes:
Reading:
Lisi Reisz wrote:
On Tuesday 02 September 2014 14:52:46 Joe wrote:
On Tue, 2 Sep 2014 23:44:49 +1200
Chris Bannister cbannis...@slingshot.co.nz wrote:
On Tue, Sep 02, 2014 at 07:22:48AM +, KD wrote:
Dan Ritter dsr at randomstring.org writes:
Reading:
On 02/09/14 16:14, Miles Fidelman wrote:
Lisi Reisz wrote:
On Tuesday 02 September 2014 14:52:46 Joe wrote:
On Tue, 2 Sep 2014 23:44:49 +1200
Chris Bannister cbannis...@slingshot.co.nz wrote:
On Tue, Sep 02, 2014 at 07:22:48AM +, KD wrote:
Dan Ritter dsr at randomstring.org writes:
On Tue, Sep 02, 2014 at 04:05:53PM CEST, Lisi Reisz lisi.re...@gmail.com said:
On Tuesday 02 September 2014 14:52:46 Joe wrote:
On Tue, 2 Sep 2014 23:44:49 +1200
Chris Bannister cbannis...@slingshot.co.nz wrote:
On Tue, Sep 02, 2014 at 07:22:48AM +, KD wrote:
Dan Ritter dsr at
On Tue, 02 Sep 2014 16:41:26 +0200
Tony van der Hoff t...@vanderhoff.org wrote:
Then again, endless spreading of FUD on a list that is powerless to do
anything about the situation, could, and should, be regarded as
trolling.
There is a good reason to keep FUD heated: the bigger and the deeper
Tony van der Hoff wrote:
On 02/09/14 16:14, Miles Fidelman wrote:
Lisi Reisz wrote:
On Tuesday 02 September 2014 14:52:46 Joe wrote:
On Tue, 2 Sep 2014 23:44:49 +1200
Chris Bannister cbannis...@slingshot.co.nz wrote:
On Tue, Sep 02, 2014 at 07:22:48AM +, KD wrote:
Dan Ritter dsr at
On Tue, 02 Sep 2014 08:05:33 -0700
Jimmy Johnson field.engin...@gmail.com wrote:
Maybe you should do some reading and maybe run Debian testing
http://igurublog.wordpress.com/2014/04/03/tso-and-linus-and-the-impotent-rage-against-systemd/
Hmm, this (sad) article raises a crucial question
On Tue, 2 Sep 2014 15:05:53 +0100
Lisi Reisz lisi.re...@gmail.com wrote:
On Tuesday 02 September 2014 14:52:46 Joe wrote:
On Tue, 2 Sep 2014 23:44:49 +1200
So is this vision of the future not likely to affect Debian, then? I
get the impression it is expected to do so.
This endless
On Tue, 02 Sep 2014 16:41:26 +0200
Tony van der Hoff t...@vanderhoff.org wrote:
Then again, endless spreading of FUD on a list that is powerless to do
anything about the situation, could, and should, be regarded as
trolling.
We have seen countless threads on the supposed evilness of
On Tuesday 02 September 2014 17:06:58 Steve Litt wrote:
So, Lisi, is it your contention that the developers don't look at this
list, and don't care what's written on it?
By and large, yes. If you want to communicate with developers, communicate
with developers. Some of them hang around here.
On 2014-09-02, B lazyvi...@gmx.com wrote:
Hmm, this (sad) article raises a crucial question that supersedes
those about systemd: can we _really_ *trust* Debian to defend us
against morons, such as nsa and other assholes' agencies?
You should worry more about your own assholes and
Le 02/09/2014 19:03, Lisi Reisz a écrit :
On Tuesday 02 September 2014 17:06:58 Steve Litt wrote:
So, Lisi, is it your contention that the developers don't look at this
list, and don't care what's written on it?
By and large, yes. If you want to communicate with developers, communicate
with
On Tuesday 02 September 2014 18:06:29 Erwan David wrote:
Please read the article pointed by the OP.
I have.
Lisi
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Archive:
Erwan David writes:
Please read the article pointed by the OP.
Nobody is going to impose any changes on the Debian packaging system.
That's a nonstarter.
--
John Hasler
jhas...@newsguy.com
Elmwood, WI USA
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Le 02/09/2014 19:29, John Hasler a écrit :
Erwan David writes:
Please read the article pointed by the OP.
Nobody is going to impose any changes on the Debian packaging system.
That's a nonstarter.
Even if in some later version systemd works only with this kind of scheme ?
--
To
On Tue, 2 Sep 2014 17:04:45 + (UTC)
Curt cu...@free.fr wrote:
You should worry more about your own assholes and morons (of course,
that doesn't sell to the gallery as well, now does it?)
On Tue, 02 Sep 2014 19:06:29 +0200
Erwan David er...@rail.eu.org wrote:
So which lists are you
speaking of ?
The systemd list, may be?
OK, I -[]
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On Tue, 02 Sep 2014 19:33:12 +0200
Erwan David er...@rail.eu.org wrote:
Even if in some later version systemd works only with this kind of
scheme ?
I join John about that, Debian as the very best packaging system,
moving to RPM would clobber any hope to stay in the lead, despite
the A grade
Le 02/09/2014 19:38, B a écrit :
On Tue, 02 Sep 2014 19:33:12 +0200
Erwan David er...@rail.eu.org wrote:
Even if in some later version systemd works only with this kind of
scheme ?
I join John about that, Debian as the very best packaging system,
moving to RPM would clobber any hope to
Erwan David writes:
Please read the article pointed by the OP.
I wrote:
Nobody is going to impose any changes on the Debian packaging system.
That's a nonstarter.
Erwan David writes:
Even if in some later version systemd works only with this kind of
scheme ?
Yes. Remember the LSB? What
Le 02/09/2014 19:58, John Hasler a écrit :
Erwan David writes:
Please read the article pointed by the OP.
I wrote:
Nobody is going to impose any changes on the Debian packaging system.
That's a nonstarter.
Erwan David writes:
Even if in some later version systemd works only with this kind
On Tue, 2 Sep 2014 19:38:42 +0200
B lazyvi...@gmx.com wrote:
On Tue, 02 Sep 2014 19:33:12 +0200
Erwan David er...@rail.eu.org wrote:
Even if in some later version systemd works only with this kind of
scheme ?
I join John about that, Debian as the very best packaging system,
moving
On Tue, 2 Sep 2014 18:03:41 +0100
Lisi Reisz lisi.re...@gmail.com wrote:
Do stop bellyaching to no avail. If you feel that Lennart should be
stopped, find a way of stopping him. But this is not it.
Lisi
He who forgets history is bound to repeat it.
Mid to late 1990's, lots of people
On Tue, 02 Sep 2014 12:29:06 -0500
John Hasler jhas...@newsguy.com wrote:
Erwan David writes:
Please read the article pointed by the OP.
Nobody is going to impose any changes on the Debian packaging system.
That's a nonstarter.
Four years ago, would you have thought that an init system
Erwan David wrote:
aptitude remove systemd - downgrade almost everything to stable...
Ok no program present in stable should depend on systemd...
that's a lot of bugs to open...
Erwan, the whole of my Wheezy desktop system as I know it seems to be
locked into 'libsystemd-login0' and
Then again, endless spreading of FUD on a list that is powerless to do
anything about the situation, could, and should, be regarded as trolling.
+1.
Please stop!
- Clemens
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On Tue 02 Sep 2014 at 11:55:24 -0700, Jimmy Johnson wrote:
Erwan David wrote:
aptitude remove systemd - downgrade almost everything to stable...
Ok no program present in stable should depend on systemd...
that's a lot of bugs to open...
Erwan, the whole of my Wheezy desktop system as
On 02/09/14 19:55, Jimmy Johnson wrote:
Erwan David wrote:
aptitude remove systemd - downgrade almost everything to stable...
Ok no program present in stable should depend on systemd...
that's a lot of bugs to open...
Erwan, the whole of my Wheezy desktop system as I know it seems to be
Martin Read wrote:
On 02/09/14 19:55, Jimmy Johnson wrote:
Erwan David wrote:
aptitude remove systemd - downgrade almost everything to stable...
Ok no program present in stable should depend on systemd...
that's a lot of bugs to open...
Erwan, the whole of my Wheezy desktop system as I
On 9/3/14, Tony van der Hoff t...@vanderhoff.org wrote:
On 02/09/14 16:14, Miles Fidelman wrote:
Lisi Reisz wrote:
This endless verbosity will not make one iota of difference.
Lobby those who
might be able to do something if you feel like it, e.g. the
developers. But
it really doesn't
On 9/3/14, Erwan David er...@rail.eu.org wrote:
On Tue, Sep 02, 2014 at 04:05:53PM CEST, Lisi Reisz lisi.re...@gmail.com
said:
This endless verbosity will not make one iota of difference.
Lobby those who might be able to do something if you feel
like it, e.g. the developers. But
it really
On 9/3/14, Steve Litt sl...@troubleshooters.com wrote:
On Tue, 02 Sep 2014 16:41:26 +0200
Tony van der Hoff t...@vanderhoff.org wrote:
Then again, endless spreading of FUD on a list that is powerless to do
anything about the situation, could, and should, be regarded as
trolling.
We have
On 9/3/14, Lisi Reisz lisi.re...@gmail.com wrote:
On Tuesday 02 September 2014 17:06:58 Steve Litt wrote:
So, Lisi, is it your contention that the developers don't look at this
list, and don't care what's written on it?
By and large, yes. If you want to communicate with developers,
On 9/3/14, Curt cu...@free.fr wrote:
On 2014-09-02, B lazyvi...@gmx.com wrote:
Hmm, this (sad) article raises a crucial question that supersedes
those about systemd: can we _really_ *trust* Debian to defend us
against morons, such as nsa and other assholes' agencies?
You should worry
On 9/3/14, Erwan David er...@rail.eu.org wrote:
Le 02/09/2014 19:03, Lisi Reisz a écrit :
On Tuesday 02 September 2014 17:06:58 Steve Litt wrote:
So, Lisi, is it your contention that the developers don't look at this
list, and don't care what's written on it?
By and large, yes. If you want
On 9/3/14, Clemens Eisserer linuxhi...@gmail.com wrote:
Then again, endless spreading of FUD on a list that is powerless to do
anything about the situation, could, and should, be regarded as trolling.
+1.
Please stop!
-1.
Please continue. At least one new thread a week
bashing systemd.
We
On 09/03/2014 12:50 AM, Zenaan Harkness wrote:
On 9/3/14, Lisi Reisz lisi.re...@gmail.com wrote:
On Tuesday 02 September 2014 17:06:58 Steve Litt wrote:
So, Lisi, is it your contention that the developers don't look at this
list, and don't care what's written on it?
By and large, yes. If
On Wednesday 03 September 2014 06:19:15 Doug wrote:
OK, guys. What is the best way to communicate with developers, not just
in the Debian crew, but devs from other popular systems, like Ubuntu,
PCLOS, Centos, etc.
The Debian ones, on the Debian developers list. Though I doubt they would
On Tue, Sep 02, 2014 at 11:14:52PM CEST, Martin Read zen75...@zen.co.uk said:
On 02/09/14 19:55, Jimmy Johnson wrote:
Erwan David wrote:
aptitude remove systemd - downgrade almost everything to stable...
Ok no program present in stable should depend on systemd...
that's a lot of bugs to
On Wed, Sep 03, 2014 at 02:22:24AM CEST, Miles Fidelman
mfidel...@meetinghouse.net said:
Martin Read wrote:
On 02/09/14 19:55, Jimmy Johnson wrote:
Erwan David wrote:
aptitude remove systemd - downgrade almost everything to stable...
Ok no program present in stable should depend on
On Wed, Sep 03, 2014 at 07:25:19AM CEST, Lisi Reisz lisi.re...@gmail.com said:
On Wednesday 03 September 2014 06:19:15 Doug wrote:
OK, guys. What is the best way to communicate with developers, not just
in the Debian crew, but devs from other popular systems, like Ubuntu,
PCLOS, Centos,
Reading:
http://0pointer.net/blog/revisiting-how-we-put-together-linux-systems.html
systemd's upstream is explicitly interested in taking over all
Linux distros, not in the minor sense of being supported on
every system but in the major sense of making package management
conform to their own
On Mon 01 Sep 2014 at 13:26:09 -0400, Dan Ritter wrote:
Reading:
http://0pointer.net/blog/revisiting-how-we-put-together-linux-systems.html
systemd's upstream is explicitly interested in taking over all
Linux distros, not in the minor sense of being supported on
every system but in the
Le 01/09/2014 20:29, Brian a écrit :
On Mon 01 Sep 2014 at 13:26:09 -0400, Dan Ritter wrote:
Reading:
http://0pointer.net/blog/revisiting-how-we-put-together-linux-systems.html
systemd's upstream is explicitly interested in taking over all
Linux distros, not in the minor sense of being
On Mon, 1 Sep 2014 13:26:09 -0400
Dan Ritter d...@randomstring.org wrote:
http://0pointer.net/blog/revisiting-how-we-put-together-linux-systems.html
An article written by… one of the systemd devs………
We happen to learn that it'll also be _dependent_ on BTRFS
and (may be?, when?) support EXT4
On Mon 01 Sep 2014 at 20:34:59 +0200, Erwan David wrote:
Le 01/09/2014 20:29, Brian a écrit :
On Mon 01 Sep 2014 at 13:26:09 -0400, Dan Ritter wrote:
Reading:
http://0pointer.net/blog/revisiting-how-we-put-together-linux-systems.html
systemd's upstream is explicitly interested in
On Mon, 1 Sep 2014 13:26:09 -0400
Dan Ritter d...@randomstring.org wrote:
Reading:
http://0pointer.net/blog/revisiting-how-we-put-together-linux-systems.html
systemd's upstream is explicitly interested in taking over all
Linux distros, not in the minor sense of being supported on
every
Dan Ritter wrote at 2014-09-01 12:26 -0500:
Reading:
http://0pointer.net/blog/revisiting-how-we-put-together-linux-systems.html
Dan, thank you for posting this link. It is especially interesting
considering it is by Lennart Poettering. Also, I consider it relevant
to Debian users and firmly
I hestitate to enter this thread, given its nasty tone, so please don't
attack me if I pose some non-partisan questions.
An issue came up whether debian Jessie can run without systemd. I'm
currently running Wheezy without systemd installed, but I get this:
$ dpkg -l *systemd* | grep ii
ii
On Mon 01 Sep 2014 at 18:17:29 -0400, Haines Brown wrote:
I hestitate to enter this thread, given its nasty tone, so please don't
attack me if I pose some non-partisan questions.
This is not an attack. :)
Non-partisan questions are much better off being asked in a standalone
post separate
* On 2014 01 Sep 12:43 -0500, Dan Ritter wrote:
Reading:
http://0pointer.net/blog/revisiting-how-we-put-together-linux-systems.html
I stopped at his second bullet point. He wants to lump RPM and .deb
systems together and it's clear he hasn't got a clue. I'm also an
upstream project manager
http://0pointer.net/blog/revisiting-how-we-put-together-linux-systems.html
That looks -awesome-! Great potential. Object-oriented distributions/
installations. It'll be quite a journey from here to there though :)
So many comedic opportunities shall undoubtedly present themselves.
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Steve Litt writes:
Let's rename the Linux Kernel to the Systemd Kernel. Then let's make
the package manager part of the kernel.
No, no. Make the kernel part of Systemd. And X as well.
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jhas...@newsguy.com
Elmwood, WI USA
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On Mon, 01 Sep 2014 21:50:04 -0500
John Hasler jhas...@newsguy.com wrote:
No, no. Make the kernel part of Systemd. And X as well.
In this case, why not making only one package of the whole distro:
systemd-all-in-one.deb-rpm-gz ;)
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Dan Ritter wrote:
Reading:
http://0pointer.net/blog/revisiting-how-we-put-together-linux-systems.html
systemd's upstream is explicitly interested in taking over all
Linux distros, not in the minor sense of being supported on
every system but in the major sense of making package management
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