On Sat, Apr 03, 2021 at 05:43:38PM +0200, Pierre-Elliott Bécue wrote:
> Move choice 7 to 8 and put it seven.
>
> [ ] Choice 7: Rejecting and denouncing a witch-hunt against RMS.
>
> (maybe Craig has a better idea)
Thanks, looks goodexcept for two problems:
1. you've used the wrong article "a"
#x27;re the ones pushing for it.
craig
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then is invalid.
craig
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On Sat, Apr 03, 2021 at 09:14:53AM +, Holger Levsen wrote:
> On Sat, Apr 03, 2021 at 10:56:45AM +1100, Craig Sanders wrote:
> > TEXT OF OPTION 5
> >
> > Debian refuses to participate in and denounces the witch-hunt against
> > Richard
>
On Sat, Apr 03, 2021 at 11:25:13AM +0300, Adrian Bunk wrote:
> Craig, if you make this a new separate GR I will be glad to sponsor it.
why not do that yourself?
craig
On Sat, Apr 03, 2021 at 09:33:48AM +0200, Kurt Roeckx wrote:
> On Sat, Apr 03, 2021 at 10:56:45AM +1100, Craig Sanders wrote:
> > Short and simple:
> >
> > TEXT OF OPTION 5
> >
> >
> > Debian refuses to participate in and denounces the witch
lify as a
> witch-hunt.
The witch hunt is not within debian, debian's just being dragged into the
angry mob.
craig
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Short and simple:
TEXT OF OPTION 5
Debian refuses to participate in and denounces the witch-hunt against Richard
Stallman, the Free Software Foundation, and the members of the board of the
Free Software Foundation.
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On Fri, Apr 02, 2021 at 08:43:15PM +0300, Adrian Bunk wrote:
> There is a common pitfall that uploads signed with a key that is expired in
> the keyring are silently dropped at some point during processing.
Thanks, i'll look into that. I'm pretty sure I signed it with my newest
(2015-ish) key, but
e who refuses to learn".
Which means exactly what it says.
craig
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On Fri, Apr 02, 2021 at 06:18:51PM +0200, Zlatan Todoric wrote:
> [...] still not good enough to throw tantrums
> around with "witch-hunt". Women in past were burnt alive on stakes, so stop
> with extreme rhetoric when some expresses that they had it enough with
> sexist behavior.
Witch-hunt is a
On Fri, Apr 02, 2021 at 10:56:42AM -0400, Roberto C. Sánchez wrote:
> debian-keyring (1998.09.27) unstable; urgency=low
>
> * Mon Sep 7 14:13:23 EDT 1998: [PGP/IG] Updated the key of Dima Barsky
> * Thu Sep 10 18:10:03 EDT 1998: [PGP/IG] Added the key of Craig Sanders
>
>
On Fri, Apr 02, 2021 at 05:07:59AM +0100, Phil Morrell wrote:
> On Fri, 2 Apr 2021, Craig Sanders wrote:
> > Debian refuses to participate in and denounces the witch-hunt against
> > Richard Stallman, the Free Software Foundation, and the members of the
> > board of the Fre
TEXT OF OPTION 5
Debian refuses to participate in and denounces the witch-hunt against Richard
Stallman, the Free Software Foundation, and the members of the board of the
Free Software Foundation.
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Short and simple:
TEXT OF OPTION 5
Debian refuses to participate in and denounces the witch-hunt against Richard
Stallman, the Free Software Foundation, and the members of the board of the
Free Software Foundation.
7;t necessary because debian is
already compliant with it.
dishonest "debating" like this (i.e. petty ego-wankers like you
point-scoring by malicious twisting of words and selective misquoting),
is why i haven't bothered for years. i should have remembered that i
have better things t
cceptable to perform stealth or forced conversions to systemd by
dependency.
craig
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such special unique snowflakes that policy
is irrelevant. if you think that's a bug, then you have to supply
the patches to fix it and not tell other people to do so.
craig
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I second Ian Jackson's proposal 'preserve freedom of choice of init
systems'
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On Fri, May 04, 2007 at 08:42:16PM -0700, Steve Langasek wrote:
> On Sat, May 05, 2007 at 12:04:25PM +1000, Craig Sanders wrote:
> > On Fri, May 04, 2007 at 06:06:18PM -0700, Steve Langasek wrote:
> > > On Sat, May 05, 2007 at 10:24:16AM +1000, Craig Sanders wrote:
> > &g
On Fri, May 04, 2007 at 06:06:18PM -0700, Steve Langasek wrote:
> On Sat, May 05, 2007 at 10:24:16AM +1000, Craig Sanders wrote:
> > if he wants to move on and grow up and put it behind him, let him. it's
> > not like a stupid parody organisation actually harms anyone or any
dy organisation actually harms anyone or anything.
craig
PS: some people deserve to be offended. those who get outraged by
moronic parody crap are amongst them.
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Faith, n. Belief without evidence in what is told by one who speaks
without knowle
and nobody has any power over anyone else.
but you've got to feel sorry for walther - after all, he's a member of
that most oppressed of minorities: white male middle-class christians.
apart from 90+% of the world's wealth and power and opportunities,
they've got nothing,
the latter?
as a neo-nazi propagandist, how quickly will you add nazi logos and
propaganda to the debian.org web site if you are elected as DPL?
how do you reconcile your overt anti-semitism with the fact that, as a
christian, you worship a jew?
craig
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On Mon, Feb 13, 2006 at 08:07:48PM -0700, Hubert Chan wrote:
> On Tue, 14 Feb 2006 10:38:57 +1100, Craig Sanders <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> said:
>
> >>> the GFDL has a similar provision. you can provide a link to an
> >>> internet address containing the full docum
On Mon, Feb 13, 2006 at 08:55:35PM -0500, Anthony DeRobertis wrote:
> Craig Sanders wrote:
>
> > the DFSG also allows that the modification may be by patch only.
>
> No, it does not.
yes it does.
> Quoting DFSG 4, with emphasis added:
> > The license may rest
containing the full document.
>
> Please show me where the GFDL has such a provision. The passage that
i've shown it before. i have no interest in playing your time-wasting
game. go read the archives.
craig
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On Mon, Feb 13, 2006 at 02:33:01PM -0800, Thomas Bushnell BSG wrote:
> Craig Sanders <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
>
> > bullshit. "freedom", as used by Debian, is explicitly defined in the
> > DFSG. the DFSG has a number of clauses detailing what we consider
&
only.
around and around the circle we go. the same stupid arguments, the same
old lies coming out of your keyboard.
craig
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ith or support it in any way, but at least it's not
dishonest. if debian wants to exclude stuff for convenience reasons,
then fair enough - but lying to pretend that the reason is that it's
non-free when it's really just inconvenient is inexcusable.
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craig sanders <[EMAIL
nses, but consider it beyond the
pale and non-free for the GFDL.
> But it gets even better. You don't even have to accompany the binary
> with the source itself. If you want, you can instead:
the GFDL has a similar provision. you can provide a link to an internet
address conta
y, and then build the package, so they
> can then do the same.
>
> In other words, I cannot distribute the modified version , I
> can only tell people how to modify it for themselves. DOes not quite
> meet the freedom requirement, in my view.
that qualifies as free a
On Mon, Feb 13, 2006 at 08:32:19PM +0100, Florian Weimer wrote:
> * Craig Sanders:
>
> > there's nothing in the GFDL that prevents you from doing that. the
> > capabilities of your medium are beyond the ability of the GFDL (or any
> > license) to control.
>
>
Of course, in this case, GFDL would prohibit sharing information. And
> people call that free?
no, the GFDL does not prohibit sharing information.
the GFDL, same as any other license, simply is not capable of granting
the power to do the physically impossible.
craig
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On Sun, Feb 12, 2006 at 06:28:34PM -0800, Thomas Bushnell BSG wrote:
> Craig Sanders <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
>
> > there's nothing in the GFDL that prevents you from doing that. the
> > capabilities of your medium are beyond the ability of the GFDL (or any
>
On Sun, Feb 12, 2006 at 05:19:37PM -0800, Thomas Bushnell BSG wrote:
> Craig Sanders <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
>
> > don't be an idiot. you only have to keep the invariant sections if you
> > are DISTRIBUTING a copy. you can do whatever you want with your own
&
ther non-english
language) that foreign language documents are non-free.
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ime of your
betters with your facile attempts at debate. your arguments are lame,
your examples are cretinous, and your "analogies" are just fucking
absurd. go find something more suited to your "talents". crayons,
perhaps.
craig
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On Mon, Feb 06, 2006 at 03:17:03PM -0800, Thomas Bushnell BSG wrote:
> Craig Sanders <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
>
> > no, code in a program could never be a secondary section. it is
> > inherently the "primary topic" of the work - which automatically
> > e
invariant sections. For
> example, to correct factual mistakes or express more correct opinions.
no, you do not put words in other people's mouths.
you add your "corrections" and make it clear that they are YOURS and not
the original author's.
craig
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On Sun, Feb 05, 2006 at 09:14:12PM -0600, Richard Darst wrote:
> On Mon, Feb 06, 2006 at 11:31:38AM +1100, Craig Sanders wrote:
>
> [the topic is invariant sections]
>
> > i challenge any of you zealots to come up with a REAL WORLD, PRACTICAL
> > proof that the GFDL
code in a program could never be a secondary section. it is
inherently the "primary topic" of the work - which automatically
excludes it from being secondary.
craig
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On Mon, Feb 06, 2006 at 09:49:51AM -0500, Zephaniah E. Hull wrote:
> On Mon, Feb 06, 2006 at 11:31:38AM +1100, Craig Sanders wrote:
> > i challenge any of you zealots to come up with a REAL WORLD, PRACTICAL
> > proof that the GFDL is non-free (and i mean actually non-free,
On Sun, Feb 05, 2006 at 05:55:54PM -0500, Zephaniah E. Hull wrote:
> On Mon, Feb 06, 2006 at 09:34:19AM +1100, Craig Sanders wrote:
> > so, your complaint is that if you delete the contents of the document,
> > then you can no longer change it?
> >
> > are you for real?
f i delete all
the lines of source code in a GPL program (leaving only the license and
copyright notice) then i can no longer change it. i can add to it, but i
can't change it. therefore the GPL is non-free.
and the same for EVERY other software license, too.
craig
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On Sat, Feb 04, 2006 at 04:42:41PM -0800, Thomas Bushnell BSG wrote:
> Craig Sanders <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
>
> > alternatively, print a single link to either the full documentation
> > (containing the invariant sections) or to just the invariant sections.
>
&
ge about
inconvenience.
on the other hand: bullshit! you don't have a right to falsely claim
that convenience issues are freedom issues.
craig
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On Fri, Feb 03, 2006 at 12:25:40AM +, MJ Ray wrote:
> Craig Sanders <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> > On Tue, Jan 31, 2006 at 05:22:39PM +, MJ Ray wrote:
> > > That's exactly why it's not similar to the things allowed by the
> > > patch clause. FDL is mor
against the GPL is still done today, either directly or via
the DFSG which was very strongly influenced by it.
craig
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On Thu, Feb 02, 2006 at 12:05:49PM +0200, Kalle Kivimaa wrote:
> Craig Sanders <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
> > there's no law that specifically states you can't remove a credit or
> > copyright notice, either - it's just convention AND the fact that
This paragraph does your argument no credit.
why? because i tell it like it is? and don't let unreasonable zealots
hide behind a flimsy facade of being rational human beings?
craig
ps: do i think GFDL Invariant Sections are a good thing? no, i don't.
it's just that i don't th
ally special cases which can be ignored for the purposes
of the DFSG (mostly because even they realise they can't completely
ignore their existence without losing what few shreds of credibility
they have), but they're seriously reality-challenged.
craig
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k, as it is currently stated. (I do not consider the
> license to be part of the work).
no, it's not necessary to change anything.
DFSG patch clause.
read it.
explains all.
restricting modifications to original + patch only is explicitly
permitted.
craig
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On Tue, Jan 31, 2006 at 05:22:39PM +, MJ Ray wrote:
> Craig Sanders <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> [...]
> > the "patch" to the opinions/rants/whatever in an invariant section
> > does not change that invariant section (it can't change, it's
> > *INVARIANT
oing to make such a claim then back it up with
reasoning, logic, and evidence. you might think that makes it non-free
but you've provided no reason for anyone to accept your opinion.
an unsupported assertion is worthless.
craig
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27;s *INVARIANT*).
It adds a NEW invariant section which makes whatever point the 'patcher'
wants to make. the new section may add to or clarify the original inv.
sec. or it may discredit it or subvert it or argue against it. or it may
be about something else entirely. it could ev
ight/credit notices or opinion
or rants or other stuff irrelevant (or, at best, only tangentially
relevant) to the topic of the document. they are not and never can be
the primary topic of a GFDL document.
absurdity like that is a common pattern with the zealots' dogma. they'll
make some
tware in the form of original work +
patch file. very inconvenient. in fact, a complete PITA, especially for
the user. yet that is explicitly defined as being free in the DFSG.
feel free to ignore this fact - it's based in reality and doesn't
conform to your loony zealot prejudices.
craig
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m to be a lot of these windup dolls in here...maybe you're
all under the misapprehension that it's in some way "clever" to quote
someone's words back at them. or maybe you're all irony-challenged
americans and think that that constitutes irony.
craig
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On Mon, Jan 30, 2006 at 04:12:09PM +0100, Wouter Verhelst wrote:
> On Tue, Jan 31, 2006 at 01:34:45AM +1100, Craig Sanders wrote:
> > On Mon, Jan 30, 2006 at 01:08:36PM +0100, Wouter Verhelst wrote:
> > > I'm willing to debate whatever you want to debate about the GFDL, but
ariant section - but you can only do so
> by adding a new section that subverts or refutes or simply adds
> to the invariant section." (Craig Sanders, January 2005)
> vs
> "If it is modified, it does not do its job." (RMS, May 2003)
>
> and so on and so for
On Mon, Jan 30, 2006 at 10:24:17AM +, MJ Ray wrote:
> Craig Sanders wrote:
> > as has been pointed out hundreds of times before, there are several
> > other situations where neither the DFSG nor the debian project require
> > modifiability - license texts and copyright
On Mon, Jan 30, 2006 at 01:08:36PM +0100, Wouter Verhelst wrote:
> On Mon, Jan 30, 2006 at 09:24:15AM +1100, Craig Sanders wrote:
> > GIVE. IT. A. FUCKING. REST!
>
> Craig,
>
> I'm willing to debate whatever you want to debate about the GFDL, but
> not with insults
On Mon, Jan 30, 2006 at 02:37:05AM +0200, Lars Wirzenius wrote:
> ma, 2006-01-30 kello 09:24 +1100, Craig Sanders kirjoitti:
> > only indirectly. the real point, which you missed, was to be an accurate
> > description of reality - something that, as an extremist nutcase, you
> &
On Sun, Jan 29, 2006 at 05:13:26PM +0100, Wouter Verhelst wrote:
> On Mon, Jan 30, 2006 at 12:09:55AM +1100, Craig Sanders wrote:
> > On Mon, Jan 23, 2006 at 02:29:38AM +0100, Wouter Verhelst wrote:
> > > On Mon, Jan 23, 2006 at 01:45:40AM +0200, Anton Zinoviev wrote:
> &g
ng this time. i've wasted more than enough of my
time on others like you in the past with nothing to show for it but an
increasing disillusionment and disgust with the debian organisation and
the extremist vermin who infest it. it's why i do little or nothing for
debian any more, and am unlikely to do so unless and until debian gets
some sanity back.
craig
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up by a bunch of extremist nutcases who want to force the
Free Software Foundation to do their bidding, no matter how idiotic.
these nutcases have been misusing the debian organisation in this and
similarly moronic ways for years. it's time to tell them where to go
and to stop turning debi
On Wed, May 26, 2004 at 12:52:46PM -0500, Branden Robinson wrote:
> On Mon, May 24, 2004 at 12:56:06PM +1000, Craig Sanders wrote:
> > On Sun, May 23, 2004 at 05:19:40PM +0200, Tore Anderson wrote:
> > > For Debian to be "100% Free Software", it first must be &
tend
that you can't understand a simple and obvious concept than it is to
acknowledge another point of view.
> I always assumed that there were no ambiguity, and that the Sarge RC
> policy deliberately violated the social contract on a few select issues,
nope.
craig
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to the tech
ctte.
you (and some others) just refused to listen.
craig
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ame can be said for those who voted against the
SC changes, they could anticipate the consequences of the change and voted
against it.
craig
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o insist that it isn't hypocrisy).
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e real world.
leave the guy alone. he's told you what he's willing and not willing to do,
and, whether you like it or not, he's not going to change his mind. there's no
point in harassing him.
oh...sorry...i forgot. this is debian-vote. pointless harassment and
bicker
now.
either the current wording of the SC is right, in which case we should follow
it; or it is wrong, in which case it should be reverted to the old wording
which wasn't so impractical and incovenient.
craig
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The next time you vote, remember
ortant thing is that the proposed action is clear and unambigous -
rescind GR 2004-003.
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The next time you vote, remember that "Regime change begins at home"
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ortant thing is that the proposed action is clear and unambigous -
rescind GR 2004-003.
craig
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The next time you vote, remember that "Regime change begins at home"
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ame appear but not seconding resolution, please approve
>the use of your name in this context. (Anthony Towns and Ian Jackson)
>If not OK, I will appreciate suggestion for the acceptable alternative.
>
> -----
ame appear but not seconding resolution, please approve
>the use of your name in this context. (Anthony Towns and Ian Jackson)
>If not OK, I will appreciate suggestion for the acceptable alternative.
>
> -----
and accusations, would you?
with anyone else i'd be inclined to ascribe this to a simple mistake or just
laziness, but your lying malice has been proven repeatedly.
craig
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The next time you vote, remember that "Regime change begins at home"
On Thu, Apr 29, 2004 at 03:47:05PM -0700, Thomas Bushnell, BSG wrote:
> Craig Sanders <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
>
> > On Thu, Apr 29, 2004 at 10:58:50AM -0700, Thomas Bushnell, BSG wrote:
> > > I don't believe my posts have been discourteous to Craig, but if
t;.
that's just insane zealotry - extremist ideology overriding rational behaviour.
craig
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and accusations, would you?
with anyone else i'd be inclined to ascribe this to a simple mistake or just
laziness, but your lying malice has been proven repeatedly.
craig
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The next time you vote, remember that "Regime change begins at home
say "who, me? couldn't be me,
butter wouldn't melt in my mouth".
craig
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The next time you vote, remember that "Regime change begins at home"
On Thu, Apr 29, 2004 at 03:47:05PM -0700, Thomas Bushnell, BSG wrote:
> Craig Sanders <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
>
> > On Thu, Apr 29, 2004 at 10:58:50AM -0700, Thomas Bushnell, BSG wrote:
> > > I don't believe my posts have been discourteous to Craig, but if
t;.
that's just insane zealotry - extremist ideology overriding rational behaviour.
craig
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say "who, me? couldn't be me,
butter wouldn't melt in my mouth".
craig
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On Thu, Apr 29, 2004 at 10:01:27AM +0200, Martin Schulze wrote:
> Craig Sanders wrote:
> > you obviously can't understand simple instructions. i'll give them to you
> > once
> > more just in case some faint glimmer of understanding manages to seep in:
> >
&
On Thu, Apr 29, 2004 at 12:15:43AM -0700, Thomas Bushnell, BSG wrote:
> Craig Sanders <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
>
> > no, it demonstrates that if you presume to insult me then i will
> > give at least as good as i get.
>
> [...]
>
> > do not attempt
On Wed, Apr 28, 2004 at 10:44:36PM -0700, Thomas Bushnell, BSG wrote:
> Craig Sanders <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
>
> > On Wed, Apr 28, 2004 at 08:58:02PM -0700, Thomas Bushnell, BSG wrote:
> > > Since you have shown yourself to be an unprincipled cad, the notion of
On Thu, Apr 29, 2004 at 10:01:27AM +0200, Martin Schulze wrote:
> Craig Sanders wrote:
> > you obviously can't understand simple instructions. i'll give them to you once
> > more just in case some faint glimmer of understanding manages to seep in:
> >
> > DO
On Thu, Apr 29, 2004 at 12:15:43AM -0700, Thomas Bushnell, BSG wrote:
> Craig Sanders <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
>
> > no, it demonstrates that if you presume to insult me then i will
> > give at least as good as i get.
>
> [...]
>
> > do not attempt
On Wed, Apr 28, 2004 at 08:58:02PM -0700, Thomas Bushnell, BSG wrote:
> Since you have shown yourself to be an unprincipled cad, the notion of
> you lecturing decent people about ethics is ironic in the extreme.
eat shit and die, you worthless low-life verminous bag of pus
craig
--
On Wed, Apr 28, 2004 at 10:44:36PM -0700, Thomas Bushnell, BSG wrote:
> Craig Sanders <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
>
> > On Wed, Apr 28, 2004 at 08:58:02PM -0700, Thomas Bushnell, BSG wrote:
> > > Since you have shown yourself to be an unprincipled cad, the notion of
On Wed, Apr 28, 2004 at 10:09:36PM -0500, Steve Langasek wrote:
> On Thu, Apr 29, 2004 at 09:45:18AM +1000, Craig Sanders wrote:
> > On Tue, Apr 27, 2004 at 08:41:35PM -0500, Steve Langasek wrote:
> > > The Debian Project,
>
> > > affirming its committment to princi
On Wed, Apr 28, 2004 at 08:58:02PM -0700, Thomas Bushnell, BSG wrote:
> Since you have shown yourself to be an unprincipled cad, the notion of
> you lecturing decent people about ethics is ironic in the extreme.
eat shit and die, you worthless low-life verminous bag of pus
craig
--
On Wed, Apr 28, 2004 at 05:19:08PM -0700, Thomas Bushnell, BSG wrote:
> Craig Sanders <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
>
> > i propose an amendment that deletes everything but clause 1 of this
> > proposal,
> > so that the entire proposal now reads:
> >
>
On Wed, Apr 28, 2004 at 10:09:36PM -0500, Steve Langasek wrote:
> On Thu, Apr 29, 2004 at 09:45:18AM +1000, Craig Sanders wrote:
> > On Tue, Apr 27, 2004 at 08:41:35PM -0500, Steve Langasek wrote:
> > > The Debian Project,
>
> > > affirming its committment to princi
On Wed, Apr 28, 2004 at 05:19:08PM -0700, Thomas Bushnell, BSG wrote:
> Craig Sanders <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
>
> > i propose an amendment that deletes everything but clause 1 of this proposal,
> > so that the entire proposal now reads:
> >
> >that t
his proposal,
so that the entire proposal now reads:
that the amendments to the Social Contract contained within the
General Resolution "Editorial Amendments To The Social Contract"
(2004 vote 003) be immediately rescinded.
craig
--
craig sanders <[EMAIL PROTEC
ised as
a minor "editorial change", so most developers assumed it wasn't very important
and ignored it.
i know that i almost did. i completely ignored the thread until after the
second call for votes...and even after that, i just read the proposal and
didn't bother readi
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