Question for Gustavo and Sam: bringing back the fun

Hi! This is for Gustavo and Sam, who have both stated in their campaigns that they want to bring back the fun to Debian. Now, I'm all for Debian being more fun, but I wonder: How do you plan to bring back the fun? What are the specific steps required to achieve such a goal? -- Besos, Marga -

Re: Question for Gustavo and Sam: bringing back the fun

On 3/13/07, Margarita Manterola <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: Hi! This is for Gustavo and Sam, who have both stated in their campaigns that they want to bring back the fun to Debian. Now, I'm all for Debian being more fun, but I wonder: How do you plan to bring back the fun? What are the specific

Re: Question for Gustavo and Sam: bringing back the fun

On Tue, Mar 13, 2007, Margarita Manterola wrote: > This is for Gustavo and Sam, who have both stated in their campaigns > that they want to bring back the fun to Debian. Now, I'm all for > Debian being more fun, but I wonder: > > How do you plan to bring back the fun? What are the specific steps

Re: Question for Gustavo and Sam: bringing back the fun

On 3/15/07, Sam Hocevar <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: My main approach to make it fun again to work on Debian is to reduce the frustration. You cannot have fun doing something if your contributions are ignored, if you cannot access the resources you need to do the work, if your administrative re

Re: Question for Gustavo and Sam: bringing back the fun

"Margarita Manterola" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > 1) flamewars: the constant bickering on mailing list is depressing, it > takes away a lot of time, and it gives the whole project a bad > reputation. I don't know what's worse, the bickering itself or the bickering about the bickering. Flamewars

Re: Question for Gustavo and Sam: bringing back the fun

On Thu, 15 Mar 2007, Julien BLACHE wrote: > "Margarita Manterola" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > 1) flamewars: the constant bickering on mailing list is depressing, it > > takes away a lot of time, and it gives the whole project a bad > > reputation. > > I don't know what's worse, the bickering

Re: Question for Gustavo and Sam: bringing back the fun

On Thu, Mar 15, 2007 at 03:50:32PM +0100, Raphael Hertzog wrote: > On Thu, 15 Mar 2007, Julien BLACHE wrote: > > "Margarita Manterola" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > > > 1) flamewars: the constant bickering on mailing list is depressing, it > > > takes away a lot of time, and it gives the whole

Re: Question for Gustavo and Sam: bringing back the fun

Raphael Hertzog <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: >> Flamewars are actually fun, when done properly. > "Having fun in a flamewar" is not the kind of fun we need to seek. > Because there's no reward for the project, only some self-satisfaction of > a few individuals. Actually I had in mind a couple of f

Re: Question for Gustavo and Sam: bringing back the fun

On Thu, Mar 15, 2007 at 11:15:03AM -0300, Margarita Manterola wrote: > On 3/15/07, Sam Hocevar <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > My main approach to make it fun again to work on Debian is to > >reduce the frustration. You cannot have fun doing something if your > >contributions are ignored, if yo

Re: Question for Gustavo and Sam: bringing back the fun

Julien BLACHE wrote: > I don't know what's worse, the bickering itself or the bickering about > the bickering. The bickering about the bickering about the bickering. Debian having a reputation for its flamewars seems to be a pretty clear indication of a problem. If it was "In Debian people discuss

Re: Question for Gustavo and Sam: bringing back the fun

On Thu, Mar 15, 2007, Julien BLACHE wrote: > Flamewars are actually fun, when done properly. Oh right; the fun part must be an omission on -- unless you meant the artistic type of flamewars. ;) -- Loïc Minier -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTEC

Re: Question for Gustavo and Sam: bringing back the fun

Thomas Viehmann <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Debian having a reputation for its flamewars seems to be a pretty clear > indication of a problem. If it was "In Debian people discuss > passionately and then make good decisions" it would be much less of a > problem than the current "Debian = endless f

Re: Question for Gustavo and Sam: bringing back the fun

On to, 2007-03-15 at 16:05 +0100, Pierre Habouzit wrote: > On Thu, Mar 15, 2007 at 11:15:03AM -0300, Margarita Manterola wrote: > > 1) flamewars: the constant bickering on mailing list is depressing, it > > takes away a lot of time, and it gives the whole project a bad > > reputation. > > FWIW y

Re: Question for Gustavo and Sam: bringing back the fun

On to, 2007-03-15 at 16:52 +0100, Julien BLACHE wrote: > The only thing that changed is that some people started bickering > about the flamewars. Ah yes, I remember that happening. In about 1995. -- sic transit discus mundi -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsu

Re: Question for Gustavo and Sam: bringing back the fun

Lars Wirzenius <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: >> FWIW you're not _forced_ either to read them, nor to participate. > > I've tried not participating or reading lists with large flame contents: > for significant parts of 2006 I did not read -devel and -project (for > instance). The result was that you

Re: Question for Gustavo and Sam: bringing back the fun

On Thu, Mar 15, 2007 at 07:37:35PM +0100, Julien BLACHE <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Lars Wirzenius <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > >> FWIW you're not _forced_ either to read them, nor to participate. > > > > I've tried not participating or reading lists with large flame contents: > > for signif

Re: Question for Gustavo and Sam: bringing back the fun

Le jeudi 15 mars 2007 à 19:43 +0200, Lars Wirzenius a écrit : > I've tried not participating or reading lists with large flame contents: > for significant parts of 2006 I did not read -devel and -project (for > instance). The result was that you're cut off from any sense of what the > project is do

Re: Question for Gustavo and Sam: bringing back the fun

On Thu, Mar 15, 2007 at 03:57:13PM +0100, Pierre Habouzit wrote: > > > Flamewars are actually fun, when done properly. > > Mailing list are a tool. We want constructive and rewarding discussions. > Humour (of lack of) is a quality. Having some is very rewarding in the > long term, as it allows

Re: Question for Gustavo and Sam: bringing back the fun

Le jeudi 15 mars 2007 à 15:19 -0700, Steve Langasek a écrit : > Many of us probably missed the humor because of the missing disclaimer > explaining "ha-ha, this was only a joke, I don't really think we should have > flamewars despite the fact that I'm frequently a rude jerk to others in the > proje

Re: Question for Gustavo and Sam: bringing back the fun

Thomas Viehmann <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Debian having a reputation for its flamewars seems to be a pretty clear > indication of a problem. If it was "In Debian people discuss > passionately and then make good decisions" it would be much less of a > problem than the current "Debian = endless fl

Re: Question for Gustavo and Sam: bringing back the fun

Steve Langasek <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Many of us probably missed the humor because of the missing disclaimer > explaining "ha-ha, this was only a joke, I don't really think we should have > flamewars despite the fact that I'm frequently a rude jerk to others in the > project." One person's r

Re: Question for Gustavo and Sam: bringing back the fun

Le vendredi 16 mars 2007 à 10:27 +, MJ Ray a écrit : > It's sort of disappointing how much less trouble I've had since adding such > disclaimers to the end of emails containing jokes. There seem to be far too > many starched attitudes around. Ah, thanks. I was looking for a translation of the

Re: Question for Gustavo and Sam: bringing back the fun

On Thu, 2007-03-15 at 15:59 +0100, Julien BLACHE wrote: > Raphael Hertzog <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > >> Flamewars are actually fun, when done properly. > > > "Having fun in a flamewar" is not the kind of fun we need to seek. > > Because there's no reward for the project, only some self-satisf

Re: Question for Gustavo and Sam: bringing back the fun

Hi, On Sunday 18 March 2007 02:16, Ben Hutchings wrote: > We need to be careful to make that tone explicit when writing > email, even at the risk of being unsubtle. This is particularly > important when writing in one's second language (something which I am > very glad I do not have to attempt).

Re: Question for Gustavo and Sam: bringing back the fun

[I hope that continuing vote discussions after voting begins is fine] Margarita Manterola wrote: > On 3/15/07, Sam Hocevar <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > >>My main approach to make it fun again to work on Debian is to >> reduce the frustration. You cannot have fun doing something if your >> con

Re: Question for Gustavo and Sam: bringing back the fun

Aigars Mahinovs wrote: > Flamewars are good if the discussions are based on facts. Lately most > flamewars in Debian were on opinions, not on facts. I think it would be useful if we only used the term "flamewar" for threads that contain actual flaming. The current alternate usage of "flamewar" for