I've been very happy with stable and trunk Metacity with compositing
enabled, but the 2-3 second pause to redraw windows when changing
workspaces is really staggering.
On Thu, 2008-06-26 at 17:43 +0200, Patryk Zawadzki wrote:
> > Metacity's compositor works pretty well here except for slow worksp
On Fri, 2008-06-27 at 00:05 +0200, Rodrigo Moya wrote:
> of course, instead of supporting XSMP, we could try to get KDE use
> William's new implementation
Even that will take time. They still have a lot of work to finish
porting apps to KDE4[1]. So while this is a good idea, it should be made
sure
On Fri, 2008-06-27 at 00:59 +0200, Patryk Zawadzki wrote:
> Well even if you try to read just a 10k file you can get stuck if
> another application is causing excessive IO (and I tend to run such
> applications). It's hard to delegate each disk operation to a separate
> thread just in case the comp
On Fri, 2008-06-27 at 01:08 +0200, Frederic Peters wrote:
> David Zeuthen wrote:
>
> > > Yes we do; at least I believe so. I won't complain about my xterms as
> > > they may be considered a legacy application but modern applications
> > > written for the other major free desktop should not be lef
On Thu, Jun 26, 2008 at 11:59 PM, Patryk Zawadzki <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> Well even if you try to read just a 10k file you can get stuck if
> another application is causing excessive IO (and I tend to run such
> applications). It's hard to delegate each disk operation to a separate
> thread
David Zeuthen wrote:
> > Yes we do; at least I believe so. I won't complain about my xterms as
> > they may be considered a legacy application but modern applications
> > written for the other major free desktop should not be left in the
> > cold.
>
> Do you have a concrete example of a modern d
On Fri, Jun 27, 2008 at 12:51 AM, Iain * <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> On Thu, Jun 26, 2008 at 11:34 PM, Patryk Zawadzki <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
>> Exactly - that's the most common scenario - app X is bound to IO and
>> it won't receive redraw requests until another app stops trashing the
>> di
On Thu, Jun 26, 2008 at 11:34 PM, Patryk Zawadzki <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Exactly - that's the most common scenario - app X is bound to IO and
> it won't receive redraw requests until another app stops trashing the
> disk.
I'd suggest that thats a broken application that should be fixed,
rat
On Fri, Jun 27, 2008 at 12:08 AM, Bastien Nocera <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> I think Patryk was thinking more of the case where the application
> "hangs" and doesn't redraw. Which looks really bad. Compositors fix
> that.
Exactly - that's the most common scenario - app X is bound to IO and
it won
On Thu, 2008-06-26 at 23:46 +0200, Frederic Peters wrote:
> Yes we do; at least I believe so. I won't complain about my xterms as
> they may be considered a legacy application but modern applications
> written for the other major free desktop should not be left in the
> cold.
Do you have a concre
On Thu, 2008-06-26 at 23:02 +0100, Iain * wrote:
> On Thu, Jun 26, 2008 at 10:49 PM, Patryk Zawadzki <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > Nah, one thing about a compositor is that it keeps off-screen copies
> > of all the windows so it does not have to invalidate regions when the
> > stacking order ch
On Thu, 2008-06-26 at 23:02 +0100, Iain * wrote:
> On Thu, Jun 26, 2008 at 10:49 PM, Patryk Zawadzki <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > Nah, one thing about a compositor is that it keeps off-screen copies
> > of all the windows so it does not have to invalidate regions when the
> > stacking order ch
William Jon McCann wrote:
Hi,
Dan Winship and Lucas Rocha have done a nice job revamping the
gnome-session codebase. It was a meritorious task. You can read
about the design here:
http://live.gnome.org/SessionManagement/NewGnomeSession
The new code is much cleaner. Parts of the new design ar
On Thu, 2008-06-26 at 12:40 -0400, David Zeuthen wrote:
> On Thu, 2008-06-26 at 14:16 +0200, Rodrigo Moya wrote:
> > KDE applications are still using XSMP AFAIK, so we'll need to support
> > it in some way
>
> We do? What happens if we decide not to?
>
well, we'll get tons of bug reports about KD
On Thu, Jun 26, 2008 at 10:49 PM, Patryk Zawadzki <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Nah, one thing about a compositor is that it keeps off-screen copies
> of all the windows so it does not have to invalidate regions when the
> stacking order changes.
To be totally honest, I've never really thought of
On Thu, Jun 26, 2008 at 11:41 PM, Iain * <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> On Thu, Jun 26, 2008 at 6:13 PM, Patryk Zawadzki <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>> I'd say for me the only essential feature of a compositor is not
>> watching the goddamn windows redraw each time you switch apps and
>> workspaces.
>
David Zeuthen wrote:
> > KDE applications are still using XSMP AFAIK, so we'll need to support
> > it in some way
>
> We do? What happens if we decide not to?
Yes we do; at least I believe so. I won't complain about my xterms as
they may be considered a legacy application but modern application
On Thu, Jun 26, 2008 at 6:09 PM, Karl Lattimer <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Have you looked at xcompmgr? it might be a good starting point. I have
> somewhere a hacked up version of xcompmgr which has some extra features.
> Let me know if you'd like it.
Good idea, wish I'd thought of that first..
On Thu, Jun 26, 2008 at 6:13 PM, Patryk Zawadzki <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> I'd say for me the only essential feature of a compositor is not
> watching the goddamn windows redraw each time you switch apps and
> workspaces.
Then you don't need a compositor
Turn it off. problem solved.
__
Am Donnerstag, den 26.06.2008, 17:25 +0100 schrieb Iain *:
> 2008/6/26 Mathias Hasselmann <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:
> > Am Donnerstag, den 26.06.2008, 15:28 +0100 schrieb Alexander Jones:
> >> Agreed, we need to move towards expecting Composited as default and
> >> Direct as a niche case, but this was j
On Thu, 2008-06-26 at 18:02 +0100, Alan Cox wrote:
> It's far from an edge case. Any situation with two monitors side by side
> of > 1024 pixel width causes the problem. Thats a pretty normal setup for
> anyone doing art & design, engineering or similar work.
Indeed.
> (And yes I agree the hardwa
2008/6/26 Mathias Hasselmann <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:
> Laptop with 1280x768 wides screen LCD plus external monitor or projector
> with 1024x768 resolution gives 2304x768 pixels. This setup absolutely
> doesn't look exotic for me, but requires more than 2048 horizontal
> pixels. When writing this I am
Am Donnerstag, den 26.06.2008, 17:55 +0200 schrieb Dave Neary:
> Hi,
>
> Jürg Billeter wrote:
> > I really want compositing but I can't use a GL-based one
> > on all systems, as for example even with some recent Intel desktop
> > mainboards you can't have DRI with a screen area larger than 2048x20
On 6/26/08, David Zeuthen <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> On Thu, 2008-06-26 at 14:16 +0200, Rodrigo Moya wrote:
> > KDE applications are still using XSMP AFAIK, so we'll need to support
> > it in some way
>
>
> We do? What happens if we decide not to?
>
Tell them we are now using a better idea and
On Thu, 2008-06-26 at 18:57 +0100, Ross Burton wrote:
> On Thu, 2008-06-26 at 20:09 +0300, Karl Lattimer wrote:
> > > I'm assuming you've turned on the appropriate xorg configuration
> > > options to enable the correct acceleration
> > > and none of that helped? I forget what they are, but I'm sure
On Thu, 2008-06-26 at 20:09 +0300, Karl Lattimer wrote:
> > I'm assuming you've turned on the appropriate xorg configuration
> > options to enable the correct acceleration
> > and none of that helped? I forget what they are, but I'm sure someone
> > will chime in.
>
> ching
>
> Section "Extension
> I don't mean to be impertinent, but isn't "any screen bigger than
> 2048x2048" a major edge case? It's like desktop apps that only work on
> screens bigger than 640x480... who cares at this stage? By the time
> that's anything bug an edge case, won't the hardware have caught up?
It's far from an
On Thu, 2008-06-26 at 17:25 +0100, Iain * wrote:
> 2008/6/26 Mathias Hasselmann <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:
> > Am Donnerstag, den 26.06.2008, 15:28 +0100 schrieb Alexander Jones:
> >> Agreed, we need to move towards expecting Composited as default and
> >> Direct as a niche case, but this was just an exa
On Thu, Jun 26, 2008 at 6:25 PM, Iain * <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> If you are one of those people with a crap graphics card (or drivers)
> I have been working on getting a strange hybrid compositor working
> that I'm assuming should be much faster
> so that you can have simple compositing to give
On Thu, 2008-06-26 at 14:16 +0200, Rodrigo Moya wrote:
> KDE applications are still using XSMP AFAIK, so we'll need to support
> it in some way
We do? What happens if we decide not to?
David
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2008/6/26 Mathias Hasselmann <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:
> Am Donnerstag, den 26.06.2008, 15:28 +0100 schrieb Alexander Jones:
>> Agreed, we need to move towards expecting Composited as default and
>> Direct as a niche case, but this was just an example. :)
>
> Guess Metacity's compositor needs to become
Hi,
On Thu, 2008-06-26 at 17:55 +0200, Dave Neary wrote:
> Jürg Billeter wrote:
> > I really want compositing but I can't use a GL-based one
> > on all systems, as for example even with some recent Intel desktop
> > mainboards you can't have DRI with a screen area larger than 2048x2048,
> > which
Hi,
Jürg Billeter wrote:
> I really want compositing but I can't use a GL-based one
> on all systems, as for example even with some recent Intel desktop
> mainboards you can't have DRI with a screen area larger than 2048x2048,
> which is easily reached with two monitors.
I don't mean to be imper
On Thu, Jun 26, 2008 at 5:37 PM, Jürg Billeter <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> On Thu, 2008-06-26 at 17:28 +0200, Patryk Zawadzki wrote:
>> * replacing the current compositor with a GL-based one; or
> Please don't. I really want compositing but I can't use a GL-based one
> on all systems, as for examp
On Thu, 2008-06-26 at 17:28 +0200, Patryk Zawadzki wrote:
> 2008/6/26 Mathias Hasselmann <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:
> > Am Donnerstag, den 26.06.2008, 15:28 +0100 schrieb Alexander Jones:
> >> Agreed, we need to move towards expecting Composited as default and
> >> Direct as a niche case, but this was ju
2008/6/26 Mathias Hasselmann <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:
> Am Donnerstag, den 26.06.2008, 15:28 +0100 schrieb Alexander Jones:
>> Agreed, we need to move towards expecting Composited as default and
>> Direct as a niche case, but this was just an example. :)
> Guess Metacity's compositor needs to become mu
Am Donnerstag, den 26.06.2008, 15:28 +0100 schrieb Alexander Jones:
> Agreed, we need to move towards expecting Composited as default and
> Direct as a niche case, but this was just an example. :)
Guess Metacity's compositor needs to become much faster first.
Activating its compositor introduces s
Agreed, we need to move towards expecting Composited as default and
Direct as a niche case, but this was just an example. :)
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On Thu, Jun 26, 2008 at 3:43 PM, Alexander Jones <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> * Currently, gnome-terminal starts up before the WM and if you run a
> compositing WM, you get an RGB window unless you close it and open it
> again.
That's because the gnome-terminal crew did an awesome job making sure
I'm sorry if I missed something (I just woke up and my eyes and brain
aren't at 100% yet)...
Doing the startup in phases like that sounds to me to be suboptimal.
If we're halting the startup of a whole "Desktop" (or even "Panel")
process just because we don't have a WM ready, it's going to add a l
> Apropos, since we are talking about session management here: have you
> guys ever thought of reuseíng upstart for managing session processes?
My thoughts exactly. We should at least talk to the upstart guys about
what code we can share.
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On Thu, 2008-06-26 at 12:41 +1200, Callum McKenzie wrote:
> On Thu, June 26, 2008 11:07 am, William Jon McCann wrote:
> >
> > I don't think these are sufficient reasons to continue to solely rely
> > on XSMP. We can do these very well using D-Bus.
> >
> Can I assume from your use of the word "sole
On Wed, 2008-06-25 at 19:07 -0400, William Jon McCann wrote:
> Hi,
>
> Dan Winship and Lucas Rocha have done a nice job revamping the
> gnome-session codebase. It was a meritorious task. You can read
> about the design here:
> http://live.gnome.org/SessionManagement/NewGnomeSession
>
> What do
Thanks for your email, I just asked yesterday morning Vincent about
the status of the dbus-based branch and this answers my questions.
William Jon McCann wrote:
> I agree with that. Logout handling is broken too. The XSMP protocol
> not only allows applications to be notified on logout (aka shu
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