Re: D2 port of xfBuild (alpha version)

2011-11-30 Thread torhu
On 30.11.2011 08:15, Jacob Carlborg wrote: On 2011-11-29 22:14, torhu wrote: On 29.11.2011 13:20, Jacob Carlborg wrote: On 2011-11-29 12:00, Andrej Mitrovic wrote: FWIW a couple of bugs from the old issue tracker were fixed in the new fork. Bugs were reported here:

Re: D2 port of xfBuild (alpha version)

2011-11-30 Thread Joel Christensen
Hi, I'm trying to get xfbuild working. First I found with WindowsAPI the line 70 of directx\d3d9.d has an error. But fixing it I run into another problem: Cannot use win32.winsock without Win32_Winsock1 defined. winsock.d(31): Error: static assert (false) is false I'm not sure where

Re: D2 port of xfBuild (alpha version)

2011-11-30 Thread Andrej Mitrovic
I knew I should have just distributed win32 with xfbuild. Someone screwed up the API headers. I'll distribute the API with xfbuild in a few minutes. Thanks for letting me know about this.

Re: D2 port of xfBuild (alpha version)

2011-11-30 Thread Andrej Mitrovic
Or maybe I just cut off the directx stuff. Heh, maybe I'm to blame. Anyway I'll fix this shortly.

Xinok Sort - December 2011

2011-11-30 Thread Xinok
I've released a few updates for my sorting algorithm in the past month. https://sourceforge.net/projects/xinoksort/ Major changes: * Added concurrency using taskPool * Use any callable type as predicate (functions, delegates) * Unittests * Documentation * Minor optimizations I have a few more

Re: D2 port of xfBuild (alpha version)

2011-11-30 Thread Andrej Mitrovic
Ok it should work now.

Re: Xinok Sort - December 2011

2011-11-30 Thread Andrej Mitrovic
Add @property to front/back/popFront/popBack/empty/save. Also popFront/popBack need to be void return type.

Re: Xinok Sort - December 2011

2011-11-30 Thread Xinok
On 11/30/2011 8:45 PM, Andrej Mitrovic wrote: Add @property to front/back/popFront/popBack/empty/save. Also popFront/popBack need to be void return type. Thanks. I was missing @property, the void return type was a mistake. After fixing some bugs, the code is working but the benchmarks are

Re: D2 port of xfBuild (alpha version)

2011-11-30 Thread Jacob Carlborg
On 2011-11-30 21:13, torhu wrote: Maybe this is about something else than I was thinking of. I was thinking of the linker errors you will get if you do partial rebuilds. Missing symbols for struct initializers and things like that. And templates too, I guess. Can't remember the details anymore.

Re: D2 port of xfBuild (alpha version)

2011-11-30 Thread Joel Christensen
On 01-Dec-11 2:28 PM, Andrej Mitrovic wrote: Ok it should work now. Thanks Andrej. Works now. Or, I have to change how StopWatch (std.datetime) works in my programs, because putting '*.start;' twice fails an assert. Also, it doesn't seem to work with Visual D. One of my programs uses it

Re: A real Forum for D

2011-11-30 Thread Abrahm
Jude 10equa...@gmail.com wrote in message news:javc93$oba$1...@digitalmars.com... -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 On 11/28/2011 12:12 AM, Walter Bright wrote: Generally, they suck. They just don't get what a threaded view is. Newsreaders solved this problem decades ago. A

Re: Java Scala

2011-11-30 Thread Walter Bright
On 11/29/2011 11:42 PM, Jacob Carlborg wrote: I think it has something to do with Scala trying to be compatible with Java. It has to run on the JVM, which is a large and heavy rock.

Re: A real Forum for D

2011-11-30 Thread Abrahm
Jude 10equa...@gmail.com wrote in message news:javfjp$120g$1...@digitalmars.com... And I'm just sick of it. The world is black and white. Have you ever heard someone say: The first answer is always NO? Ideas are like.. well, everyone.. nevermind that. Web forum for D is just an idea. Not a

Re: Java Scala

2011-11-30 Thread Walter Bright
On 11/29/2011 11:46 PM, Jacob Carlborg wrote: I agree. The shared library problem is blocked by DMD not being able to correctly generate PIC. The compiler does correctly generate PIC code on Linux. The problem is nobody has figured out the details of making Phobos/Druntime a shared library.

Re: Is D more cryptic than C++?

2011-11-30 Thread Adam Wilson
On Tue, 29 Nov 2011 22:30:21 -0800, Abrahm abe2...@nospam.net wrote: I get the feeling that it is from reading the threads in here. Is there somewhere that has non-trivial D and C++ code that does the same thing, side by side, so that I can evaluate D better? Links if you got 'em please. Maybe

Re: Java Scala

2011-11-30 Thread Russel Winder
Walter, On Wed, 2011-11-30 at 00:17 -0800, Walter Bright wrote: On 11/29/2011 11:42 PM, Jacob Carlborg wrote: I think it has something to do with Scala trying to be compatible with Java. It has to run on the JVM, which is a large and heavy rock. I think only response possible to this is

Re: Java Scala

2011-11-30 Thread Russel Winder
On Wed, 2011-11-30 at 08:42 +0100, Jacob Carlborg wrote: [...] I wonder to what extent the inefficiencies he mentioned (such as the lambdas being sugar for anon classes) could be due to the JVM itself. Or if the reason is primarily something else, such as something about Scala's internal

Re: A real Forum for D

2011-11-30 Thread Abrahm
Walter Bright newshou...@digitalmars.com wrote in message news:javogj$1mc1$2...@digitalmars.com... On 11/27/2011 11:36 PM, Vladimir Panteleev wrote: Imagine being used to a user interface idiom which you perceive as vastly more productive, and then have most of the world use a dumbed-down

Re: Java Scala

2011-11-30 Thread Walter Bright
On 11/30/2011 12:29 AM, Russel Winder wrote: Walter, On Wed, 2011-11-30 at 00:17 -0800, Walter Bright wrote: On 11/29/2011 11:42 PM, Jacob Carlborg wrote: I think it has something to do with Scala trying to be compatible with Java. It has to run on the JVM, which is a large and heavy rock.

Re: A real Forum for D

2011-11-30 Thread Abrahm
Jude 10equa...@gmail.com wrote in message news:javh6n$19tn$1...@digitalmars.com... -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 On 11/28/2011 02:10 AM, so wrote: On Mon, 28 Nov 2011 09:11:35 +0200, Jude 10equa...@gmail.com wrote: Forums are lame and just DON'T GET IT and I don't like

Re: A real Forum for D

2011-11-30 Thread Abrahm
so s...@so.so wrote in message news:op.v5ne4zhympw3zg@localhost.localdomain... Everything boils down to one thing IMO, Don't you worry your pretty little head. A web forum for you is on its way! (I couldn't resist. I'm not laughing at you, I'm laughing with you, please realize). Abe

Re: Is D more cryptic than C++?

2011-11-30 Thread bearophile
Abrahm: D is a bigger and more complex language compared to Java. And D gives more freedom compared to Java, so it's a bit easier to write D2 code that's unreadable compared to Java. But compared to C++ I think D code is a bit less cryptic because some of idioms of good C++ are language

Re: A real Forum for D

2011-11-30 Thread Abrahm
Bane branimir.milosavlje...@gmail.com wrote in message news:javrug$1ua9$1...@digitalmars.com... so Wrote: Its all about money. There is more. Power (many kinds, such as the ability to land the supermodel for some heavy bonking, e.g., or the ability to con the sheeple). Ego is another.

Re: Is D more cryptic than C++?

2011-11-30 Thread Peter Alexander
On 30/11/11 6:30 AM, Abrahm wrote: I get the feeling that it is from reading the threads in here. Is there somewhere that has non-trivial D and C++ code that does the same thing, side by side, so that I can evaluate D better? Links if you got 'em please. Maybe even a small entire application

Re: A real Forum for D

2011-11-30 Thread Abrahm
Walter Bright newshou...@digitalmars.com wrote in message news:javobv$1mc1$1...@digitalmars.com... On 11/27/2011 11:11 PM, Jude wrote: I have yet to see a 'valid' reason against having a forum. It splits our community into two groups that likely won't communicate with each other. That is

Re: A real Forum for D

2011-11-30 Thread Abrahm
Gour g...@atmarama.net wrote in message news:2029095421.25754...@atmarama.noip.me... -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 On Mon, 28 Nov 2011 01:11:35 -0600 Jude 10equa...@gmail.com wrote: If you think that it would split the community too much, speak your mind. This is my

Re: A real Forum for D

2011-11-30 Thread Abrahm
Kagamin s...@here.lot wrote in message news:jb0rs3$18c5$1...@digitalmars.com... In forum you already have all messages before your eyes. Scroll, scroll, scroll! It's like writing a letter to someone on a remote 10 mile stretch of highway instead of on stationary put in an envelop delivered

Re: A real Forum for D

2011-11-30 Thread Abrahm
Unknown W. Brackets usefirstnameinstead-newsgr...@unknownbrackets.org wrote in message news:jb20c4$2ue$4...@digitalmars.com... I'm not alone. Tons of other people have abandoned this artificial communication format, not because they're stupid or the masses or they don't get it, but simply

Re: A real Forum for D

2011-11-30 Thread Abrahm
Unknown W. Brackets usefirstnameinstead-newsgr...@unknownbrackets.org wrote in message news:jb20c4$2ue$4...@digitalmars.com... And let's be honest. When people ask for web based forums, they're not talking about putting a threaded interface up. Gen Yers who don't know anything else?

Re: A real Forum for D

2011-11-30 Thread Abrahm
Unknown W. Brackets usefirstnameinstead-newsgr...@unknownbrackets.org wrote in message news:jb2760$gtg$1...@digitalmars.com... I've definitely used threaded conversation in the past. In fact, I used to think it was much better than linear, quite so. But, then I used linear for quite some

Re: Java Scala

2011-11-30 Thread Marco Leise
Am 30.11.2011, 08:21 Uhr, schrieb Paulo Pinto pj...@progtools.org: Quite an interesting read, but I cannot stop to think than again is one of the typical blame the tool thing. In my line of business we only allow employees with proper university background to enter the company, and even

Re: A real Forum for D

2011-11-30 Thread Abrahm
Jimmy Cao jcao...@gmail.com wrote in message news:mailman.1131.1322426097.24802.digitalmar...@puremagic.com... Everything is moving to the cloud and to the web. A scientific study of avg IQ of D NG vs. D web forum participants please.

Re: A real Forum for D

2011-11-30 Thread Abrahm
Jimmy Cao jcao...@gmail.com wrote in message news:mailman.1131.1322426097.24802.digitalmar...@puremagic.com... Why are online bulletin boards/forums attractive? You mean why are they attractive to the masses? Um, because they have been designed to reel-in the masses (sheeple)? Where the

Re: extern(C++) and struct (constness mangling problem ?)

2011-11-30 Thread deadalnix
Le 29/11/2011 23:06, Timon Gehr a écrit : On 11/29/2011 10:46 PM, deadalnix wrote: Le 29/11/2011 22:09, Andrei Alexandrescu a écrit : On 11/29/11 11:39 AM, deadalnix wrote: Le 29/11/2011 19:52, Andrei Alexandrescu a écrit : On 11/29/11 10:50 AM, deadalnix wrote: 2/ Use that stract/class as

Re: A real Forum for D

2011-11-30 Thread Abrahm
Walter Bright newshou...@digitalmars.com wrote in message news:javpdo$1o4p$1...@digitalmars.com... I rarely bother to load a topic more than once because of this. Same goes for reddit. I consider web forums a read-once medium. I cut-paste-save anything pertinent. Posting on /. for example.

Re: extern(C++) and struct (constness mangling problem ?)

2011-11-30 Thread deadalnix
Le 30/11/2011 03:07, Andrei Alexandrescu a écrit : On 11/29/11 2:22 PM, Timon Gehr wrote: The default initializer can easily be disabled: struct S{ int x; @disable this(); @disable void[0] init; @disable this(this); } Now nobody can do auto x = S.init; @disable void[0] init; Sound hacky as

Re: A real Forum for D

2011-11-30 Thread Abrahm
Walter Bright newshou...@digitalmars.com wrote in message news:jb24lj$c8q$2...@digitalmars.com... On 11/28/2011 11:08 PM, Unknown W. Brackets wrote: In contrast, I haven't a clue how to use NNTP on my iPhone. Go figure. There is an NNTP newsreader app on the iphone, but the reviews on it

Re: A real Forum for D

2011-11-30 Thread Abrahm
Kai Meyer k...@unixlords.com wrote in message news:jb3imi$1koq$1...@digitalmars.com... I think converting D.learn to a Forum could benefit the community by being more attractive to younger/newer programmers. When they want to get serious, they can spend the 10 minutes it takes to configure an

Re: A real Forum for D

2011-11-30 Thread Abrahm
so s...@so.so wrote in message news:op.v5ndl1yvmpw3zg@localhost.localdomain... Nobody is against web interface I probably am, but maybe not for D. I'd have to see the TOS first.

Re: A real Forum for D

2011-11-30 Thread Abrahm
so s...@so.so wrote in message news:op.v5ndl1yvmpw3zg@localhost.localdomain... Nobody is against web interface and we also have it (ugly and sometimes useless but we still do), what we are against is the replacement of newsgroups with something lesser like forums. Is there a list of

Re: Please remove misleading examples from D's website

2011-11-30 Thread maarten van damme
I don't know about the examples you mentioned but I agree. Last time I tried shared still didn't work and having not working examples not only leads to a lot of confusion but also on people disliking a perfectly fine language

Re: Is D more cryptic than C++?

2011-11-30 Thread Abrahm
Adam Wilson flybo...@gmail.com wrote in message news:op.v5q2zgji707...@invictus.skynet.com... On Tue, 29 Nov 2011 22:30:21 -0800, Abrahm abe2...@nospam.net wrote: I get the feeling that it is from reading the threads in here. Is there somewhere that has non-trivial D and C++ code that does

Re: Is D more cryptic than C++?

2011-11-30 Thread Abrahm
Peter Alexander peter.alexander...@gmail.com wrote in message news:jb4sjp$1dnr$1...@digitalmars.com... On 30/11/11 6:30 AM, Abrahm wrote: I get the feeling that it is from reading the threads in here. Is there somewhere that has non-trivial D and C++ code that does the same thing, side

Re: Is D more cryptic than C++?

2011-11-30 Thread Abrahm
bearophile bearophileh...@lycos.com wrote in message news:jb4rgv$1bi1$1...@digitalmars.com... Abrahm: D is a bigger and more complex language compared to Java. And D gives more freedom compared to Java, so it's a bit easier to write D2 code that's unreadable compared to Java. But compared

Re: Is D more cryptic than C++?

2011-11-30 Thread bearophile
Abrahm: I don't think I like that. D's 'sort' is some kind of construct instead of a function? It's essentially a function template. Not intuitive at all. Seemingly incorrect from a design standpoint (but I'm not thinking about it heavily). Better getting used to that kind of D code :-)

Re: Is D more cryptic than C++?

2011-11-30 Thread bearophile
Abrahm: An easy to grok small app, but non-trivial and using a number of D features would be ideal. I see. What kind of app do you prefer? Bye, bearophile

Re: Is D more cryptic than C++?

2011-11-30 Thread Abrahm
bearophile bearophileh...@lycos.com wrote in message news:jb566l$20rr$1...@digitalmars.com... Abrahm: I don't think I like that. D's 'sort' is some kind of construct instead of a function? It's essentially a function template. OK. Whatever it is though, it doesn't look like language

Re: Java Scala

2011-11-30 Thread Jacob Carlborg
On 2011-11-30 09:19, Walter Bright wrote: On 11/29/2011 11:46 PM, Jacob Carlborg wrote: I agree. The shared library problem is blocked by DMD not being able to correctly generate PIC. The compiler does correctly generate PIC code on Linux. So you're saying this issue has already been fixed:

Re: Is D more cryptic than C++?

2011-11-30 Thread Abrahm
bearophile bearophileh...@lycos.com wrote in message news:jb56j2$21g4$1...@digitalmars.com... Abrahm: An easy to grok small app, but non-trivial and using a number of D features would be ideal. I see. What kind of app do you prefer? Anything high-level. A weird request in a systems

Re: Is D more cryptic than C++?

2011-11-30 Thread simendsjo
On 30.11.2011 13:20, Abrahm wrote: A small commandline utility would work too. Take a look at rdmd: https://github.com/D-Programming-Language/tools

Re: extern(C++) and struct (constness mangling problem ?)

2011-11-30 Thread Timon Gehr
On 11/30/2011 11:57 AM, deadalnix wrote: Le 30/11/2011 03:07, Andrei Alexandrescu a écrit : On 11/29/11 2:22 PM, Timon Gehr wrote: The default initializer can easily be disabled: struct S{ int x; @disable this(); @disable void[0] init; @disable this(this); } Now nobody can do auto x =

Re: extern(C++) and struct (constness mangling problem ?)

2011-11-30 Thread deadalnix
Le 30/11/2011 13:30, Timon Gehr a écrit : On 11/30/2011 11:57 AM, deadalnix wrote: Le 30/11/2011 03:07, Andrei Alexandrescu a écrit : On 11/29/11 2:22 PM, Timon Gehr wrote: The default initializer can easily be disabled: struct S{ int x; @disable this(); @disable void[0] init; @disable

Re: Is D more cryptic than C++?

2011-11-30 Thread Timon Gehr
On 11/30/2011 12:57 PM, Abrahm wrote: Peter Alexanderpeter.alexander...@gmail.com wrote in message news:jb4sjp$1dnr$1...@digitalmars.com... On 30/11/11 6:30 AM, Abrahm wrote: I get the feeling that it is from reading the threads in here. Is there somewhere that has non-trivial D and C++ code

Re: Is D more cryptic than C++?

2011-11-30 Thread Timon Gehr
On 11/30/2011 01:14 PM, Abrahm wrote: bearophilebearophileh...@lycos.com wrote in message news:jb566l$20rr$1...@digitalmars.com... Abrahm: I don't think I like that. D's 'sort' is some kind of construct instead of a function? It's essentially a function template. OK. Whatever it is

Re: Please remove misleading examples from D's website

2011-11-30 Thread Trass3r
Mehrdad Wrote: Please remove this from the home page: // Automatic or explicit memory management delete cl; It is obviously not doing what it implies. Similarly, please remove Allocating Class Instances On The Stack from the memory.html page: scope c = new C(); // c is

Re: extern(C++) and struct (constness mangling problem ?)

2011-11-30 Thread Timon Gehr
On 11/30/2011 01:54 PM, deadalnix wrote: Le 30/11/2011 13:30, Timon Gehr a écrit : On 11/30/2011 11:57 AM, deadalnix wrote: Le 30/11/2011 03:07, Andrei Alexandrescu a écrit : On 11/29/11 2:22 PM, Timon Gehr wrote: The default initializer can easily be disabled: struct S{ int x; @disable

Re: Java Scala

2011-11-30 Thread Paulo Pinto
I am with Russel here. I work mostly in JVM and .Net environments and although currently I am the opinion that there are too many VM based applications, we hardly have any performance issues. When they do happen we are able to track them mostly to bad coding practices. JNI or P/Invoke are

Re: Is D more cryptic than C++?

2011-11-30 Thread Dejan Lekic
I think there is no need for a whole app. Take *any* D source code, and write the same code in C++, and you will understand. A nice summary about D: http://www.d-programming-language.org/new/

Re: Is D more cryptic than C++?

2011-11-30 Thread Dejan Lekic
*Any* project on http://.dsource.org ...

Re: Please remove misleading examples from D's website

2011-11-30 Thread Dejan Lekic
No please! Do not remove, but add a note that those are either deprecated or removed and what a developer should do with a modern implementation of D2!

Re: Java Scala

2011-11-30 Thread Dejan Lekic
There is also this article about similar thing. http://www.infoq.com/news/2011/11/yammer-scala As a Java programmer I can only say one thing - I hate Java shortcomings, but the simplicity pays off. Second, this is just one case of Scala - Java transition. I bet the number of Java-Scala

Re: Java Scala

2011-11-30 Thread Martin Nowak
On Wed, 30 Nov 2011 09:19:59 +0100, Walter Bright newshou...@digitalmars.com wrote: On 11/29/2011 11:46 PM, Jacob Carlborg wrote: I agree. The shared library problem is blocked by DMD not being able to correctly generate PIC. The compiler does correctly generate PIC code on Linux. The

Re: Java Scala

2011-11-30 Thread Regan Heath
On Wed, 30 Nov 2011 14:46:10 -, Paulo Pinto pj...@progtools.org wrote: I am with Russel here. I work mostly in JVM and .Net environments and although currently I am the opinion that there are too many VM based applications, we hardly have any performance issues. Then you're not doing

Re: Please remove misleading examples from D's website

2011-11-30 Thread Mehrdad
On 11/30/2011 7:07 AM, Dejan Lekic wrote: No please! Do not remove, but add a note that those are either deprecated or removed and what a developer should do with a modern implementation of D2! Uhm, what? Deprecated means that the feature is still usable, but discouraged. 'delete' and 'scope'

Re: Please remove misleading examples from D's website

2011-11-30 Thread Mehrdad
On 11/30/2011 5:33 AM, Trass3r wrote: Mehrdad Wrote: Please remove this from the home page: // Automatic or explicit memory management delete cl; It is obviously not doing what it implies. Similarly, please remove Allocating Class Instances On The Stack from the memory.html page:

Re: Please remove misleading examples from D's website

2011-11-30 Thread Timon Gehr
On 11/30/2011 05:04 PM, Mehrdad wrote: On 11/30/2011 7:07 AM, Dejan Lekic wrote: No please! Do not remove, but add a note that those are either deprecated or removed and what a developer should do with a modern implementation of D2! Uhm, what? Deprecated means that the feature is still

Re: SQL/database server capabilities NO ODBC please

2011-11-30 Thread Steve Teale
As I understand it, FreeTDS provides three client libraries: db-lib, ct-lib and odbc. These libraries are available as dynamic libraries and then it won't be any licensing issues. TinyTDS uses db-lib and it HAS to use dynamic library since it's a Ruby library. I took a quick look at the

Re: SQL/database server capabilities NO ODBC please

2011-11-30 Thread Jacob Carlborg
On 2011-11-30 18:09, Steve Teale wrote: As I understand it, FreeTDS provides three client libraries: db-lib, ct-lib and odbc. These libraries are available as dynamic libraries and then it won't be any licensing issues. TinyTDS uses db-lib and it HAS to use dynamic library since it's a Ruby

Re: Please remove misleading examples from D's website

2011-11-30 Thread Trass3r
Feel free to open a pull request. (1) No idea how :( For small and fast edits github provides a nifty feature: https://github.com/blog/844-forking-with-the-edit-button

Re: Java Scala

2011-11-30 Thread Jacob Carlborg
On 2011-11-30 16:36, Martin Nowak wrote: On Wed, 30 Nov 2011 09:19:59 +0100, Walter Bright newshou...@digitalmars.com wrote: On 11/29/2011 11:46 PM, Jacob Carlborg wrote: I agree. The shared library problem is blocked by DMD not being able to correctly generate PIC. The compiler does

Re: Please remove misleading examples from D's website

2011-11-30 Thread Dejan Lekic
The reason why i wrote what i wrote is simple - so people who read legacy D code understand it has been removed or deprecated.

Re: SQL/database server capabilities NO ODBC please

2011-11-30 Thread Steve Teale
As far as I can see db-lib is a dead end for SQL Server - http:// msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/library/aa936940%28v=sql.80%29.aspx. ct-lib seems to be a Sybase branch. Steve I've seen that page as well. I'm wondering if that is about Microsoft's implementation. Using Ruby on Rails, TinyTDS is

Re: Java Scala

2011-11-30 Thread Jeff Nowakowski
On 11/30/2011 03:17 AM, Walter Bright wrote: It has to run on the JVM, which is a large and heavy rock. You should check the beams in your eyes before talking about the motes in others. Did you see this recent post? I don't think porting any game to D is a good idea right now. I've did

Re: Java Scala

2011-11-30 Thread Walter Bright
On 11/30/2011 10:12 AM, Jeff Nowakowski wrote: On 11/30/2011 03:17 AM, Walter Bright wrote: It has to run on the JVM, which is a large and heavy rock. The JVM garbage collector is miles ahead of D's. Yes, it is. What I meant by the large and heavy rock is the difficulty of expressing any

Re: Java Scala

2011-11-30 Thread Walter Bright
On 11/30/2011 9:36 AM, Jacob Carlborg wrote: I'm pretty sure the compiler needs to generate different code for TLS when the variable to access is in a dynamic library. That is correct, and you'll see the difference when you use -fPIC.

Re: Java Scala

2011-11-30 Thread Walter Bright
On 11/30/2011 4:18 AM, Jacob Carlborg wrote: On 2011-11-30 09:19, Walter Bright wrote: On 11/29/2011 11:46 PM, Jacob Carlborg wrote: I agree. The shared library problem is blocked by DMD not being able to correctly generate PIC. The compiler does correctly generate PIC code on Linux. So

Re: Please remove misleading examples from D's website

2011-11-30 Thread Hans Uhlig
On 11/30/2011 9:53 AM, Dejan Lekic wrote: The reason why i wrote what i wrote is simple - so people who read legacy D code understand it has been removed or deprecated. Then we need documentation versioning. Choose your version and get the current documentation. Things not in the current

so, what about the library based typedef?

2011-11-30 Thread Trass3r
So typedef is finally deprecated now and I have to add -d to all of my build scripts just to shut dmd up. As I pointed out months ago and recently again, shouldn't we have a library based typedef as a replacement before doing so? http://d.puremagic.com/issues/show_bug.cgi?id=5467

Re: Java Scala

2011-11-30 Thread Gour
On Wed, 30 Nov 2011 15:11:53 -0500 Jeff Nowakowski j...@dilacero.org wrote: And isn't the point of D to relieve you of the burden of doing stuff like memory management? You should read Tim Sweeney's (Gears of War developer) The Next Mainstream Programming Language, where the slide for

Re: Java Scala

2011-11-30 Thread Jeff Nowakowski
On 11/30/2011 01:38 PM, Walter Bright wrote: Yes, it is. What I meant by the large and heavy rock is the difficulty of expressing any sort of semantics that are not Java semantics in the JVM bytecode. Fair enough. In C++, one does all the memory management manually. But in C++ libraries

Re: Java Scala

2011-11-30 Thread Walter Bright
On 11/30/2011 12:11 PM, Jeff Nowakowski wrote: But in C++ libraries are designed with this in mind. You didn't address his point: Unless you want to do all of the memory management yourself, which pretty much results in not using phobos and most of the cool features in D. As in C++, you do

Re: Java Scala

2011-11-30 Thread Paulo Pinto
Well doing lots of transactions per second while aggregating data from network elements scattered across mobile network stations seems quite a lot of work to me. I worked in several projects from quite a few big mobile companies and I can say that most code that runs on the network side doing

Re: Java Scala

2011-11-30 Thread Paulo Pinto
Are you not being a bit simplistic here? There are several JVM implementations around not just one. Plus if I understand correctly some complains of people using D in real projects, in many cases JVM JITs are able to generate better code than D. At least for the time being. I used to be

Re: Java Scala

2011-11-30 Thread bigsandwich
Jeff Nowakowski Wrote: On 11/30/2011 01:38 PM, Walter Bright wrote: Yes, it is. What I meant by the large and heavy rock is the difficulty of expressing any sort of semantics that are not Java semantics in the JVM bytecode. Fair enough. In C++, one does all the memory management

Re: Java Scala

2011-11-30 Thread Jeff Nowakowski
On 11/30/2011 03:58 PM, bigsandwich wrote: Usually garbage collected in the case of Unreal refers to Unreal Script which is not C++ at all. Its a language similar to Java that is compiled into bytecode. It doesn't say that in the slides. It says that they use C++ *and* script code. The

Re: Java Scala

2011-11-30 Thread Timon Gehr
On 11/30/2011 09:56 PM, Paulo Pinto wrote: Are you not being a bit simplistic here? There are several JVM implementations around not just one. Where did he talk about implementations? He only described the _design_ of the JVM. Plus if I understand correctly some complains of people using

Re: Java Scala

2011-11-30 Thread bigsandwich
Jeff Nowakowski Wrote: On 11/30/2011 03:58 PM, bigsandwich wrote: Usually garbage collected in the case of Unreal refers to Unreal Script which is not C++ at all. Its a language similar to Java that is compiled into bytecode. It doesn't say that in the slides. It says that they use

Re: Java Scala

2011-11-30 Thread Walter Bright
On 11/30/2011 12:56 PM, Paulo Pinto wrote: Are you not being a bit simplistic here? There are several JVM implementations around not just one. It's not the implementation that's the problem, it's the *definition* of the bytecode for the JVM. Plus if I understand correctly some complains

Re: Java Scala

2011-11-30 Thread Timon Gehr
On 11/30/2011 09:58 PM, bigsandwich wrote: Jeff Nowakowski Wrote: On 11/30/2011 01:38 PM, Walter Bright wrote: Yes, it is. What I meant by the large and heavy rock is the difficulty of expressing any sort of semantics that are not Java semantics in the JVM bytecode. Fair enough. In C++,

Re: Java Scala

2011-11-30 Thread Jude
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 On 11/30/2011 03:33 PM, Timon Gehr wrote: On 11/30/2011 09:56 PM, Paulo Pinto wrote: Are you not being a bit simplistic here? There are several JVM implementations around not just one. Where did he talk about implementations? He only

Re: Java Scala

2011-11-30 Thread bearophile
Jude: I would be VERY surprised if a JVM JIT could outperform D, excepting the occasional corner case of course. Be prepared to be surprised again and again... :-) Bye, bearophile

Re: Java Scala

2011-11-30 Thread Jude
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 On 11/30/2011 06:06 PM, bearophile wrote: Jude: I would be VERY surprised if a JVM JIT could outperform D, excepting the occasional corner case of course. Be prepared to be surprised again and again... :-) Bye, bearophile Oh, I'm

Re: A real Forum for D

2011-11-30 Thread Sean Kelly
On Nov 29, 2011, at 12:30 PM, Gour wrote: On Tue, 29 Nov 2011 13:52:24 -0500 Jonathan M Davis jmdavisp...@gmx.com wrote: and I don't know how to get that with a newsgroup client even if it works at both work and home (and wherever else you'd need to sync). ssh and some rsync magic

Re: Java Scala

2011-11-30 Thread bearophile
Jude: Got any ideas for code that is currently way less than optimal in D? Compared to Java running on the OracleVM D is most times slower when it comes to heavily garbage collected code, and often with floating-point-heavy code. Exceptions (and synchronized methods) are faster than D-DMD

Re: Concurrency.

2011-11-30 Thread Sean Kelly
On Nov 27, 2011, at 9:51 PM, Debdata wrote: I agree that message passing and resource hiding are a great way to go for a lot of cases, but there are an equally large (Larger?) number of cases that would benefit from global sharing. Especially when threading for performance rather than

Re: Concurrency.

2011-11-30 Thread Sean Kelly
On Nov 28, 2011, at 3:48 AM, Debdatta wrote: In my (limited) experience, involving mostly threading for performance, sharing is the norm.( Take a look at .NET's task parallel library, or intel's TBB.) So is complexity and the propensity for deadlocks ;-)

Re: Concurrency.

2011-11-30 Thread Sean Kelly
On Nov 28, 2011, at 2:54 AM, Jonathan M Davis wrote: On Monday, November 28, 2011 10:28:34 Debdatta wrote: Let me get this straight. Instances are shared... and marking a class shared marks all its members shared? If what you said were true, it would be trivial to instantiate a class as both

Re: Concurrency.

2011-11-30 Thread Andrei Alexandrescu
On 11/30/11 5:04 PM, Sean Kelly wrote: On Nov 28, 2011, at 3:48 AM, Debdatta wrote: In my (limited) experience, involving mostly threading for performance, sharing is the norm.( Take a look at .NET's task parallel library, or intel's TBB.) So is complexity and the propensity for deadlocks

Re: Concurrency.

2011-11-30 Thread Jonathan M Davis
On Wednesday, November 30, 2011 17:06:22 Sean Kelly wrote: On Nov 28, 2011, at 2:54 AM, Jonathan M Davis wrote: On Monday, November 28, 2011 10:28:34 Debdatta wrote: Let me get this straight. Instances are shared... and marking a class shared marks all its members shared? If what you said

Re: Is D more cryptic than C++?

2011-11-30 Thread Jesse Phillips
What bearophile was referring to was the use of templates is common. D's templates have the advantage of being easier on the eyes and more powerful (with the inclusion of 'static if' in the language). On Wed, 30 Nov 2011 06:14:34 -0600, Abrahm wrote: bearophile bearophileh...@lycos.com wrote

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