Low-overhead components

2013-07-27 Thread Vladimir Panteleev
Not really an article or anything - this was planned as just a post to this newsgroup, but I decided to put it somewhere suitable for larger blocks of text with formatting: http://blog.thecybershadow.net/2013/07/28/low-overhead-components/

Re: Pulling Xorg dependencies on headless machine

2013-07-27 Thread Jordi Sayol
On 28/07/13 02:04, H. S. Teoh wrote: > On Sun, Jul 28, 2013 at 01:46:31AM +0200, Adam D. Ruppe wrote: >> I don't know much about debian, but dmd itself doesn't need X, nor >> should phobos. I compile and run D programs on headless web servers >> every day. >> >> If you can't ignore the dependencies

Re: Are there any crypto libraries floating around?

2013-07-27 Thread Tyler Jameson Little
On Saturday, 27 July 2013 at 17:53:52 UTC, Walter Bright wrote: On 7/27/2013 8:58 AM, Tyler Jameson Little wrote: Has anyone started working on this? Are there any openssh wrappers lying around somewhere? I may have a crack at it myself it noone has started on it. https://github.com/D-Program

Re: Pulling Xorg dependencies on headless machine

2013-07-27 Thread Vladimir Panteleev
On Sunday, 28 July 2013 at 00:06:32 UTC, H. S. Teoh wrote: On that note, though, why on earth are we depending on xdg-utils? For xdg-open, which is used in std.process.browse, and the dman utility.

Re: Pulling Xorg dependencies on headless machine

2013-07-27 Thread nazriel
On Sunday, 28 July 2013 at 00:16:54 UTC, nazriel wrote: On Sunday, 28 July 2013 at 00:09:04 UTC, H. S. Teoh wrote: On Sun, Jul 28, 2013 at 02:03:47AM +0200, nazriel wrote: [...] I am afraid that DMD is the one pulling in X stuff. I suspect it may be because of -man switch. That would explain

Re: Pulling Xorg dependencies on headless machine

2013-07-27 Thread nazriel
On Sunday, 28 July 2013 at 00:09:04 UTC, H. S. Teoh wrote: On Sun, Jul 28, 2013 at 02:03:47AM +0200, nazriel wrote: [...] I am afraid that DMD is the one pulling in X stuff. I suspect it may be because of -man switch. That would explain why dmd wants xdg-open on Debian. Gah. I say the .deb

Re: Pulling Xorg dependencies on headless machine

2013-07-27 Thread H. S. Teoh
On Sun, Jul 28, 2013 at 02:03:47AM +0200, nazriel wrote: [...] > I am afraid that DMD is the one pulling in X stuff. > > I suspect it may be because of -man switch. That would explain why > dmd wants xdg-open on Debian. Gah. I say the .deb should just Recommends: xdg-utils, not Depends:. As far a

Re: Pulling Xorg dependencies on headless machine

2013-07-27 Thread H. S. Teoh
On Sun, Jul 28, 2013 at 01:46:31AM +0200, Adam D. Ruppe wrote: > I don't know much about debian, but dmd itself doesn't need X, nor > should phobos. I compile and run D programs on headless web servers > every day. > > If you can't ignore the dependencies with the apt, downloading the > dmd zip fi

Re: Pulling Xorg dependencies on headless machine

2013-07-27 Thread nazriel
On Saturday, 27 July 2013 at 23:46:34 UTC, Adam D. Ruppe wrote: I don't know much about debian, but dmd itself doesn't need X, nor should phobos. I compile and run D programs on headless web servers every day. If you can't ignore the dependencies with the apt, downloading the dmd zip file sho

Re: Pulling Xorg dependencies on headless machine

2013-07-27 Thread Adam D. Ruppe
I don't know much about debian, but dmd itself doesn't need X, nor should phobos. I compile and run D programs on headless web servers every day. If you can't ignore the dependencies with the apt, downloading the dmd zip file should be just about as easy and it doesn't pull anything else with

Re: Pulling Xorg dependencies on headless machine

2013-07-27 Thread H. S. Teoh
On Sun, Jul 28, 2013 at 12:27:20AM +0200, nazriel wrote: > What are the rationales for pulling in Xorg dependencies on headless > machines like web server? > > I am installing DMD on Debian machine from D-APT but I guess > installing from dlang.org dpkg would result in the same behaviour. > > Pac

Pulling Xorg dependencies on headless machine

2013-07-27 Thread nazriel
What are the rationales for pulling in Xorg dependencies on headless machines like web server? I am installing DMD on Debian machine from D-APT but I guess installing from dlang.org dpkg would result in the same behaviour. Packages like noveau, readeon, intel drivers and other Xorg utilis ar

Re: A proper language comparison...

2013-07-27 Thread Walter Bright
On 7/27/2013 11:50 AM, Meta wrote: On Saturday, 27 July 2013 at 17:52:20 UTC, Walter Bright wrote: I use a Turtlebeach Audiotron. That may be your problem right there. Turtle Beach seems to make high-quality products, but in reality the quality is extremely poor. I have 5 (5!) friends now, as

Re: A proper language comparison...

2013-07-27 Thread Meta
On Saturday, 27 July 2013 at 17:52:20 UTC, Walter Bright wrote: I use a Turtlebeach Audiotron. That may be your problem right there. Turtle Beach seems to make high-quality products, but in reality the quality is extremely poor. I have 5 (5!) friends now, as well as myself, who bought a Turt

Re: Are there any crypto libraries floating around?

2013-07-27 Thread Jacob Carlborg
On Saturday, 27 July 2013 at 15:58:04 UTC, Tyler Jameson Little wrote: I found this thread mentioning some initial work on a crypto library: http://forum.dlang.org/thread/j84us9$2m5k$1...@digitalmars.com?page=1 It looks like "std.digest" is what came of that though, not "std.crypto". I foun

Re: Are there any crypto libraries floating around?

2013-07-27 Thread Walter Bright
On 7/27/2013 8:58 AM, Tyler Jameson Little wrote: Has anyone started working on this? Are there any openssh wrappers lying around somewhere? I may have a crack at it myself it noone has started on it. https://github.com/D-Programming-Deimos/openssl

Re: A proper language comparison...

2013-07-27 Thread Walter Bright
On 7/27/2013 3:24 AM, Jacob Carlborg wrote: On Friday, 26 July 2013 at 19:50:22 UTC, Walter Bright wrote: But I see no point. 32 bit code is already dead on OSX, and is rapidly dying on Linux and Windows. I hear from more and more outfits that they've transitioned to 64 bits and are not looking

Re: A proper language comparison...

2013-07-27 Thread Walter Bright
On 7/27/2013 3:31 AM, Jacob Carlborg wrote: On Friday, 26 July 2013 at 19:54:58 UTC, Walter Bright wrote: My current media player freezes about once every couple weeks. It's infrequent enough to be tolerable. The Ubuntu one dies about once an hour. I gave up on that long ago. Then you should

Are there any crypto libraries floating around?

2013-07-27 Thread Tyler Jameson Little
I found this thread mentioning some initial work on a crypto library: http://forum.dlang.org/thread/j84us9$2m5k$1...@digitalmars.com?page=1 It looks like "std.digest" is what came of that though, not "std.crypto". I found this on the wish list: Encryption and hashing This is more a

Re: Are we getting better at designing programming languages?

2013-07-27 Thread JS
On Friday, 26 July 2013 at 23:19:45 UTC, H. S. Teoh wrote: On Fri, Jul 26, 2013 at 03:02:32PM +0200, JS wrote: I think the next step in languages it the mutli-level abstraction. Right now we have the base level core programming and the preprocessing/template/generic level above that. There is n

Re: Strict aliasing in D

2013-07-27 Thread bearophile
Walter Bright: Although it isn't in the spec, D should be "strict aliasing". This is because: 1. it enables better code generation 2. there are ways, such as unions, to get the other aliasing that doesn't break strict aliasing Is it good to add to Phobos a small template (named like "Poin

Re: A proper language comparison...

2013-07-27 Thread John Colvin
On Saturday, 27 July 2013 at 10:31:10 UTC, Jacob Carlborg wrote: On Friday, 26 July 2013 at 19:54:58 UTC, Walter Bright wrote: My current media player freezes about once every couple weeks. It's infrequent enough to be tolerable. The Ubuntu one dies about once an hour. I gave up on that long a

Re: Flame bait: D vs. Rust vs. Go Benchmarking

2013-07-27 Thread Artur Skawina
On 07/26/13 22:49, Walter Bright wrote: > Jobs and Torvalds famously use(d) obscenity, and in fact being cussed out by > either of those can be a perverse badge of honor. > > But I think those are exceptions, and their methods are not general license > for others to use the same techniques. Tha

Re: persistent byLine

2013-07-27 Thread Nick Treleaven
On 25/07/2013 03:22, Brad Anderson wrote: https://github.com/schveiguy/phobos/blob/new-io/std/io.d Thanks, now added to the wiki: http://wiki.dlang.org/Review_Queue#Current_Review_Queue

Re: A proper language comparison...

2013-07-27 Thread Jacob Carlborg
On Friday, 26 July 2013 at 19:54:58 UTC, Walter Bright wrote: My current media player freezes about once every couple weeks. It's infrequent enough to be tolerable. The Ubuntu one dies about once an hour. I gave up on that long ago. Then you should use a Mac. They're (in)famous for when the w

Re: A proper language comparison...

2013-07-27 Thread Jacob Carlborg
On Friday, 26 July 2013 at 19:50:22 UTC, Walter Bright wrote: But I see no point. 32 bit code is already dead on OSX, and is rapidly dying on Linux and Windows. I hear from more and more outfits that they've transitioned to 64 bits and are not looking back. 32bit is far from dead on ARM. --

Re: Strict aliasing in D

2013-07-27 Thread ponce
On Saturday, 27 July 2013 at 09:05:32 UTC, ponce wrote: It would be great to have something like GCC's solution: warn when pointer casts may violate the strict aliasing rule, and provide a flag to disable it. BTW, C++ compilers usually have an effective way to disambiguate pointer aliasing so

Re: Strict aliasing in D

2013-07-27 Thread ponce
On Saturday, 27 July 2013 at 06:58:04 UTC, Walter Bright wrote: 2. there are ways, such as unions, to get the other aliasing that doesn't break strict aliasing It would be great to have something like GCC's solution: warn when pointer casts may violate the strict aliasing rule, and provide a

Re: Strict aliasing in D

2013-07-27 Thread monarch_dodra
On Saturday, 27 July 2013 at 08:58:22 UTC, Walter Bright wrote: On 7/27/2013 1:08 AM, monarch_dodra wrote: 1. Does strict aliasing apply to slices? I don't know what you mean. double d; uint* p = cast(int*)&d; //unsafe aliasing vs double[] d = new double[](1); uint[] p = cast(uint[])d; //u

Re: Strict aliasing in D

2013-07-27 Thread Walter Bright
On 7/27/2013 1:57 AM, David Nadlinger wrote: On Saturday, 27 July 2013 at 06:58:04 UTC, Walter Bright wrote: Although it isn't in the spec, D should be "strict aliasing". This is because: 1. it enables better code generation 2. there are ways, such as unions, to get the other aliasing that doe

Re: Strict aliasing in D

2013-07-27 Thread Walter Bright
On 7/27/2013 1:08 AM, monarch_dodra wrote: 1. Does strict aliasing apply to slices? I don't know what you mean. 2. C++ uses 'char' as a 'neutral' type that can alias to anything. What about D? Does char fill that role? Does ubyte? I'll go with deadalnix's answer.

Re: Strict aliasing in D

2013-07-27 Thread monarch_dodra
On Saturday, 27 July 2013 at 08:35:36 UTC, deadalnix wrote: On Saturday, 27 July 2013 at 08:08:01 UTC, monarch_dodra wrote: Thank you for the answer. I expected D to do strict aliasing for the reasons you mentioned. This does come up with two follow up question though: 1. Does strict aliasing

Re: Strict aliasing in D

2013-07-27 Thread David Nadlinger
On Saturday, 27 July 2013 at 06:58:04 UTC, Walter Bright wrote: Although it isn't in the spec, D should be "strict aliasing". This is because: 1. it enables better code generation 2. there are ways, such as unions, to get the other aliasing that doesn't break strict aliasing We need to care

Re: A proper language comparison...

2013-07-27 Thread Walter Bright
On 7/27/2013 12:40 AM, deadalnix wrote: This kind of software can leverage way to recovers that would be untolerable in an airplane (for instance because they only work most of the time, or would produce an erratic behavior for a short period of time, like an audio glitch). D right now is not ve

Re: Strict aliasing in D

2013-07-27 Thread deadalnix
On Saturday, 27 July 2013 at 08:08:01 UTC, monarch_dodra wrote: Thank you for the answer. I expected D to do strict aliasing for the reasons you mentioned. This does come up with two follow up question though: 1. Does strict aliasing apply to slices? 2. C++ uses 'char' as a 'neutral' type that

Re: Strict aliasing in D

2013-07-27 Thread monarch_dodra
On Saturday, 27 July 2013 at 06:58:04 UTC, Walter Bright wrote: On 7/26/2013 12:45 PM, monarch_dodra wrote: On Sunday, 29 January 2012 at 16:25:33 UTC, Peter Alexander wrote: As for D, I can't see anything in the standard that prevents two pointers of different types from pointing to the same l

Re: A proper language comparison...

2013-07-27 Thread deadalnix
On Friday, 26 July 2013 at 19:54:58 UTC, Walter Bright wrote: On 7/26/2013 10:25 AM, deadalnix wrote: You emphasis it quite well, and that is certainly true for a car, a plane, or anything potentially dangerous. Different tradeoff apply when you talk about a video game, a media player or and

Re: Strict aliasing in D

2013-07-27 Thread Walter Bright
On 7/26/2013 12:45 PM, monarch_dodra wrote: On Sunday, 29 January 2012 at 16:25:33 UTC, Peter Alexander wrote: As for D, I can't see anything in the standard that prevents two pointers of different types from pointing to the same location, but I suspect it is an assumption that is being made.