On Thursday, 7 March 2013 at 03:06:48 UTC, bearophile wrote:
Walter Bright:
Happy hacking!
Extra karma points if done blindfolded, using a Braille tablet
:-)
Bye,
bearophile
As far as I know, Walter DOES IT blindfolded, using a Braille
tablet and while he writes 3 other compilers at the
On Sunday, 23 March 2014 at 16:10:48 UTC, Daniel Murphy wrote:
"Asman01" wrote in message
news:ucqujzetvkkxzelvj...@forum.dlang.org...
Very noob question about binary files. What else also put the
code to load at right address (say, 0x08048000 on linux) of
operating system is needed to a pro
"Asman01" wrote in message news:ucqujzetvkkxzelvj...@forum.dlang.org...
Very noob question about binary files. What else also put the code to load
at right address (say, 0x08048000 on linux) of operating system is needed
to a program run?
Not really sure what you're asking, but the executabl
On Saturday, 9 March 2013 at 05:22:31 UTC, Jesse Phillips wrote:
On Thursday, 7 March 2013 at 15:53:09 UTC, Denis Shelomovskij
wrote:
Didn't get. You don't have to use D with druntime. Just don't
link it and everything will be OK - you will just get "better
C" (i.e. with D structs and other goo
"Asman01" wrote in message news:klvtbihnvoxfarsjd...@forum.dlang.org...
Is this the current linker used by DMD on all platforms?
No, only when building win32 executables.
Very noob question about binary files. What else also put the
code to load at right address (say, 0x08048000 on linux) of
operating system is needed to a program run?
On Thursday, 7 March 2013 at 01:25:02 UTC, Walter Bright wrote:
Some months ago, I did make the source to optlink available on
github:
https://github.com/DigitalMars/optlink
Rainer Schuetze has improved it where it can be built with
modern tools (the older tools would not run on Win7). I know
"Jacob Carlborg" wrote in message news:khaqhb$on0$1...@digitalmars.com...
On 2013-03-07 13:35, Daniel Murphy wrote:
> If anyone is interested I'll put it up on github.
I would say put it there to see how much interest there is.
Better late than never...
https://github.com/yebblies/ylink
19.03.2013 2:34, Denis Shelomovskij пишет:
1. DM C++ compiler source is required to build Optlink.
2. C++ compiler is not open-source.
3. You can not build Optlink.
4. Walter isn't going to change anything
It works now! Thanks be to God!
Optlink Issue 7139 now looks like this (with Optlink pul
On 3/20/13, Denis Shelomovskij wrote:
> I see now that one have to run `build_optlink.bat`, not `build.bat`. And
> it wasn't obvious to me and no one told me it or at least to carefully
> read pull #2 description...
Also make sure to get imagecfg.exe to avoid hangs when running
Optlink. See https
20.03.2013 21:12, Denis Shelomovskij пишет:
20.03.2013 13:34, Andrej Mitrovic пишет:
On 3/20/13, Denis Shelomovskij wrote:
Dear Walter Bright,
could you please test Optlink to be buildable not only with your machine
configuration?
This[1] should have taken care of that. Although it still nee
20.03.2013 12:42, Walter Bright пишет:
On 3/20/2013 12:40 AM, Denis Shelomovskij wrote:
19.03.2013 22:31, Walter Bright пишет:
On 3/19/2013 7:00 AM, Denis Shelomovskij wrote:
LINK.def(0) : Error 2: File Not Found LINK.def
It's there now.
Dear Walter Bright,
could you please test Optlink t
20.03.2013 21:12, Denis Shelomovskij пишет:
20.03.2013 13:34, Andrej Mitrovic пишет:
On 3/20/13, Denis Shelomovskij wrote:
Dear Walter Bright,
could you please test Optlink to be buildable not only with your machine
configuration?
This[1] should have taken care of that. Although it still nee
20.03.2013 13:34, Andrej Mitrovic пишет:
On 3/20/13, Denis Shelomovskij wrote:
Dear Walter Bright,
could you please test Optlink to be buildable not only with your machine
configuration?
This[1] should have taken care of that. Although it still needed DMC
source for scio.h, but it did build o
On 3/20/13, Denis Shelomovskij wrote:
> Dear Walter Bright,
> could you please test Optlink to be buildable not only with your machine
> configuration?
This[1] should have taken care of that. Although it still needed DMC
source for scio.h, but it did build on my machine.
[1] https://github.com/D
On 3/20/2013 12:40 AM, Denis Shelomovskij wrote:
19.03.2013 22:31, Walter Bright пишет:
On 3/19/2013 7:00 AM, Denis Shelomovskij wrote:
LINK.def(0) : Error 2: File Not Found LINK.def
It's there now.
Dear Walter Bright,
could you please test Optlink to be buildable not only with your machin
19.03.2013 22:31, Walter Bright пишет:
On 3/19/2013 7:00 AM, Denis Shelomovskij wrote:
LINK.def(0) : Error 2: File Not Found LINK.def
It's there now.
Dear Walter Bright,
could you please test Optlink to be buildable not only with your machine
configuration?
If dummy (empty) file isn't cr
On 3/19/2013 7:00 AM, Denis Shelomovskij wrote:
LINK.def(0) : Error 2: File Not Found LINK.def
It's there now.
19.03.2013 17:40, Denis Shelomovskij пишет:
So, everything works now!
No, it's a joke. )))
Optlink is surely propected from being compiled by dmc's ICE:
---
dmc -c newlibc -NTPASS1_TEXT -I..\common -r -N_ -o -o.\OBJNT\newlibc.obj
Internal error: cgcod.c 750
---
The ICE is disappeared with oth
On 3/18/2013 3:34 PM, Denis Shelomovskij wrote:
1. DM C++ compiler source is required to build Optlink.
2. C++ compiler is not open-source.
3. You can not build Optlink.
4. Walter isn't going to change anything
1. "Optlink is on github" announce
Ready for review: ne
Sorry, accidentally Ctrl+Enter sent the main post malformed. The last
link is a proof of statement #4.
--
Денис В. Шеломовский
Denis V. Shelomovskij
On Thursday, 7 March 2013 at 14:42:25 UTC, Marco Leise wrote:
On Thu, Mar 07, 2013 at 07:09:22AM +0100, Lars T. Kyllingstad
wrote:
This reminds me of
http://www.catb.org/jargon/html/story-of-mel.html
Good story! Imagine how Mel must have known the entire program
by heart and he never got any
On Friday, 8 March 2013 at 17:40:58 UTC, Andrej Mitrovic wrote:
On 3/8/13, Walter Bright wrote:
On 3/7/2013 8:16 PM, Brad Roberts wrote:
Personally, even though I don't use win32, I believe that
moving it over
to use the VS toolchain and runtime is the
right path forward.
I like being able
On Thursday, 7 March 2013 at 06:34:05 UTC, H. S. Teoh wrote:
Man, that brings back the memories. I remember doing those
kinds of
stunts when coding for the good ole Motorola 6502. Back in
those days,
Well, there never was a 'Motorola' 6502, in fact the manufacturer
MOS Technologies (though foun
On 3/7/13, Daniel Murphy wrote:
> If anyone is interested I'll put it up on github.
I'd be interested, please do put it online when you get the time.
On 3/9/13, deadalnix wrote:
> On Friday, 8 March 2013 at 17:40:58 UTC, Andrej Mitrovic wrote:
>> Honestly D has huge potential for tools like
>> compilers/linkers/etc.
>> They're the types of programs where you practically know all
>> your
>> requirements at compile-time, so e.g. generics come int
Am Sat, 09 Mar 2013 11:35:42 +0100
schrieb "Dicebot" :
> Ye, sure, I wanted to support your point with practical example,
> not object it by any means. By the way, templates and array
> literals I have tried were doomed, too :)
Sorry, I misunderstood that then.
Am Sat, 09 Mar 2013 11:35:42 +0100
schrieb "Dicebot" :
> Ye, sure, I wanted to support your point with practical example,
> not object it by any means. By the way, templates and array
> literals I have tried were doomed, too :)
Really, templates also don't work? There's a lot of work required t
Ye, sure, I wanted to support your point with practical example,
not object it by any means. By the way, templates and array
literals I have tried were doomed, too :)
Am Sat, 09 Mar 2013 10:32:18 +0100
schrieb "Dicebot" :
> On Saturday, 9 March 2013 at 09:11:54 UTC, Johannes Pfau wrote:
> > Am Thu, 07 Mar 2013 19:53:29 +0400
> > schrieb Denis Shelomovskij :
> >
> >> 07.03.2013 14:28, Jacob Carlborg пишет:
> >> > On 2013-03-07 11:12, Moritz Maxeiner wrote:
> >>
On Saturday, 9 March 2013 at 09:11:54 UTC, Johannes Pfau wrote:
Am Thu, 07 Mar 2013 19:53:29 +0400
schrieb Denis Shelomovskij :
07.03.2013 14:28, Jacob Carlborg пишет:
> On 2013-03-07 11:12, Moritz Maxeiner wrote:
>
>> Sorry if this has been answered before/is common knowledge,
>> but is
>> po
Am Thu, 07 Mar 2013 19:53:29 +0400
schrieb Denis Shelomovskij :
> 07.03.2013 14:28, Jacob Carlborg пишет:
> > On 2013-03-07 11:12, Moritz Maxeiner wrote:
> >
> >> Sorry if this has been answered before/is common knowledge, but is
> >> porting functions at a time to C wanted for optlink in general,
On 3/8/2013 11:29 PM, Nick Sabalausky wrote:
So if they *can* be so simple, why should everyone have
to continue to stay stuck with a crappy one?
That's a good question. It's surprising how excessively complicated most designs
are.
On Thu, 07 Mar 2013 19:41:10 -0800
Walter Bright wrote:
>
> I don't want to discourage people from trying to come up with a
> replacement linker for win32 written in D. I think that is a great
> project. But while a linker is a conceptually simple program, the
> awful file formats involved make i
On Thursday, 7 March 2013 at 01:25:02 UTC, Walter Bright wrote:
Some months ago, I did make the source to optlink available on
github:
https://github.com/DigitalMars/optlink
Rainer Schuetze has improved it where it can be built with
modern tools (the older tools would not run on Win7). I know
On Thursday, 7 March 2013 at 15:53:09 UTC, Denis Shelomovskij
wrote:
Didn't get. You don't have to use D with druntime. Just don't
link it and everything will be OK - you will just get "better
C" (i.e. with D structs and other good stuff).
Walter wrote all about it:
http://www.drdobbs.com/arc
On Friday, 8 March 2013 at 17:40:58 UTC, Andrej Mitrovic wrote:
Honestly D has huge potential for tools like
compilers/linkers/etc.
They're the types of programs where you practically know all
your
requirements at compile-time, so e.g. generics come into play
really
nicely.
That is the theo
On Friday, 8 March 2013 at 13:02:06 UTC, Jakob Ovrum wrote:
On Friday, 8 March 2013 at 05:29:14 UTC, Rikki Cattermole wrote:
I've actually modified dmd's frontend to support using the VS
tool chain for linking 32 bit executables. But I didn't
understand the backend to seperate the 32bit binary
On 3/8/13, Walter Bright wrote:
> On 3/7/2013 8:16 PM, Brad Roberts wrote:
>> Personally, even though I don't use win32, I believe that moving it over
>> to use the VS toolchain and runtime is the
>> right path forward.
>
> I like being able to provide a completely free D toolchain for win32.
s/f
On Friday, 8 March 2013 at 05:29:14 UTC, Rikki Cattermole wrote:
I've actually modified dmd's frontend to support using the VS
tool chain for linking 32 bit executables. But I didn't
understand the backend to seperate the 32bit binary generation
vs 64bit. I believe it shouldn't be too much. But
On 08.03.2013 08:25, Rikki Cattermole wrote:
On Friday, 8 March 2013 at 07:17:24 UTC, Walter Bright wrote:
On 3/7/2013 8:16 PM, Brad Roberts wrote:
Personally, even though I don't use win32, I believe that moving it
over to use the VS toolchain and runtime is the
right path forward.
I like
On 2013-03-08 09:58, Walter Bright wrote:
Sure, but who is going to do the work?
Anyone that's interested in doing the work. But we don't have to invest
all our time doing it. Daniel Murphy seems to be working on a linker, so
apparently there is at least some interest.
BTW, we did come up
On 3/8/2013 12:50 AM, Jacob Carlborg wrote:
If we have our own linker for every supported platform and format I pretty sure
that we can take advantage of that and come up with features not possible using
other linkers.
For example, storing .di files directly in the object file. This has also bee
08-Mar-2013 12:50, Jacob Carlborg пишет:
On 2013-03-08 04:41, Walter Bright wrote:
The other thing is, we just don't have a need for our own linker for any
platform other than win32. So what's the cost benefit moving forward? I
think it's easier to just fix optlink's bugs.
If we have our own
On 2013-03-08 04:41, Walter Bright wrote:
The other thing is, we just don't have a need for our own linker for any
platform other than win32. So what's the cost benefit moving forward? I
think it's easier to just fix optlink's bugs.
If we have our own linker for every supported platform and fo
08-Mar-2013 00:15, Andrej Mitrovic пишет:
On Thursday, 7 March 2013 at 20:01:58 UTC, Walter Bright wrote:
What we *can* do with Optlink is fix the occasional bug that crops up
in it.
I hope so. :)
On Thursday, 7 March 2013 at 20:01:58 UTC, Walter Bright wrote:
I also believe that even if Opt
On Friday, 8 March 2013 at 07:17:24 UTC, Walter Bright wrote:
On 3/7/2013 8:16 PM, Brad Roberts wrote:
Personally, even though I don't use win32, I believe that
moving it over to use the VS toolchain and runtime is the
right path forward.
I like being able to provide a completely free D toolc
On 3/7/2013 8:16 PM, Brad Roberts wrote:
Personally, even though I don't use win32, I believe that moving it over to use
the VS toolchain and runtime is the
right path forward.
I like being able to provide a completely free D toolchain for win32.
On Friday, 8 March 2013 at 04:17:03 UTC, Brad Roberts wrote:
On 3/7/2013 7:41 PM, Walter Bright wrote:
On 3/7/2013 7:27 PM, Daniel Murphy wrote:
"Walter Bright" wrote in message
news:khblbe$27f5$1...@digitalmars.com...
On 3/7/2013 7:09 PM, Daniel Murphy wrote:
That's correct. However, it'll b
On 3/7/2013 7:41 PM, Walter Bright wrote:
> On 3/7/2013 7:27 PM, Daniel Murphy wrote:
>> "Walter Bright" wrote in message
>> news:khblbe$27f5$1...@digitalmars.com...
>>> On 3/7/2013 7:09 PM, Daniel Murphy wrote:
>>> That's correct. However, it'll be much more maintainable,
>>
>> I don't know how m
"Walter Bright" wrote in message
news:khbmkn$298s$1...@digitalmars.com...
>
>>> That's correct. However, it'll be much more maintainable,
>>
>> I don't know how much redesign you're planning, but I can't imagine it
>> ever
>> being as maintainable as a pure d codebase. A less stable/complete
>
On 3/7/2013 7:27 PM, Daniel Murphy wrote:
"Walter Bright" wrote in message
news:khblbe$27f5$1...@digitalmars.com...
On 3/7/2013 7:09 PM, Daniel Murphy wrote:
Good, but does the code still increase the difficulty in porting?
I don't understand your question.
Does the presence of support fo
"Walter Bright" wrote in message
news:khblbe$27f5$1...@digitalmars.com...
> On 3/7/2013 7:09 PM, Daniel Murphy wrote:
>> Good, but does the code still increase the difficulty in porting?
>
> I don't understand your question.
>
Does the presence of support for eg. linking OS2 executables make the
On 3/7/2013 7:09 PM, Daniel Murphy wrote:
Good, but does the code still increase the difficulty in porting?
I don't understand your question.
And even once it's in C, optlink will probably never be more than a
win32/omf linker.
That's correct. However, it'll be much more maintainable, and
"Walter Bright" wrote in message
news:khb5d7$1cfd$1...@digitalmars.com...
> On 3/7/2013 2:25 PM, Daniel Murphy wrote:
>> That's not what I meant. I mean that when trying to work out what the
>> assembly does, having real stack frames and a consistent calling
>> convention
>> could be more usefu
On 3/7/13, Walter Bright wrote:
> 1. all the supported file formats were completely encapsulated and
> modularized
> For some idea of how that can work, see libmscoff.c and scanmscoff.c
DDL seems to do a decent job of abstracting things, e.g.:
OMF loader: http://dsource.org/projects/ddl/browser/
On 3/7/2013 2:25 PM, Daniel Murphy wrote:
That's not what I meant. I mean that when trying to work out what the
assembly does, having real stack frames and a consistent calling convention
could be more useful than knowing the label names and having out of date
comments.
I've done some disassem
"Walter Bright" wrote in message
news:khaplp$nn5$1...@digitalmars.com...
> On 3/7/2013 4:35 AM, Daniel Murphy wrote:
>> Maybe I'm missing something, but I don't understand why this is
>> necessary.
>> It should be trivial to look at the map file for the closest preceding
>> label. On modern too
On 3/7/2013 12:15 PM, Andrej Mitrovic wrote:
Interesting. But if it's made behind-the-scenes with no input or work from the
community I won't be holding my hopes up too much, I know you have very limited
time for side-projects like that.
It didn't get much past the conceptual part. I wanted to
On 3/7/2013 11:32 AM, Andrej Mitrovic wrote:
On Thursday, 7 March 2013 at 19:26:49 UTC, Walter Bright wrote:
If anyone is interested I'll put it up on github.
There's much more to making a linker. There's the debug info (which you
mentioned), then there are the resource files, the module defin
On 2013-03-07 13:35, Daniel Murphy wrote:
If anyone is interested I'll put it up on github.
I would say put it there to see how much interest there is.
--
/Jacob Carlborg
On Thursday, 7 March 2013 at 19:26:49 UTC, Walter Bright wrote:
If anyone is interested I'll put it up on github.
There's much more to making a linker. There's the debug info
(which you mentioned), then there are the resource files, the
module definition files, and lastly the myriad of rather
On 3/7/2013 4:35 AM, Daniel Murphy wrote:
Maybe I'm missing something, but I don't understand why this is necessary.
It should be trivial to look at the map file for the closest preceding
label. On modern toolchains it should even be possible to compile the asm
with debug line information. Or i
On 2013-03-07 16:53, Denis Shelomovskij wrote:
Didn't get. You don't have to use D with druntime. Just don't link it
and everything will be OK - you will just get "better C" (i.e. with D
structs and other good stuff).
I was referring to using C with out the C runtime or C standard library.
Wa
07.03.2013 14:28, Jacob Carlborg пишет:
On 2013-03-07 11:12, Moritz Maxeiner wrote:
Sorry if this has been answered before/is common knowledge, but is
porting functions at a time to C wanted for optlink in general, or only
for finding segfaults? (e.g. are pull-requests for that welcome)
Yes,
"Marco Leise" wrote in message
news:20130307154744.206d9bb0@marco-leise...
> Am Thu, 7 Mar 2013 23:35:52 +1100
> schrieb "Daniel Murphy" :
>
>> As a side note I actually wrote an omf (dmd-emitted subset) linker last
>> year
>> that gets through almost all of the dmd test suite. It has no debug
Am Thu, 7 Mar 2013 23:35:52 +1100
schrieb "Daniel Murphy" :
> As a side note I actually wrote an omf (dmd-emitted subset) linker last year
> that gets through almost all of the dmd test suite. It has no debug info
> support, which sucks, but it may work in some cases where optlink can't
> cope
On Thu, Mar 07, 2013 at 07:09:22AM +0100, Lars T. Kyllingstad
wrote:
> This reminds me of http://www.catb.org/jargon/html/story-of-mel.html
Good story! Imagine how Mel must have known the entire program
by heart and he never got any change requests that are so common today.
I would have been addi
"Walter Bright" wrote in message
news:kh8q9e$2j02$1...@digitalmars.com...
> Some months ago, I did make the source to optlink available on github:
>
> https://github.com/DigitalMars/optlink
>
[snip]
>
> So, what I do, is look at the asm code where the seg fault occurs, and
> then grep through th
On 2013-03-07 11:12, Moritz Maxeiner wrote:
Sorry if this has been answered before/is common knowledge, but is
porting functions at a time to C wanted for optlink in general, or only
for finding segfaults? (e.g. are pull-requests for that welcome)
Yes, in general. I think the idea is to port t
On Thursday, 7 March 2013 at 01:25:02 UTC, Walter Bright wrote:
https://github.com/DigitalMars/optlink
Rainer Schuetze has improved it where it can be built with
modern tools (the older tools would not run on Win7). I know
some of you are frustrated by optlink problems. Well, now you
can do
On Thu, 07 Mar 2013 06:04:29 +0100, deadalnix wrote:
It sound like a nightmare. What is the reason in the first place to use
optlink ? Isn't it possible to use another linker ?
It's fast, it's pretty well tested, Walter's written it himself, and
changing to a different linker is likely to ha
On Thu, Mar 07, 2013 at 07:09:22AM +0100, Lars T. Kyllingstad wrote:
> On Thursday, 7 March 2013 at 01:25:02 UTC, Walter Bright wrote:
> >Some months ago, I did make the source to optlink available on
> >github:
> >
> >[...]
> >
> >Happy hacking!
>
> This reminds me of http://www.catb.org/jargon/h
On Thursday, 7 March 2013 at 01:25:02 UTC, Walter Bright wrote:
Some months ago, I did make the source to optlink available on
github:
[...]
Happy hacking!
This reminds me of
http://www.catb.org/jargon/html/story-of-mel.html
:)
Lars
On Thursday, 7 March 2013 at 01:25:02 UTC, Walter Bright wrote:
Some months ago, I did make the source to optlink available on
github:
https://github.com/DigitalMars/optlink
Rainer Schuetze has improved it where it can be built with
modern tools (the older tools would not run on Win7). I know
Walter Bright:
Happy hacking!
Extra karma points if done blindfolded, using a Braille tablet :-)
Bye,
bearophile
Some months ago, I did make the source to optlink available on github:
https://github.com/DigitalMars/optlink
Rainer Schuetze has improved it where it can be built with modern tools (the
older tools would not run on Win7). I know some of you are frustrated by optlink
problems. Well, now you ca
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