Re: [DNG] Debian is endorsed by Microsoft

On Thu, Jan 21, 2016 at 12:08:19PM +, Simon Hobson wrote: > KatolaZ wrote: > > > Well, not everybody pays his bills developing open source software, > > but if I were a Debian developer, who had adhered to the debian Social > > Contract [1], I would find it difficult to

Re: [DNG] Debian is endorsed by Microsoft

KatolaZ wrote: > Well, not everybody pays his bills developing open source software, > but if I were a Debian developer, who had adhered to the debian Social > Contract [1], I would find it difficult to organise a fest to > celebrate Microsoft offering Debian as an option

Re: [DNG] Debian is endorsed by Microsoft

On 2016-01-21 09:32, KatolaZ wrote: On Thu, Jan 21, 2016 at 12:08:19PM +, Simon Hobson wrote: KatolaZ wrote: > Well, not everybody pays his bills developing open source software, > but if I were a Debian developer, who had adhered to the debian Social > Contract [1],

Re: [DNG] Debian is endorsed by Microsoft

On Thursday, January 21, 2016 12:08 PM, Simon Hobson wrote: > KatolaZ wrote: > > Whether supporting Debian on Azure is just logical, or there's an ulterior > motive, it's happened and we don't know which reason it is. What I am sure > about

Re: [DNG] Apparently Jessie has runit

On 21/01/16 11:20, Simon Hobson wrote: > Daniel Reurich wrote: > >> perhaps doing the same thing as init-system-helpers dh_systemd package >> to add support for runit into each respective package. > > That's the logical way to do it - the init script(s) should be part

Re: [DNG] Debian is endorsed by Microsoft

On Thu, Jan 21, 2016 at 10:12:08AM +, Simon Hobson wrote: [cut] > > > I have to say that some of what I see written on this list plays right into > the "bunch of hippies with an axe to grind" stereotype some people like to > bash GNU/Linux/FOSS with. > I realise some people have strong

Re: [DNG] Debian is endorsed by Microsoft

Le 20/01/2016 23:25, dev1fanboy a écrit : Not surprising. They already threw a party for Debian 8 (not debian in general, but debian 8). http://openness.microsoft.com/blog/2015/04/21/microsoft-debian-8-linuxfest/ The ethical break down is enough of a reason for them to throw a party imho. On

Re: [DNG] Does dunst require dbus?

Le 21/01/2016 05:57, Simon Wise a écrit : On 19/01/16 04:59, Steve Litt wrote: On Mon, 18 Jan 2016 13:31:43 +1100 Simon Wise wrote: But recently discovered that xfce4-terminal loses critical functionality without a session dbus running (it no longer connects to the cut

Re: [DNG] Apparently Jessie has runit

Daniel Reurich wrote: > perhaps doing the same thing as init-system-helpers dh_systemd package > to add support for runit into each respective package. That's the logical way to do it - the init script(s) should be part of the package. The downside of that is the

Re: [DNG] Debian is endorsed by Microsoft

Didier Kryn wrote: >It's absolutely amazing that one can be a Debian developper and a member > of Microsoft in the same time. Yes, that's an ethical break down of the whole > Debian project. I think some people are reading more into this than they should. There is no reason

Re: [DNG] Apparently Jessie has runit

Rainer Weikusat wrote: >> - Some headers to tell utilities what runlevels the service should run >> at, and dependencies. > > That's a LSB invention. It's a grotesque travesty as it uses 'magic > comments' to embed a declarative mini programming language in an

Re: [DNG] Apparently Jessie has runit

> As I mentioned before, I run quite a bunch of Debian servers (wheezy > and jessie) with runit as both process supervisor and init system. > To simplify deployment I wrote small debian packages for my run > scripts. It's definitely not production ready, but it's been working > for me for years.

Re: [DNG] Apparently Jessie has runit

On 20/01/16 20:57, Steve Litt wrote: > People aren't completely alone on run scripts: I can give them any run > scripts I'm using. Also, Runit run scripts are *nothing* like sysvinit > or OpenRC init scripts: Most are five lines or less, few are over 10 > lines. As I mentioned before, I run quite

Re: [DNG] Debian is endorsed by Microsoft

dev1fanboy wrote: > So for having our own values we are a "hardcore cult", how dare we voice our > opinions or stand up for our values (like anyone else in the free software > community, btw). Better yet, let's go back to debian because otherwise we're > elitists.

Re: [DNG] Apparently Jessie has runit

Hendrik Boom writes: > On Thu, Jan 21, 2016 at 09:14:48AM +, Simon Hobson wrote: > >> Rainer Weikusat wrote: >> >> > The sendmail init scripts is 1340 lines long, 901 of which contain code. >> >> I wasn't aware of that, I am inclined

Re: [DNG] Does dunst require dbus?

On Thu, Jan 21, 2016 at 11:03:18AM +0100, Didier Kryn wrote: > Le 21/01/2016 05:57, Simon Wise a écrit : > >On 19/01/16 04:59, Steve Litt wrote: > >>On Mon, 18 Jan 2016 13:31:43 +1100 > >>Simon Wise wrote: > >> > >>>But recently discovered that xfce4-terminal loses critical

Re: [DNG] Debian is endorsed by Microsoft

Simon Hobson writes: > dev1fanboy wrote: > >> So for having our own values we are a "hardcore cult", how dare we >> voice our opinions or stand up for our values (like anyone else in >> the free software community, btw). Better yet, let's go

Re: [DNG] Does dunst require dbus?

Le 21/01/2016 12:33, Hendrik Boom a écrit : On Thu, Jan 21, 2016 at 11:03:18AM +0100, Didier Kryn wrote: Le 21/01/2016 05:57, Simon Wise a écrit : On 19/01/16 04:59, Steve Litt wrote: On Mon, 18 Jan 2016 13:31:43 +1100 Simon Wise wrote: But recently discovered that

Re: [DNG] Apparently Jessie has runit

Mat wrote: >> That's the logical way to do it - the init script(s) should be part of the >> package. The downside of that is the requirement for every package >> maintainer (team) to understand and support multiple init systems - or for >> someone supporting an init system

Re: [DNG] Debian is endorsed by Microsoft

Le 21/01/2016 13:08, Simon Hobson a écrit : What if we s/Microsoft/Rackspace/ (you can use pretty well any hosting outfit really) The basic underlying thing that this announcement shows is that ${company} now supports ${OS} on it's hosting platform. Yes, the sole reason they are doing it where

Re: [DNG] Apparently Jessie has runit

On Thu, Jan 21, 2016 at 09:14:48AM +, Simon Hobson wrote: > Rainer Weikusat wrote: > > > The sendmail init scripts is 1340 lines long, 901 of which contain code. > > I wasn't aware of that, I am inclined to agree that it sounds "way too much" Presuably

Re: [DNG] Debian is endorsed by Microsoft

As long as this made some impact, I'd like to point out that, in my opinion, 'tis not bad when particular people work in particular companies, while having a part time job in other projects. Linux, GNU and their childer should not be affiliated with companies such as Microsoft. Microsoft has

Re: [DNG] Debian is endorsed by Microsoft

On 21/01/16 08:21 AM, Marlon Nunes wrote: On 2016-01-21 09:32, KatolaZ wrote: On Thu, Jan 21, 2016 at 12:08:19PM +, Simon Hobson wrote: KatolaZ wrote: > Well, not everybody pays his bills developing open source software, > but if I were a Debian developer, who had

Re: [DNG] desktop-base package review

Daniel Reurich writes: > I'd like some other eyes to look over my code and point out any > improvements/flaw. > > I haven't tested the code for setting the GRUB_THEME variable in > /etc/default/grub (in debian/postinst) and I think it's rather crude to > do it that way.

Re: [DNG] Apparently Jessie has runit

Joel Roth wrote: > Steve Litt wrote: > Hi Steve, > > How complicated is it to port such scripts to runit? Exim4's > init.d script is 275 lines. I see there is a library of scripts for runit, although the page seems somewhat stale. For example, exim 3 only.

Re: [DNG] Apparently Jessie has runit

On Wed, 20 Jan 2016 21:20:26 -1000 Joel Roth wrote: > Steve Litt wrote: > > On Wed, 20 Jan 2016 20:23:10 + > > Rainer Weikusat wrote: > > > > > Steve Litt writes: > > > > People aren't completely alone on run

[DNG] The Stone Truth: was Debian is endorsed by Microsoft

On Thu, 21 Jan 2016 12:32:01 + KatolaZ wrote: > The real support to GNU/Linux and > Debian has come from silent hackers. The preceding sentence is the Stone Truth, and should be inscribed in an image visible to all who use Linux for more than as a ticket to a salary.

Re: [DNG] Debian is endorsed by Microsoft

On Thu, 21 Jan 2016 15:46:55 +0100, Didier wrote in message <56a0ef5f.3050...@in2p3.fr>: > Le 21/01/2016 13:08, Simon Hobson a écrit : > > What if we s/Microsoft/Rackspace/ > > (you can use pretty well any hosting outfit really) > > The basic underlying thing that this announcement shows is that

Re: [DNG] Apparently Jessie has runit

On Thu, Jan 21, 2016 at 06:52:07PM -0500, Steve Litt wrote: [cut] > > Here's pseudocode for the typical Runit run script that runs as root, > doesn't need GUI capabilities, and needs no environment variables: > > = > #!/bin/sh > exec 2>&1 > exec

Re: [DNG] Apparently Jessie has runit

Simon Hobson writes: > Rainer Weikusat wrote: >>> - Some headers to tell utilities what runlevels the service should run >>> at, and dependencies. >> >> That's a LSB invention. It's a grotesque travesty as it uses 'magic >> comments' to

Re: [DNG] Does dunst require dbus?

On Thu, 21 Jan 2016 11:03:18 +0100 Didier Kryn wrote: > I installed roxterm and rox-filer. Both are just nice behaving. > roxterm doesn't seem to differ in apearence, configurability or > behaviour, from xfce4-terminal or gnome-terminal. I too have used rox-filer (but not

Re: [DNG] Does dunst require dbus?

On Thu, Jan 21, 2016 at 04:57:28PM +0100, Didier Kryn wrote: > Le 21/01/2016 12:33, Hendrik Boom a écrit : > >So I tried installing it, and found that it recommended zeroinstall-injector. > >Anyone know what this is? It seems to be a "platform-independent > >package manager". What does this

[DNG] desktop-base package review

Hi Daniel, On 01/21/2016 11:11 PM, Daniel Reurich wrote: Hi, I've been hacking on the desktop-base package to add a bunch of features like monitor size & aspect ratio detection to improve our chances of selecting the best artwork, adding support for grub2 themes and

Re: [DNG] Debian is endorsed by Microsoft

Hi List, ... Follow the money... Maybe this is related too? http://mjg59.dreamwidth.org/39546.html The Linux Foundation quietly dropped community representation. No more voting rights for simple members. Looks like a coup to me. And that begs the question: "Who is Karen Sandler?"

Re: [DNG] Debian is endorsed by Microsoft

On Thu, 21 Jan 2016 12:08:19 + Simon Hobson wrote: > reading this list is like being at an evangelical meeting of some > hardcore cult - and that *IS* very off-putting to a large number of > people. Both clauses of the preceding partial sentence are absolutely true.

Re: [DNG] Does dunst require dbus?

On 22/01/16 07:41, Hendrik Boom wrote: On Thu, Jan 21, 2016 at 04:57:28PM +0100, Didier Kryn wrote: Le 21/01/2016 12:33, Hendrik Boom a écrit : I suspect that zeroinstall is the native, cross-platform package installer that Rox uses, and quite possibly that a lot of the file-type handlers

Re: [DNG] Does dunst require dbus?

On 21/01/16 21:03, Didier Kryn wrote: Le 21/01/2016 05:57, Simon Wise a écrit : On 19/01/16 04:59, Steve Litt wrote: On Mon, 18 Jan 2016 13:31:43 +1100 Simon Wise wrote: But recently discovered that xfce4-terminal loses critical functionality without a session dbus

Re: [DNG] Does dunst require dbus?

On 22/01/16 02:57, Didier Kryn wrote: Le 21/01/2016 12:33, Hendrik Boom a écrit : Might it alleviate some of the above complaints? I always use apt-get install --no-install-recommends, or "default upgrade" in Synaptic. And I don't look at the recommended packages :-) This "recommends"

Re: [DNG] Debian is endorsed by Microsoft

On Thu, 21 Jan 2016 14:41:40 + Simon Hobson wrote: > dev1fanboy wrote: > > > So for having our own values we are a "hardcore cult", how dare we > > voice our opinions or stand up for our values (like anyone else in > > the free software

Re: [DNG] Does dunst require dbus?

On Fri, 22 Jan 2016 14:52:39 +1100 Simon Wise wrote: > On 22/01/16 02:57, Didier Kryn wrote: > > This "recommends" feature has become a kind of bin for packages the > > maintainers would like desperately to "require" for obscure > > reasons, but they fail to find a valid

Re: [DNG] Does dunst require dbus?

On Fri, 22 Jan 2016 14:47:59 +1100 Simon Wise wrote: > The second advantage for me (since I use colours to indicate some > tasks) is the profile/theme configuration is easier to deal with and > file based. Yes! After the last time I did an rm -rf on my laptop, only to

Re: [DNG] Apparently Jessie has runit

Steve Litt wrote: > On Wed, 20 Jan 2016 21:20:26 -1000 > Joel Roth wrote: > > > > Hi Steve, > > > > How complicated is it to port such scripts to runit? Exim4's > > init.d script is 275 lines. > > > > Joel > > Hi Joel, > > According to