Re: [DNSOP] New Version Notification for draft-pwouters-powerbind-00.txt (fwd)

2018-03-21 Thread Michael Casadevall
Paul: Thanks for the explanation, it clears up a fair bit for me. Replies inline. On 03/20/2018 09:48 AM, Paul Wouters wrote: > On Tue, 20 Mar 2018, Michael Casadevall wrote: > >> Without the RRtypes logged, I'm not seeing how you're supposed to be >> able to audit them. In the case where a KSK is

Re: [DNSOP] New Version Notification for draft-pwouters-powerbind-00.txt (fwd)

2018-03-20 Thread Paul Wouters
On Tue, 20 Mar 2018, Michael Casadevall wrote: Certificate Transparency works because specifically because the entire certificate is uploaded, and (assuming a valid cert) a SCT is generated which can be verified by cross-checking it against the log servers public key. Without the RRtypes logged

Re: [DNSOP] New Version Notification for draft-pwouters-powerbind-00.txt (fwd)

2018-03-20 Thread Michael Casadevall
On 03/20/2018 07:44 AM, Paul Wouters wrote: > The goal of the document is to make such malicious changes visible. > > If the parent needs to replace NS/DS records, these are easily > auditable identically to Certificate Transparency (rfc 6962bis) > We only need to look (log) the DS/DNSKEY and we

Re: [DNSOP] New Version Notification for draft-pwouters-powerbind-00.txt (fwd)

2018-03-20 Thread Paul Wouters
On Tue, 20 Mar 2018, Stephane Bortzmeyer wrote: The 'delegation-only' flag does not *by itself* prevent parent domains from answering authoritatively for their child domains, but it could make "certificate-transparency" more tractable for DNSSEC. I don't think that you replied to Bob's remark.

Re: [DNSOP] New Version Notification for draft-pwouters-powerbind-00.txt (fwd)

2018-03-20 Thread Stephane Bortzmeyer
On Mon, Mar 19, 2018 at 07:49:45PM +, Viktor Dukhovni wrote a message of 30 lines which said: > The 'delegation-only' flag does not *by itself* prevent parent > domains from answering authoritatively for their child domains, but > it could make "certificate-transparency" more tractable for

Re: [DNSOP] New Version Notification for draft-pwouters-powerbind-00.txt (fwd)

2018-03-19 Thread Robert Edmonds
Paul Wouters wrote: > On Mon, 19 Mar 2018, Robert Edmonds wrote: > > > Viktor Dukhovni wrote: > > > The idea is to log the DNSKEY RRs observed at each zone apex. > > > Without the proposed flag, one would also have to log denial of > > > existence which would make the logs much too large. > > > >

Re: [DNSOP] New Version Notification for draft-pwouters-powerbind-00.txt (fwd)

2018-03-19 Thread Paul Wouters
On Mon, 19 Mar 2018, Stephane Bortzmeyer wrote: I'm opposed to this idea. Can you clarify whether you oppose to be a user of this new flag, or whether you oppose of giving others the option of using this flag? While the root and TLD zones are asumed to be almost exclusively delegation-only z

Re: [DNSOP] New Version Notification for draft-pwouters-powerbind-00.txt (fwd)

2018-03-19 Thread Paul Wouters
On Mon, 19 Mar 2018, Robert Edmonds wrote: Viktor Dukhovni wrote: The idea is to log the DNSKEY RRs observed at each zone apex. Without the proposed flag, one would also have to log denial of existence which would make the logs much too large. Can you expand on what you mean by "much too larg

Re: [DNSOP] New Version Notification for draft-pwouters-powerbind-00.txt (fwd)

2018-03-19 Thread Robert Edmonds
Viktor Dukhovni wrote: > The idea is to log the DNSKEY RRs observed at each zone apex. > Without the proposed flag, one would also have to log denial of > existence which would make the logs much too large. Can you expand on what you mean by "much too large"? There are already existing large scale

Re: [DNSOP] New Version Notification for draft-pwouters-powerbind-00.txt (fwd)

2018-03-19 Thread Viktor Dukhovni
On Mon, Mar 19, 2018 at 02:12:38PM -0400, Bob Harold wrote: > > > We have just submitted a draft aimed at increasing the security of > > > the DNSSEC with respect to the power that parental zones have over > > > their children. > > > > I'm opposed to this idea. > > If the parent simply pointed the

Re: [DNSOP] New Version Notification for draft-pwouters-powerbind-00.txt (fwd)

2018-03-19 Thread Bob Harold
On Mon, Mar 19, 2018 at 12:34 PM, Stephane Bortzmeyer wrote: > On Mon, Mar 19, 2018 at 08:22:03AM -0400, > Paul Wouters wrote > a message of 57 lines which said: > > > We have just submitted a draft aimed at increasing the security of > > the DNSSEC with respect to the power that parental zone

Re: [DNSOP] New Version Notification for draft-pwouters-powerbind-00.txt (fwd)

2018-03-19 Thread Stephane Bortzmeyer
On Mon, Mar 19, 2018 at 08:22:03AM -0400, Paul Wouters wrote a message of 57 lines which said: > We have just submitted a draft aimed at increasing the security of > the DNSSEC with respect to the power that parental zones have over > their children. I'm opposed to this idea. > While the roo

[DNSOP] New Version Notification for draft-pwouters-powerbind-00.txt (fwd)

2018-03-19 Thread Paul Wouters
We have just submitted a draft aimed at increasing the security of the DNSSEC with respect to the power that parental zones have over their children. The aim of this draft is twofold: 1) Allow zones to publicly commit to being delegation_only zones. The aim here is to counter the argument that