[EM] Declaring victory?

2005-05-30 Thread MIKE OSSIPOFF
I haven't yet posted my final reply to Russ, and so I'll reply to this. I'd thought that this was one of Russ's political off-topic postings, due to its subject-line. Russ says: Well, if Saddam Hussein could declare victory after the 1991 Gulf War, I suppose Mike can declare victory here. I r

[EM] Re: majority rule, mutinous pirates, and voterstrategy

2005-05-30 Thread Stephane Rouillon
> Abd ul-Rahman Lomax a écrit : > > > [...] You may > > increase meeting efficiency by excluding minority factions, but at the cost > > of potentially excluding them in deliberations toward consensus. This is not necessary. The efficiency aspect can be treated after the representation exercise. Ma

Re: [EM] Re: majority rule, mutinous pirates, and voter strategy

2005-05-30 Thread Stephane Rouillon
Juho just showed another way of using time to get some efficiency without sacrifying fairness. A better example than any I could provide... My sincere congratulations, Steph. Juho Laatu a écrit : > Hello James, > > In the pirate example one could take a step in the direction of > proportional re

Re: [EM] Re: majority rule, mutinous pirates, and voter strategy

2005-05-30 Thread Stephane Rouillon
James, I never said that the electorate will was to identify itself to some political parties. You mix the fact that I use political parties in SPPA to simplify ballot treatment in order to get nearer our common objective (a representative chamber that is independent of party lines) and the fact

Re: [EM] Reward oiffensive truncation to avoid order-reversal? :-)

2005-05-30 Thread Stephane Rouillon
This is exactly the point. For Mike it is obvious, that burying-strategy is riskier. For me, offensive truncation can be as much dangerous. Yes burying as a double weight compared and it should hurt more when your strategy comes back right against your favorite, but it is easier to predict, becaus

[EM] Proof that the CDTT is monotonic

2005-05-30 Thread Kevin Venzke
Hello, While this may be obvious to some, I don't think it was ever shown, that the CDTT is monotonic. So: Raising A, when A is a CDTT set member, can't cause any other candidate to enter the CDTT. Let "A>B" mean "A has a majority-strength win over B," and let "A->B" mean "A has a majority-stren

[EM] Monotonicity example: CDTT,FPP vs CDTT//FPP

2005-05-30 Thread Kevin Venzke
Hi, The main reason to use the comma version rather than the // version is monotonicity. This is a bit difficult to demonstrate with CDTT,IRV, since neither version satisfies it. So here's an example using CDTT,FPP and CDTT//FPP: 9 A 8 B 5 C 2 C>B CDTT is {a,b,c}. CDTT//FPP elects A. CDTT,FPP el

[EM] CDTT,IRV (Chris)

2005-05-30 Thread Chris Benham
Kevin, (Sorry list about the double posting and pairwise matrix tables mess. I copied something from an on-line vote calculator which looked ok when I sent it.) I had written: Take this really outrageous scenario (one of James G-A's): 46: A>B>C 44: B>C>A (sincere is BA>C) 05: C>A>B 0

[EM] CDTT, IRV is IRV with pre-elimination

2005-05-30 Thread Chris Benham
Mike O., You wrote (Sun.May29): I don't understand the difference between CDTT,IRV and CDTT//IRV. With the // version, first the candidates that are not in the CDTT are identified and then they are dropped from the ballots and the IRV count is carried out as if though those eliminated can

[EM] CDTT, IRV is IRV with pre-elimination

2005-05-30 Thread Chris Benham
Mike O., You wrote (Sun.May29): I don't understand the difference between CDTT,IRV and CDTT//IRV. With the // version, first the candidates that are not in the CDTT are identified and then they are dropped from the ballots and the IRV count is carried out as if though those eliminated can

[EM] Reply to December MMPO comments

2005-05-30 Thread Chris Benham
Mike, Those quotes that you attributed to Gervase Lam were actually things I wrote. http://lists.electorama.com/pipermail/election-methods-electorama.com/2004-December/014320.html To me the price MMPO (MinMax Pairwise Opposition) pays for strategy benefits you describe is just far too h