Ok, there's no getting through to Tom or Don on this issue.
What this shows is that, with so many ways to count ranked ballots,
lots of people will be confused about it, and there's a good chance
that we'll end up with a rank-count, IRV in particular, that's nowhere
near as good as Approval.
Because there IS no best that will be agreed by all.
But presumably there are some methods that seem to _you_ to be better
than others. So why should you advocate less.
Majority rule is not a
well defined concept with 3 or more choices.
...certainly not by IRVies. There are 2 definitions of
01 3:17 AM
Subject: Re: [EM] Unranked IRV versus Approval - divergent winners exist!
Ok, there's no getting through to Tom or Don on this issue.
What this shows is that, with so many ways to count ranked ballots,
lots of people will be confused about it, and there's a good chance
that we
- Original Message -
From: "MIKE OSSIPOFF" [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Monday, April 02, 2001 3:33 AM
Subject: Re: [EM] Unranked IRV versus Approval - divergent winners exist!
Because there IS no best that will be agreed by all.
But presumably ther
If a majority supports a single candidate, any method may do. The question
is how do you convince people to compromise to find a majority among 3 or
more strong choices.
Oh is that the question? I thought the question was about what
majority rule means with more than 2 candidates. I answered
From: Tom Ruen
Subject: Re: [EM] Unranked IRV versus Approval - divergent winners exist!
My main defense for and attraction to Unranked-IRV is that
it satisfies the one vote/seat rule of our current
elections. It is a good compromise in my opinion since it
is just another way to count
[fwd: missent]
Tom Ruen wrote:
My point is a runoff process works to identify strong candidates and
so this
should be a minimum reform over plurality.
Agreed. Plurality is sick, and IRV would be a good deal better. If it's
a choice
between IRV or Plurality I'd prefer IRV - but I'd prefer
From: Tom Ruen
Subject: Re: [EM] Unranked IRV versus Approval - divergent winners exist!
My main defense for and attraction to Unranked-IRV is that
it satisfies the one vote/seat rule of our current
elections. It is a good compromise in my opinion since it ...
Your vote is your
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Sunday, April 01, 2001 5:11 PM
Subject: Re: [EM] Unranked IRV versus Approval - divergent winners exist!
Tom Ruen wrote:
About the instability of elimination among 3 strong candidates, in
ranked or
unranked IRV, I'm still not overly afraid. Small spoilers are the
[some snippage: apologies if I've mis-snipped, but I wanted to keep some vague
attempt at focus]
Tom Ruen wrote:
Plurality among 3 is like a game of chicken between toy cars and real cars,
except the toy cars can afford to crash while the big ones often manage to
get wrecked too!
Runoffs
.
Tom
- Original Message -
From: "Martin Harper" [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Sunday, April 01, 2001 7:55 PM
Subject: Re: [EM] Unranked IRV versus Approval - divergent winners exist!
[some snippage: apologies if I've mis-snipped, but I wanted to keep some
vagu
candidates rather than who is going
to give the biggest tax cuts or entitlements to voters.
Tom Ruen
- Original Message -
From: Bart Ingles [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Thursday, March 29, 2001 2:32 AM
Subject: Re: [EM] Unranked IRV versus Approval - divergent winners exist
Tom Ruen wrote:
About the instability of elimination among 3 strong candidates, in ranked or
unranked IRV, I'm still not overly afraid. Small spoilers are the more
common enemy.
Well, they are at the moment, cause Plurality kills off small spoilers before
they have a chance to grow into
What if Unranked-IRV is equivalent to Approval (for single seat
elections)?!
My intuition offers a sweet reply, although I may be wrong.
It can't really be! But where is a counter-example? I would think if it is
false, a counter example would exist for 3 candidates.
Didn't I post an example
Here's a simple case of interest between these methods. This case makes
UIRV's top bias obvious.
Let A and B be two strong parties, and C is a "weaker" centrist. A and B
supporters are scared and some compromise to C, while C's core supporters
all bullet vote in the middle.
Approval Ballots:
What if Unranked-IRV is equivalent to Approval (for single seat elections)?!
My intuition offers a sweet reply, although I may be wrong.
It can't really be! But where is a counter-example? I would think if it is
false, a counter example would exist for 3 candidates.
Given 6 types of approval
Well! Unranked-IRV does diverge from Approval voting, although perhaps only
barely!
Being fundamentally lazy, I did a computer search! :)
For a simple survey, I searched for ballots {A,B,C,AB,BC,AC} with counts
0..9 for each. (10^6=1 million elections)
--
Example #1: (21 voters)
17 matches
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