Re: Why Objective Values Exist

2007-08-28 Thread Torgny Tholerus
[EMAIL PROTECTED] skrev: (7) From (3) mathematical concepts are objectively real. But there exist mathematical concepts (inifinite sets) which cannot be explained in terms of finite physical processes. How can you prove that infinite sets exists? -- Torgny Tholerus

Re: Why Objective Values Exist

2007-08-28 Thread Stathis Papaioannou
On 28/08/07, David Nyman [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: What if someone simply claimed that they couldn't see how circulation was the same as cardiovascular activity: they could understand that the heart was a pump, the blood a fluid, the blood vessels conduits, but the circulatory system as a

Re: Why Objective Values Exist

2007-08-28 Thread marc . geddes
On Aug 28, 6:31 pm, Torgny Tholerus [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: [EMAIL PROTECTED] skrev: (7) From (3) mathematical concepts are objectively real. But there exist mathematical concepts (inifinite sets) which cannot be explained in terms of finite physical processes. How can you prove

Re: Why Objective Values Exist

2007-08-28 Thread Stathis Papaioannou
On 28/08/07, [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: What if someone simply claimed that they couldn't see how circulation was the same as cardiovascular activity: they could understand that the heart was a pump, the blood a fluid, the blood vessels conduits, but the circulatory

Re: Observer Moment = Sigma1-Sentences

2007-08-28 Thread Bruno Marchal
Le 27-août-07, à 13:27, David Nyman a écrit : On 16/08/07, Bruno Marchal [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: If you drop a pen, to compute EXACTLY what will happen in principle, you have to consider all comp histories in UD* (the complete development of the UD) going through your actual state

Re: Why Objective Values Exist

2007-08-28 Thread Brent Meeker
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Aug 28, 12:53 am, Stathis Papaioannou [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On 27/08/07, [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I accept that there is more than one way to describe reality, and I accept the concept of supervenience, but where I differ with you

Re: Observer Moment = Sigma1-Sentences

2007-08-28 Thread David Nyman
On 28/08/07, Bruno Marchal [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: If you drop a pen, to compute EXACTLY what will happen in principle, you have to consider all comp histories in UD* (the complete development of the UD) going through your actual state (the higher level description of it, which

Re: Why Objective Values Exist

2007-08-28 Thread marc . geddes
On Aug 29, 4:20 am, Brent Meeker [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Thanks for spelling it out. (1) Mathematical concepts are indispensible to our explanations of reality. So are grammatical concepts. No they aren't. Grammatical concepts are human creations, which is precisely shown by the

Re: Why Objective Values Exist

2007-08-28 Thread marc . geddes
On Aug 29, 4:03 am, Brent Meeker [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: There is this special quality of subjective experience: that which is left over after all the objective (third person knowable) information is accounted for. Nevertheless, the subjective experience can be perfectly reproduced by

Re: Why Objective Values Exist

2007-08-28 Thread Brent Meeker
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Aug 29, 4:20 am, Brent Meeker [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Thanks for spelling it out. (1) Mathematical concepts are indispensible to our explanations of reality. So are grammatical concepts. No they aren't. Grammatical concepts are human creations, which is