Re: COMP refutation paper - finally out

2011-06-16 Thread Colin Hales
Hi Russel, 1) Strong CT/Deutch...will look it up...Sounds like one of the conflations in operation: confusing the natural world with some kind of computer running rules, rather than something natural merely behaving rule-ly to an observing scientist. 2) Re: angry popperians...the role of

Re: COMP refutation paper - finally out

2011-06-16 Thread Bruno Marchal
On 15 Jun 2011, at 18:47, meekerdb wrote: On 6/15/2011 6:56 AM, Bruno Marchal wrote: Doesn't this objection only apply to attempts to construct an AI with human-equivalent intelligence? As a counter example I'm thinking here of Ben Goertzel's OpenCog, an attempt at artificial general

Re: COMP refutation paper - finally out

2011-06-16 Thread Bruno Marchal
Hi Benjayk, Bruno Marchal wrote: We just cannot do artificial intelligence in a provable manner. We need chance, or luck. Even if we get some intelligent machine, we will not know-it-for sure (perhaps just believe it correctly). But this is a quite weak statement, isn't it? It just

Re: COMP refutation paper - finally out

2011-06-16 Thread Bruno Marchal
On 15 Jun 2011, at 21:20, benjayk wrote: Hi Bruno, Bruno Marchal wrote: I think that comp might imply that simple virgin (non programmed) universal (and immaterial) machine are already conscious. Perhaps even maximally conscious. What could maximally conscious mean? My intuition says

Re: COMP refutation paper - finally out

2011-06-16 Thread meekerdb
On 6/16/2011 7:38 AM, Bruno Marchal wrote: Concerning the learning competence of a machine, I measure it by the classes of computable functions that the machine is able to identify from finite samples of input-outputs. This leads to the computational learning theory or inductive inference

Re: COMP refutation paper - finally out

2011-06-16 Thread Russell Standish
On Thu, Jun 16, 2011 at 03:34:51PM +0200, Bruno Marchal wrote: So we agree violently on this, to borrow an expression to Russell (I think). To be fair, Brent used this expression when agreeing with me on something. But it is a good one! Cheers --