Re: Why Fedora is for experts only?

2009-07-27 Thread gilpel
Tim wrote: > On Mon, 2009-07-27 at 02:05 +0500, gil...@altern.org wrote: > And we've all be wondering why Windows doesn't "just work" for the last > decade I'm not. Their main problem was secrecy reigned even inside the box. Everybody was developing its own little thing without seeing all the co

Re: Why Fedora is for experts only?

2009-07-26 Thread Tim
On Mon, 2009-07-27 at 02:05 +0500, gil...@altern.org wrote: > So far, Fedora is the one that worked best for me. I'm sure, with a 3 > page list of do and don't, most Windows users could get it running. > The question is "Would they go through a 3 page list?" Knowing that > there will be a whole lot

Re: Why Fedora is for experts only?

2009-07-26 Thread g
Mikkel L. Ellertson wrote: > I guess you do not understand the difference between Red Hat and > Fedora. The two are not interchangeable. I expect Red Hat to acquire > a user base through Red Hat Enterprise Linux. CentOS and Scientific > Linux are two clones of RH Enterprise Linux, without the supp

Re: Why Fedora is for experts only?

2009-07-26 Thread Mikkel L. Ellertson
gil...@altern.org wrote: > Mikkel L. Ellertson wrote: > >> While it is important to you, and important to companies like >> Red Hat, > > So, it's important for Red Hat and until now, your point was that it is > irrelevant to Fedora because Fedora is for experts. So you expect RHEL to > acquire a

Re: Why Fedora is for experts only?

2009-07-26 Thread gilpel
Mikkel L. Ellertson wrote: > While it is important to you, and important to companies like > RedHat, So, it's important for Red Hat and until now, your point was that it is irrelevant to Fedora because Fedora is for experts. So you expect RHEL to acquire a user base by people getting use to it th

Re: Why Fedora is for experts only?

2009-07-26 Thread David Boles
Timothy Murphy wrote: > David Boles wrote: > >> Fedora has its place. Fedora is a distribution for the user that is >> smarter that what they are doing. The user that can solve a little >> problem. > ... >> (K)Ubuntu has its place. They are distribution for the 'install it and >> forget it' crowd.

Re: Why Fedora is for experts only?

2009-07-26 Thread Mikkel L. Ellertson
gil...@altern.org wrote: > > I suppose you're not both wrong, but there are some considerations: > > 1) some peole need a story to get interest into a subject. > That is not usually the case on support lists. > 2) teckies often write short messages and then come back with precisions. > I prefer

Re: Why Fedora is for experts only?

2009-07-26 Thread Timothy Murphy
David Boles wrote: > Fedora has its place. Fedora is a distribution for the user that is > smarter that what they are doing. The user that can solve a little > problem. ... > (K)Ubuntu has its place. They are distribution for the 'install it and > forget it' crowd. They do all the setups and confi

Re: Why Fedora is for experts only?

2009-07-26 Thread Timothy Murphy
gil...@altern.org wrote: > But there's one *stoupid* thing that really puzzles me. When I rebooted > after installation, I noticed there was no pause for choosing the kernel. > I thought maybe that was because there was only one kernel installed. Isn't this just the timeout setting in /etc/grub.c

Re: Why Fedora is for experts only?

2009-07-25 Thread gilpel
Geoff wrote: > And *that* answer does not work. My home dir was already 'user:user'. > I have also confirmed the chcon context is now > 'unconfined_u:object_r:user_home_dir_t:s0' for /home/user > > And it doesn't work! Still get the error and no login. Sorry it didn't work. I'd like to help you mo

Re: Why Fedora is for experts only?

2009-07-25 Thread gilpel
Patrick O'Callaghan wrote: > Very long emails are less likely to be read, especially when they're so > discursive. You seem to be more interested in topics such as market > share than actual technical content Mikkel L. Ellertson thinks the same. I suppose you're not both wrong, but there are some

Re: Why Fedora is for experts only?

2009-07-25 Thread gilpel
Suvayu Ali wrote: > *ubuntu is not that install and forget if you want to do something > serious. I use Fedora 11 at home and Xubuntu 8.04 for work, and every > time I try out something not conventional Fedora works flawlessly > whereas Xubuntu fails big time. I hate it, but the management at our

Re: Why Fedora is for experts only?

2009-07-25 Thread David Boles
Suvayu Ali wrote: > On Saturday 25 July 2009 08:34 AM, David Boles wrote: >> >> (K)Ubuntu has its place. They are distribution for the 'install it and >> forget it' crowd. They do all the setups and configuration and all of >> the nanny hand holding. This 'install it and forget it' crowd then sits

Re: Why Fedora is for experts only?

2009-07-25 Thread R. G. Newbury
gil...@altern.org wrote: R. G. Newbury wrote: > Even better are the stupid messes where there is NO default setting to > change. Google 'kstartupconfig4 error 3' No-one, and I mean no-one knows > what causes this, or how to fix it. It seems somebody at the Fedora Forum had the same problem

Re: Why Fedora is for experts only?

2009-07-25 Thread Suvayu Ali
On Saturday 25 July 2009 08:34 AM, David Boles wrote: (K)Ubuntu has its place. They are distribution for the 'install it and forget it' crowd. They do all the setups and configuration and all of the nanny hand holding. This 'install it and forget it' crowd then sits in front of the monitor and '

Re: Why Fedora is for experts only?

2009-07-25 Thread R. G. Newbury
R. G. Newbury wrote: > > > > It is the lack of documentation which makes Fedora (and Mandriva, and > > Ubuntu) an OS for experts only. > > >You forgot Windows, OS x, and a few more. >Mikkel You are right. I did! Geoff -- Please let me know if anything I say offends you. I

Re: Why Fedora is for experts only?

2009-07-25 Thread Patrick O'Callaghan
Very long emails are less likely to be read, especially when they're so discursive. You seem to be more interested in topics such as market share than actual technical content, which is the focus of this list. If you have a technical question or comment, try to make it succintly. Or maybe this is

Re: Why Fedora is for experts only?

2009-07-25 Thread David Boles
Marko Vojinovic wrote: > On Saturday 25 July 2009 06:11:30 gil...@altern.org wrote: >> jack craig wrote: Really, pausing for a few seconds still seems to me like the best option. The way out is easier than I thought but when a newbie comes to Linux and he's already afraid b

Re: Why Fedora is for experts only?

2009-07-25 Thread Marko Vojinovic
On Saturday 25 July 2009 06:11:30 gil...@altern.org wrote: > jack craig wrote: > >> Really, pausing for a few seconds still seems to me like the best > >> option. > >> The way out is easier than I thought but when a newbie comes to Linux > >> and > >> he's already afraid because everybody says that

Re: Why Fedora is for experts only?

2009-07-24 Thread g
gil...@altern.org wrote: > But there's one *stoupid* thing that really puzzles me. When I rebooted > after installation, I noticed there was no pause for choosing the kernel. > I thought maybe that was because there was only one kernel installed. [the word is 'stupid', but i understand why of y

Re: Why Fedora is for experts only?

2009-07-24 Thread gilpel
jack craig wrote: >> Really, pausing for a few seconds still seems to me like the best >> option. >> The way out is easier than I thought but when a newbie comes to Linux >> and >> he's already afraid because everybody says that Fedora is for experts >> only, he might not look further and give up.

Re: Why Fedora is for experts only?

2009-07-24 Thread gilpel
R. G. Newbury wrote: > On 07/24/2009 06:29 PM, gil...@altern.org wrote > >> I'm trying to figure out what our great experts would lose if there was >> a >> pause for choosing the kernel. If they don't like this setting, they >> wouldn't have to use vi, just the Administration menu. All it takes

Re: Why Fedora is for experts only?

2009-07-24 Thread Mikkel L. Ellertson
R. G. Newbury wrote: > > It is the lack of documentation which makes Fedora (and Mandriva, and > Ubuntu) an OS for experts only. > You forgot Windows, OS x, and a few more. Mikkel -- Do not meddle in the affairs of dragons, for thou art crunchy and taste good with Ketchup! signature.a

Re: Why Fedora is for experts only?

2009-07-24 Thread jack craig
On 07/24/2009 09:43 PM, gil...@altern.org wrote: I'm trying to figure out what our great experts would lose if there was a pause for choosing the kernel. When booting, if you keep pressed the SHIFT key, you will have the grub menu. Interesting. It worked but only after a reset: o

Re: Why Fedora is for experts only?

2009-07-24 Thread gilpel
>> I'm trying to figure out what our great experts would lose if there was >> a >> pause for choosing the kernel. > > When booting, if you keep pressed the SHIFT key, you will have the grub > menu. Interesting. It worked but only after a reset: on the reboot it just blocked and stayed dead. This

Re: Why Fedora is for experts only?

2009-07-24 Thread R. G. Newbury
On 07/24/2009 06:29 PM, gil...@altern.org wrote I'm trying to figure out what our great experts would lose if there was a pause for choosing the kernel. If they don't like this setting, they wouldn't have to use vi, just the Administration menu. All it takes is a few seconds and, thereafter, the

Re: Why Fedora is for experts only?

2009-07-24 Thread Shannon McMackin
On 07/24/2009 05:51 PM, Federico Sebastián De Malmayne Duppa wrote: I'm trying to figure out what our great experts would lose if there was a pause for choosing the kernel. When booting, if you keep pressed the SHIFT key, you will have the grub menu. Any other key may work, but shift was told

Re: Why Fedora is for experts only?

2009-07-24 Thread Federico Sebastián De Malmayne Duppa
> I'm trying to figure out what our great experts would lose if there was a > pause for choosing the kernel. When booting, if you keep pressed the SHIFT key, you will have the grub menu. Any other key may work, but shift was told to be the safest one. -- fedora-list mailing list fedora-list@red

Why Fedora is for experts only?

2009-07-24 Thread gilpel
My first post on this list was a comment on this passage at Distrowatch beginning by "The topic of CentOS": http://distrowatch.com/weekly.php?issue=20090629 Fedora is plainly described as "broken" and "unstable"! Want something that works? Piggyback Red Hat on CentOS! And, of course, all over the