At 5:07 AM +1000 6/03/03, Michael Edwards wrote:

I can't, off the top of my head, think of an alternative way to notate
Viennese waltz rhythm more accurately than based on even beats; maybe one could
be devised, but I suspect it would be far more complicated that a simple triplet
or dotted rhythm.


Or for that matter, tango rhythms, Latin rhythms, Haitian Compas, reggae, a whole lot of South American folk music, and these are just the ones I am familiar with. David Fenton's examples about Mozart ornaments are very on-point as well.


But in swing rhythms, even if a literally-played triplet rhythm doesn't
swing, and even if *true* swing rhythm is very subtle, too much so to be notated
exactly, it does strike me that triplet or dotted-rhythm notation is at least
*closer* to the effect than straight notes. Not necessarily accurate - just at
least a tiny bit closer. Does anyone disagree with that?


Yes, I do. Even eighths are closer to swing in most styles, except for slow tempos in some very old styles. Dotted eighth-sixteenth is very bad, and even when it was current among jazz musicians (this notational practice died a deserved death sometime around 1950) it was kind of a private "code" for "swing this, please" and was never meant to be played anything close to accurately.

Look at the opening to "West Side Story", the Prologue. Lenny notated it in 6/8, with occasional duples, to approximate a swing feel, and it always feels TERRIBLE on first reading, until a wise conductor says, "Just swing it normally, please, and ignore the odd notation." As written, it sounds like somebody trying to dance who has corns, blisters, and a recently severed toe on one foot, and suffers from coughing fits.
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