Re: Purchasing the correct hardware: dual-core intel? Big cache?

2006-04-26 Thread Martin Hepworth
Bill start with looking the DB design - I;ve had batch runs go from 5 days down to 1/2 day purely by tuning the SQL. I'm not kidding, all the DB tuning quides say look at the SQL/design first, then look at hardware like disk/data layout, then finally the CPU. There's lots of info about tuning

Re: Purchasing the correct hardware: dual-core intel? Big cache?

2006-04-25 Thread Martin Hepworth
Bill if the database is CPU dependant I'd look at tuning the queries/indexes and that stuff...it really shouldn't be CPU bound. -- martin On 4/24/06, Bill Moran [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Mon, 24 Apr 2006 23:03:59 +0100 Martin Hepworth [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Bill depends on the

Re: Purchasing the correct hardware: dual-core intel? Big cache?

2006-04-25 Thread Bill Moran
On Tue, 25 Apr 2006 13:28:50 +0100 Martin Hepworth [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Bill if the database is CPU dependant I'd look at tuning the queries/indexes and that stuff...it really shouldn't be CPU bound. That's in progress, and it's going to be an ongoing process as the application goes

Re: Purchasing the correct hardware: dual-core intel? Big cache?

2006-04-25 Thread Bill Moran
On Mon, 24 Apr 2006 18:31:46 -0500 Derek Ragona [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: You can get better information directly from intel's website on motherboards and CPU performance. Dual core is faster than hyperthreaded CPU's usually about 20% if you use the larger CPU cache models. I don't follow

Re: Purchasing the correct hardware: dual-core intel? Big cache?

2006-04-25 Thread Derek Ragona
Yes, dual core is on average 20% faster than hyperthreaded CPU's. But that is general benchmark. The range of performance difference is 10% - 30% depending on the application mix. If you use well optimized applications, you see the larger performance gain. Poor optimization causes a CPU to

Re: Purchasing the correct hardware: dual-core intel? Big cache?

2006-04-25 Thread Derek Ragona
If your database application is CPU bound, you may need to re-architect the database. You may need more indexes. You may be calculating values on queries, rather than storing calculated values. There are many ways to optimize a RDBMS performance, but the first thing to do is analyze the

Re: Purchasing the correct hardware: dual-core intel? Big cache?

2006-04-25 Thread Bill Moran
On Tue, 25 Apr 2006 07:56:03 -0500 Derek Ragona [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Yes, dual core is on average 20% faster than hyperthreaded CPU's. But that is general benchmark. The range of performance difference is 10% - 30% depending on the application mix. Thanks. If you use well optimized

Re: Purchasing the correct hardware: dual-core intel? Big cache?

2006-04-25 Thread Derek Ragona
Bill, Never assume . . . Depending on where you got the PostgreSQL, was it in binary form or source. Most binarys are NOT optimized for higher end, more current processors, rather they are optimized for the most common family of CPU's. But if your database application is really CPU bound,

Re: Purchasing the correct hardware: dual-core intel? Big cache?

2006-04-25 Thread Bill Moran
On Tue, 25 Apr 2006 07:59:29 -0500 Derek Ragona [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: If your database application is CPU bound, you may need to re-architect the database. You may need more indexes. You may be calculating values on queries, rather than storing calculated values. I appreciate your

Re: Purchasing the correct hardware: dual-core intel? Big cache?

2006-04-25 Thread Chuck Swiger
Bill Moran wrote: [ ... ] If you use well optimized applications, you see the larger performance gain. Poor optimization causes a CPU to chug along, flushing the CPU cache often, and slowing things down considerably. I know. That's why I'm so desperately trying to find a way to determine

Re: Purchasing the correct hardware: dual-core intel? Big cache?

2006-04-25 Thread Bill Moran
On Tue, 25 Apr 2006 09:48:21 -0400 Chuck Swiger [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Bill Moran wrote: [ ... ] If you use well optimized applications, you see the larger performance gain. Poor optimization causes a CPU to chug along, flushing the CPU cache often, and slowing things down

Re: Purchasing the correct hardware: dual-core intel? Big cache?

2006-04-25 Thread Chuck Swiger
Bill Moran wrote: On Tue, 25 Apr 2006 09:48:21 -0400 Chuck Swiger [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: [ ...long explanation snipped for brevity... :-) ] Thanks, Chuck. Most welcome. What I'm looking for is a way to measure this on the current machines we're using so I can make a prediction as to

Re: Purchasing the correct hardware: dual-core intel? Big cache?

2006-04-25 Thread Erik Trulsson
On Tue, Apr 25, 2006 at 09:59:20AM -0400, Bill Moran wrote: On Tue, 25 Apr 2006 09:48:21 -0400 Chuck Swiger [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Bill Moran wrote: [ ... ] If you use well optimized applications, you see the larger performance gain. Poor optimization causes a CPU to chug along,

Re: Purchasing the correct hardware: dual-core intel? Big cache?

2006-04-25 Thread Michal Mertl
Bill Moran wrote: I've been asked to make some hardware recommendations, I'm hoping some folks on the list can make some suggestions. We're looking hard at getting either Intel dual-core procs, or getting hyperthreaded procs with huge (8M) caches. We currently have

Purchasing the correct hardware: dual-core intel? Big cache?

2006-04-24 Thread Bill Moran
I've been asked to make some hardware recommendations, I'm hoping some folks on the list can make some suggestions. We're looking hard at getting either Intel dual-core procs, or getting hyperthreaded procs with huge (8M) caches. We currently have a few dual proc Intel HT machines that we can

Re: Purchasing the correct hardware: dual-core intel? Big cache?

2006-04-24 Thread Martin Hepworth
Bill depends on the application itself, but more RAM and the disk layout (RAID) will be more important than the CPU. Also depends on how write-heavy the apps are... -- martin On 4/24/06, Bill Moran [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I've been asked to make some hardware recommendations, I'm hoping

Re: Purchasing the correct hardware: dual-core intel? Big cache?

2006-04-24 Thread Bill Moran
On Mon, 24 Apr 2006 23:03:59 +0100 Martin Hepworth [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Bill depends on the application itself, but more RAM and the disk layout (RAID) will be more important than the CPU. Also depends on how write-heavy the apps are... Thanks for the feedback, Martin. I'm fully aware