Re: [Freetel-codec2] new waveform

2014-03-02 Thread David Rowe
> How long to synchronize? TBD but one 400ms frame I would guess. > Any PAPR differences? The waveform has 8 x 100 baud carriers so perhaps a PAPR improvement. - David -- Subversion Kills Productivity. Get off Subve

Re: [Freetel-codec2] FDM Subband Thoughts

2014-03-02 Thread David Rowe
A repeatable test in simulation form would be better. Also some way to define when a version fails. On Sun, 2014-03-02 at 17:34 -0600, Ham Radio Java wrote: > On Sun, Mar 2, 2014 at 4:50 PM, David Rowe wrote: > > Key question here is - how would you test any changes? > > > It

[Freetel-codec2] Radio control server thoughts

2014-03-02 Thread Nate Bargmann
Regarding the thoughts on a rig control "server" if you will. Bruce mentioned rigctld about which I replied currently lacks what I believe are certain critical features, among them security, proper handling of mutliple clients, and no sequence control for commands. While there is little question t

Re: [Freetel-codec2] FDM Subband Thoughts

2014-03-02 Thread Mel Whitten
...and no fading. :-)Well, actually several of us worked DX with the AOR modems. I have a few QSLs for my effort. It was the most frustrating mode I ever used because of the poor sync robustness. Mel - Original Message - From: Ham Radio Java To: freetel-codec2@lists.so

Re: [Freetel-codec2] FDM Subband Thoughts

2014-03-02 Thread Ham Radio Java
On Sun, Mar 2, 2014 at 4:21 PM, Bruce Perens wrote: > I don't even know how anyone got OFDM to work with an amplifier designed > for SSB. If you just stay out of compression, all is well. I got to work with a religious broadcast station on a clear frequency, and the modem was amazing. He kept

Re: [Freetel-codec2] FDM Subband Thoughts

2014-03-02 Thread Ham Radio Java
On Sun, Mar 2, 2014 at 4:50 PM, David Rowe wrote: > > Key question here is - how would you test any changes? It would not be too difficult, but I was thinking of attacking the band edges. You could do this with another user moving into your edge, and another user noting at which Hz the current

Re: [Freetel-codec2] new waveform

2014-03-02 Thread Bruce Perens
On 03/02/2014 03:11 PM, David Rowe wrote: > I have a candidate waveform (i.e. modulation and coding combination) that has > a 10dB improvement over the current FreeDV waveform. We'd be happy with a 6 dB real-life improvement. If you can really get 10 dB that's awesome. > + 400ms (ish) of latency

[Freetel-codec2] new waveform

2014-03-02 Thread David Rowe
Hi, > How is your work on LDPC going? I've been plugging away for a few months on this, and am getting my head around the problem. I have a candidate waveform (i.e. modulation and coding combination) that has a 10dB improvement over the current FreeDV waveform. To develop this waveform I made a

Re: [Freetel-codec2] FDM Subband Thoughts

2014-03-02 Thread Bruce Perens
On 03/02/2014 02:17 PM, Ham Radio Java wrote: > My experience is kind of old, as I was an user of the OFDM modem by > AOR, and without fail, I'd sooner or later get jammed off the band by > the friendly people down south, as I could sometimes manage a whole 25 > watts. I don't even know how anyo

Re: [Freetel-codec2] FDM Subband Thoughts

2014-03-02 Thread David Rowe
Hi Steve, Our modem is much more robust than typical Ham data modems. If we get some interference the modem comes right back, you don't lose an over. HF data is tricky, you require high SNRs to overcome fades or interferers. DV is different (at least I treat it differently), the brain can error

Re: [Freetel-codec2] FDM Subband Thoughts

2014-03-02 Thread Ham Radio Java
My experience is kind of old, as I was an user of the OFDM modem by AOR, and without fail, I'd sooner or later get jammed off the band by the friendly people down south, as I could sometimes manage a whole 25 watts. Apples and Oranges probably, but the thought came to me over breakfast: "Does FDM

Re: [Freetel-codec2] FDM Subband Thoughts

2014-03-02 Thread Bruce Perens
On 03/02/2014 01:55 PM, Ham Radio Java wrote: > Where I'm going with this, isn't so much interleaving, but changing > the bit pairing of the QPSK subbands. I think the best you can do is to distribute the golay code evenly across all of the carriers. That would deal with frequency-selective fadi

Re: [Freetel-codec2] FDM Subband Thoughts

2014-03-02 Thread Bruce Perens
On 03/02/2014 01:18 PM, David Rowe wrote: > Is interference (intentional or otherwise) by other users a problem ATM? I've only heard one report. And the offending station was W1AW! OK, one of the portable W1AW's run for ARRL's centennial, and no doubt a volunteer or walk-in operator. However, co

Re: [Freetel-codec2] FDM Subband Thoughts

2014-03-02 Thread Ham Radio Java
Where I'm going with this, isn't so much interleaving, but changing the bit pairing of the QPSK subbands. It might be just a wash, but if moving bits can lessen the number on which the parity checker gives up, might be an easy thing. For example does V! and V2 have to be togther, and if spread ap

Re: [Freetel-codec2] FDM Subband Thoughts

2014-03-02 Thread David Rowe
Is interference (intentional or otherwise) by other users a problem ATM? I haven't heard anyone mention in to date. I have seen examples (some on my blog posts) of good robustness to some overlap by SSB signals. Those pitch/voicing/energy are protected by FEC, the parity bits for the FEC are at t

Re: [Freetel-codec2] FDM Subband Thoughts

2014-03-02 Thread Bruce Perens
On March 2, 2014 12:48:33 PM PST, Ham Radio Java wrote: >You can see I might have stopped after the first two subbands, because with >just a 150 Hz low-power jammer I can destroy your communications. Isn't this entirely discounting the effect of the FEC? Also, do we really have raw codec bit

[Freetel-codec2] FDM Subband Thoughts

2014-03-02 Thread Ham Radio Java
I thought I would put down on paper my thoughts about the current FDM implementation. No performance charts or anything like that, just a binary bit placement. The QPSK is of course fed 2-bits, which are used to create one of four phases to one of the sixteen subbands (carriers if you like). You m