Re: [Full-disclosure] How secure is software X?

2006-05-13 Thread Valdis . Kletnieks
On Sat, 13 May 2006 15:35:22 +0200, Roman Medina-Heigl Hernandez said: > even accessed if the network were propperly segmented/firewalled. Or my > IDS noticed the 0day exploitation (not very sure of this }:-)). An IDS can almost never spot a 0day for the same reason almost all A/V solutions can't

Re: [Full-disclosure] How secure is software X?

2006-05-13 Thread Roman Medina-Heigl Hernandez
Lucien Fransman wrote: > I often wondered about this. An assessment is only as good as the assesser. > What is the use of a "i can break and exploit $foo application, and have > shown this in my tests", if it is done by a private exploit? Again, i'm [...] > It only shows that the application

Re: [Full-disclosure] How secure is software X?

2006-05-12 Thread sebastian . rother
Well the same question cam eup also in OpenBSD-mailinglists. And I angree with Theo de Raadt because he`s completly right. So I`ll simply paste his mail: --- > http://marc.theaimsgroup.com/?l=openbsd-misc&m=114657401630096&w=2 > > If I understand correctly from what I've been told, this is not a >

Re: [Full-disclosure] How secure is software X?

2006-05-12 Thread Lucien Fransman
On Friday 12 May 2006 05:20, Blue Boar wrote: Hello, > Do you want just public results of standardized blackbox testing? > Something similar to the ICSA firewall certification? (Though, I assume > you want actual public results.) That would be ideal. properly anonimized ofcourse. It would be nice

Re: [Full-disclosure] How secure is software X?

2006-05-12 Thread Lucien Fransman
On Friday 12 May 2006 05:20, Blue Boar wrote: Hello, > Do you want just public results of standardized blackbox testing? > Something similar to the ICSA firewall certification? (Though, I assume > you want actual public results.) That would be ideal. properly anonimized ofcourse. It would be nice

Re: [Full-disclosure] How secure is software X?

2006-05-12 Thread Brian Eaton
On 5/12/06, Blue Boar <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: Brian Eaton wrote: > On 5/11/06, Blue Boar <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: >> Don't we fairly quickly arrive at all products passing all the standard >> tests, and "passing" no longer means anything? > > I believe that point is called "success." I was

Re: [Full-disclosure] How secure is software X?

2006-05-12 Thread Blue Boar
Brian Eaton wrote: On 5/11/06, Blue Boar <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: Don't we fairly quickly arrive at all products passing all the standard tests, and "passing" no longer means anything? I believe that point is called "success." I was thinking more like all their "security" efforts only went

Re: [Full-disclosure] How secure is software X?

2006-05-12 Thread Brian Eaton
On 5/11/06, Blue Boar <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: Don't we fairly quickly arrive at all products passing all the standard tests, and "passing" no longer means anything? I believe that point is called "success." - Brian ___ Full-Disclosure - We believ

Re: [Full-disclosure] How secure is software X?

2006-05-11 Thread Blue Boar
So pin it down a bit more for me. Do you want just public results of standardized blackbox testing? Something similar to the ICSA firewall certification? (Though, I assume you want actual public results.) Would you include source review? The Sardonix project tried to do that. Who does the

Re: [Full-disclosure] How secure is software X?

2006-05-11 Thread David Litchfield
From: "Michael Silk" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> why do we need this? Take your average bit of common software. I can bet someone's thrown Spike at it, someone else crazyfuzz, and another foofuz. Now let's say that it stood up to everything that was thrown at it - and let's say another product cr

Re: [Full-disclosure] How secure is software X?

2006-05-11 Thread Michael Silk
On 5/12/06, David Litchfield <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: How secure is software X? At least as secure as Vulnerability Assessment Assurance Level P; or Q or R. Well, that's what I think we should be able to say. What we need is an open standard, that has been agreed upon by recognized experts, ag

[Full-disclosure] How secure is software X?

2006-05-11 Thread David Litchfield
How secure is software X? At least as secure as Vulnerability Assessment Assurance Level P; or Q or R. Well, that's what I think we should be able to say. What we need is an open standard, that has been agreed upon by recognized experts, against which the absence of software security vulnerabi