- and transport-independent framework for
building and consuming network services.
= Proposal
Etch is a cross-platform, language- and transport-independent framework for
building and consuming network services. The Etch toolset includes a network
service description language, a compiler, and
On Friday 01 August 2008 00:16, James Dixson wrote:
> This a proposal to enter Etch in to the incubator.
>
> See http://wiki.apache.org/incubator/EtchProposal for updates.
>
> In particular, we are looking for an interested Champion.
Well, you are expected to have found a Champion prior to submitt
You adressed the two concerns that I have, too, thanks.
- The name. "Debian Etch" is a deeply engrained meme with the "Etch"
short cut.
- Office disussions. Projects where a large number of committers are
from the same organization and that also have this company being
invested in the project mig
14 people from one organisation on the initial committer list looks to
me like a daunting incubation. To get some level of independence from
Cisco, that will mean recruiting at least 14 new committers. That is a
major task.
I see Shindig having the same issue - it is moving fast, and developing
w
Niclas, thanks for the support it is much appreciated. I will put you down
as as 'willing' on Mentor and Champion.
I understand the "at office" concern, it is a mode of operation and we (the
committers) all understand the importance of public communication and
consensus.
I am a bit confused thoug
On Friday 01 August 2008 21:10, James Dixson wrote:
> I am a bit confused though about the "too good" concern, I do not think I
> understand what you mean. Could you elaborate?
I think it was Stefano Mazzocchi who said about community building, that the
only "Bad Code + Great Vision" will succeed
On Thu, Jul 31, 2008 at 12:16 PM, James Dixson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> This a proposal to enter Etch in to the incubator.
James, could you perhaps describe how this differs from Thrift?
-Yonik
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Ah. Well, then I do not think there is anything to worry about as far as
Etch is concerned. There are many, many potential growth points for the
project. A simple example, Etch supports Java and C# language bindings today
with a binary-transport. One of the committers, Seth Call, is working on a
J
The watercooler problem is real, but addressable. We accept that in order
for a community around Etch to grow, communication has to be open. Much of
our communication and discussion about Etch has been mediated over email as
our intramural community is geographically distributed. It is not a stretc
On Fri, Aug 1, 2008 at 5:41 AM, Upayavira <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> 14 people from one organisation on the initial committer list looks to
> me like a daunting incubation.
Indeed. Which of those people will actually be working on Etch going forward?
A quick perusal shows a Manager and a Direct
Niclas Hedhman <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
On Friday 01 August 2008 21:10, James Dixson wrote:
I am a bit confused though about the "too good" concern, I do not think I
understand what you mean. Could you elaborate?
I think it was Stefano Mazzocchi who said about community building, that the
o
thrift had a number of issues as we considered it more than a year ago. we
thought, well, we could fix these issues, but as they'd require interface
changes then we'd be breaking someone else's code and the fixes would be
substantial and then we'd have to negotiate each and every one of them, b
Well, personally I have been heavily involved in or have written outright
the build system, compiler interface, and ant plug-in. I am currently
working on a maven mojo and as well as a python binding that has full parity
with the Java and C# bindings. I am a Manager at Cisco, but I am Developer
wit
sted Champion.
>
> We welcome any and all comments. :-)
>
>
> --
> James Dixson
>
>
> -proposal-
> = Abstract
>
> Etch is a cross-platform, language- and transport-independent framework for
> building and consuming network services.
>
> = Pr
James Dixson wrote:
This a proposal to enter Etch in to the incubator.
+1 for incubation.
I will gladly be a mentor.
Doug
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we might have overdone the committer list here a bit so nobody who made
a significant contribution felt left out. :-)
(in addition to what james dixson has reported about himself) for the
last two months, the main contributors to the compiler and the java and
csharp bindings (the core) have be
updates.
>>
>> In particular, we are looking for an interested Champion.
>>
>> We welcome any and all comments. :-)
>>
>>
>> --
>> James Dixson
>>
>>
>> -proposal-----
>> = Abstract
>>
>> Etch is a cross-pla
e looking for an interested Champion.
>>>
>>> We welcome any and all comments. :-)
>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>> James Dixson
>>>
>>>
>>> -proposal-
>>> = Abstract
>>>
>>> Etch is a cross-platform
I've spent some time looking at the existing documentation, and
checking out the video introduction great stuff! I think it could
fit well in the ASF, and I have a personal interest in perhaps using
it for Solr 2.0.
I'll certainly volunteer to be a Mentor.
-Yonik
On Thu, Jul 31, 2008 at 12:
Thank you for the support Yonik!
--
james
On 8/4/08 3:00 PM, "Yonik Seeley" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> I've spent some time looking at the existing documentation, and
> checking out the video introduction great stuff! I think it could
> fit well in the ASF, and I have a personal interest
On Fri, Aug 1, 2008 at 2:23 PM, scott comer (sccomer) <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> we might have overdone the committer list here a bit so nobody who made a
> significant contribution felt left out. :-)
Perhaps something like a FAQ entry "What is the history of Etch?" on
the web site would be a mo
On 8/1/08, scott comer (sccomer) <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> we might have overdone the committer list here a bit so nobody who made
> a significant contribution felt left out. :-)
Having a long committer list is not necessarily bad but projects which
enter with a long list of which only a small
On Thu, Jul 31, 2008 at 6:16 PM, James Dixson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> This a proposal to enter Etch in to the incubator.
>
> See http://wiki.apache.org/incubator/EtchProposal for updates.
+1 for incubation (non-binding). While I find this area to be a bit
overcrowded lately, having both Etch
.
Direct: 512-336-3305
Mobile: 512-968-2116
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
-Original Message-
From: Niklas Gustavsson [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Tuesday, August 05, 2008 3:33 PM
To: general@incubator.apache.org
Subject: Re: [PROPOSAL] Etch
On Thu, Jul 31, 2008 at 6:16 PM, James Dixson <[EMAIL PROTECT
m: Niklas Gustavsson [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Tuesday, August 05, 2008 3:33 PM
To: general@incubator.apache.org
Subject: Re: [PROPOSAL] Etch
On Thu, Jul 31, 2008 at 6:16 PM, James Dixson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
wrote:
This a proposal to enter Etch in to the incubator.
See http://wiki.a
James
I'm +1 for incubation. I see you have three mentors, but if at some
future point you need another mentor, I would be very happy to step
in.
Regards,
Paul
On Tue, Aug 5, 2008 at 9:33 PM, Niklas Gustavsson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> On Thu, Jul 31, 2008 at 6:16 PM, James Dixson <[EMAIL PRO
Thanks for the support Paul!
--
james
On 8/6/08 4:58 AM, "Paul Fremantle" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> James
>
> I'm +1 for incubation. I see you have three mentors, but if at some
> future point you need another mentor, I would be very happy to step
> in.
>
> Regards,
> Paul
>
> On Tue, Aug
.com/ -- Lucene - Solr - Nutch
- Original Message
> From: James Dixson (jadixson) <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: general@incubator.apache.org
> Sent: Tuesday, August 5, 2008 6:03:28 PM
> Subject: RE: [PROPOSAL] Etch
>
> I have heard the name concern a couple of times now...
>
&g
A modern replacement for CORBA? Just resist the temptation to
implement Persistence Services on top. ;-)
+1
Craig
On Jul 31, 2008, at 9:16 AM, James Dixson wrote:
This a proposal to enter Etch in to the incubator.
See http://wiki.apache.org/incubator/EtchProposal for updates.
In particula
On Friday 01 August 2008 00:16:57 James Dixson wrote:
> == Nominated Mentors
Now;
Niclas Hedhman
Doug Cutting
Paul Fremantle
I had to remove Yonik from the list of formal Mentors, as he is not on the
Incubator PMC (AFAICT). Paul Fremantle has volunteered, so I put him up as
well.
A
On Wed, Aug 6, 2008 at 10:20 PM, Niclas Hedhman <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Now;
> Niclas Hedhman
> Doug Cutting
> Paul Fremantle
>
> I had to remove Yonik from the list of formal Mentors, as he is not on the
> Incubator PMC (AFAICT).
Huh? Mentors become part of the Incubator PMC.
"The Sp
On Thursday 07 August 2008 10:50:10 Yonik Seeley wrote:
> "The Sponsor shall assign a Mentor, who shall be granted membership of
> the Incubator PMC for the duration of the incubation process."
> That's also why they are listed as Nominated Members... the Incubator
> PMC must confirm them.
Yes, b
On Thu, Aug 7, 2008 at 12:10 AM, Niclas Hedhman <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> On Thursday 07 August 2008 10:50:10 Yonik Seeley wrote:
>
>> "The Sponsor shall assign a Mentor, who shall be granted membership of
>> the Incubator PMC for the duration of the incubation process."
>> That's also why they
Yonik Seeley wrote:
On Thu, Aug 7, 2008 at 12:10 AM, Niclas Hedhman <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
On Thursday 07 August 2008 10:50:10 Yonik Seeley wrote:
"The Sponsor shall assign a Mentor, who shall be granted membership of
the Incubator PMC for the duration of the incubation process."
That's al
On Thursday 07 August 2008 12:16:47 Yonik Seeley wrote:
> And I also qualify on that point.
Then I am so sorry. As Bill pointed out, it ain't easy to recall exactly who
are Members and who are not...
I will adjust the Proposal.
Cheers
--
Niclas Hedhman, Software Developer
I live here; http:/
On Thursday 07 August 2008 12:16:47 Yonik Seeley wrote:
> And I also qualify on that point.
Then I am so sorry. As Bill pointed out, it ain't easy to recall exactly who
are Members and who are not...
I will adjust the Proposal.
Paul, do you still want to be Mentor??
Cheers
--
Niclas Hedhman,
Niclas
I offered as a backup. I'm perfectly happy for the proposal to go
forwards with the three original mentors. I will probably join the
mailing lists anyway.
Thanks!
Paul
On Thu, Aug 7, 2008 at 6:35 AM, Niclas Hedhman <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> On Thursday 07 August 2008 12:16:47 Yonik Se
On Thursday 07 August 2008 14:33:57 Paul Fremantle wrote:
> Niclas
>
> I offered as a backup. I'm perfectly happy for the proposal to go
> forwards with the three original mentors. I will probably join the
> mailing lists anyway.
Ok, noted in proposal.
Cheers
--
Niclas Hedhman, Software Develop
Folks,
Can I ask if anyone has compared Etch with Apache Tuscany and the SCA
specifications?
Yours, Mike.
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From my understanding, Tuscany could leverage Etch to offer a wire
format that can be consumed by a variety of different languages and
environments, not a contestant to it.
Ciao
Henning
Mike Edwards schrieb:
Folks,
Can I ask if anyone has compared Etch with Apache T
Henning,
I'd be grateful if you could explain this further.
When I look at the Etch proposal page, it does not seem that Etch is simply about a wire format, so
I am puzzled by your reply. There are some things I'm clearly not getting about Etch.
Yours, Mike.
Henning Schmiedehausen wrote:
: [PROPOSAL] Etch
Doug Cutting has a few nice and short naming rules that I liked when I read
them. I believe one of them was that a Google search for the proposed name
should yield very few matches. Hadoop and Lucene are/were good examples of
that. Here is another naming example. I created this
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Wednesday, August 06, 2008 12:41 PM Pacific Standard Time
To: general@incubator.apache.org
Subject: Re: [PROPOSAL] Etch
A modern replacement for CORBA? Just resist the temptation to
implement Persistence Services on top. ;-)
+1
Craig
On Jul 31, 2008, at
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: general@incubator.apache.org; general@incubator.apache.org
> Sent: Thursday, August 7, 2008 2:50:37 PM
> Subject: Re: [PROPOSAL] Etch
>
> Doug is a wise man and that is how we picked the name etch 18 month ago.
>
> Scott out
>
>
>
>
e name
beforehand?
---
James
-Original Message-
From: Otis Gospodnetic [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Thursday, August 07, 2008 11:16 PM
To: general@incubator.apache.org
Subject: Re: [PROPOSAL] Etch
http://www.google.com/search?&q=etch -- 12MM hits for an unreleased
product (this
On Aug 8, 2008, at 4:28 AM, James Dixson (jadixson) wrote:
Simple put: a name change is work. Before I can accept the need to do
work, I want to clearly understand the benefits of doing it.
Etch, while new to open-source, does have some awareness in a
technical
community ( http://developer.c
Etch, it's just that it's an English word, plus there are
several other products with "Etch" in their name.
- Original Message
> From: Grant Ingersoll <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: general@incubator.apache.org
> Sent: Friday, August 8, 2008 6:28:23 AM
> S
On Fri, Aug 1, 2008 at 8:23 PM, scott comer (sccomer) <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> we might have overdone the committer list here a bit so nobody who made a
> significant contribution felt left out. :-)...
> ...summary:
>
> architecture: scott comer
> compiler, java and csharp binding: scott comer
as a scientist, i am getting somewhat bristly at all the rumor,
innuendo, and hyperbole around names. i've not seen any definitive or
measurable steps that can be take to ensure success. we're also ignoring
the silent majority which seems to like etch just fine. my personal
opinion is that the
+1 Well said.
Part of the silent majority,
Craig
On Aug 12, 2008, at 10:29 AM, scott comer wrote:
as a scientist, i am getting somewhat bristly at all the rumor,
innuendo, and hyperbole around names. i've not seen any definitive
or measurable steps that can be take to ensure success. we're
+1 to Scott's comments.
I don't think the name is a significant conflict at all. Debian Etch is a
release codename - regular references to it will fade away as the next
release surfaces, and the Apache Etch name, if it is a successful project,
should last much longer. This would supplant recogn
Scott Comer wrote:
> as a scientist, i am getting somewhat bristly at all the rumor,
> innuendo, and hyperbole around names.
Can you be more specific?
So far the best argument against Etch that I've seen is Grant's, and Les
makes a good point about the transient nature of such release labels.
>
On Tue, Aug 12, 2008 at 6:29 PM, scott comer <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> as a scientist, i am getting somewhat bristly at all the rumor, innuendo,
> and hyperbole around names. i've not seen any definitive or measurable steps
> that can be take to ensure success. we're also ignoring the silent maj
Noel J. Bergman wrote:
Scott Comer wrote:
the important thing right now is, i think, that searching now for etch
doesn't not reveal anything which is obviously competing technology
True, but were the debian community to make "a federal case" of the issue, I
don't know that the name would be
William A. Rowe, Jr. wrote:
> Noel J. Bergman wrote:
>> Scott Comer wrote:
>>> the important thing right now is, i think, that searching now for etch
>>> doesn't not reveal anything which is obviously competing technology
>> True, but were the debian community to make "a federal case" of the issue
the discussion about names seems somewhat done. it is easy to get the
impression from the volume that there is a demand for name change. in
my opinion there isn't. certainly names is a rich topic and the discussion
would never die down on it's own because it is so much fun. it's a wonder
anything
Scott,
I don't think that my question was answered.
I want to make it clear: I have no issues with names.
Yours, Mike.
scott comer wrote:
the discussion about names seems somewhat done. it is easy to get the
impression from the volume that there is a demand for name change. in
my opinion th
sorry, mike!
in a 3 minute examination of apache tuscany it seems like there are some
similar aims and some overlap in capability. both are addressing SOA
issues such as protocol independence and implementation independence.
both seek to make deploying service oriented architectures a snap. th
On Wed, Aug 13, 2008 at 12:58 PM, scott comer <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> of the people that mention name (8), only 3 are voting:
This is a discussion thread, not a formal vote for Etch to enter the Incubator.
[...]
> so, can we put the name question to bed? it was suggested that the podling
> c
+1
-Yonik
On Sat, Aug 9, 2008 at 4:58 AM, Bertrand Delacretaz
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> On Fri, Aug 1, 2008 at 8:23 PM, scott comer (sccomer) <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> wrote:
>> we might have overdone the committer list here a bit so nobody who made a
>> significant contribution felt left out. :-
scott comer wrote:
> in my opinion there isn't [a demand for name change]. certainly
> names is a rich topic and the discussion would never die down on
> it's own because it is so much fun. it's a wonder anything gets done.
You should have been around for the start of Geronimo. :-)
> can we put
FWIW, I'm +1 on the proposal, regardless of the name.
On Aug 13, 2008, at 12:58 PM, scott comer wrote:
the discussion about names seems somewhat done. it is easy to get the
impression from the volume that there is a demand for name change. in
my opinion there isn't. certainly names is a rich t
It seems discussion has died down a bit.
So to wrap up on the last issues discussed:
I think we should just keep the name. We have quite a bit of goodwill
invested in the name already and it is certainly no worse than other names
that have been accepted into incubation. So unless there is a dire
On Mon, 2008-08-18 at 12:33 -0500, James Dixson wrote:
> It seems discussion has died down a bit.
>
> So to wrap up on the last issues discussed:
>
> I think we should just keep the name. We have quite a bit of goodwill
> invested in the name already and it is certainly no worse than other names
It was suggested that the committer list be trimmed to those who will
actually be committing (perhaps the 8 that Scott mentions). Those
suggestions were not even acknowledged. Is there a problem with
trimming the list?
-Yonik
-
I may have missed some of the threads on this, so apologize if this is a
repeat. However, FWIW, I wanted to confirm that Etch isn't registered as a
trademark or service mark with the US PTO for any software product or
service, so there is no direct conflict with names in that venue.
Jennifer
On
: Monday, August 18, 2008 4:18 PM
To: general@incubator.apache.org
Subject: Re: [PROPOSAL] Etch
It was suggested that the committer list be trimmed to those who will
actually be committing (perhaps the 8 that Scott mentions). Those
suggestions were not even acknowledged. Is there a problem with
On Wed, 2008-08-20 at 08:43 -0700, James Dixson (jadixson) wrote:
> There is no problem trimming the list. As I mentioned originally, we
> included in the list all of the most recent active contributors.
>
> The question has been asked of the current contributors over the last
> several days and m
On Wed, Aug 20, 2008 at 9:30 PM, Upayavira <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> On Wed, 2008-08-20 at 08:43 -0700, James Dixson (jadixson) wrote:
>> There is no problem trimming the list. As I mentioned originally, we
>> included in the list all of the most recent active contributors.
>>
>> The question ha
Upayavira wrote:
My expressed concern was to do with the length of the committer list. If
you start with 14 committers, (and they all remain active) you won't be
able to graduate until you reach at least 29 committers - so that there
isn't a predominance from one organisation.
I've always under
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