Re: Harnad's faulty thinking on OA deposit and APA policy

2008-07-24 Thread Arthur Sale
Let me add something that I have said repeatedly in many forums and without contradiction: Universities are delinquent in their duty of public accountability if they do not make all their research outputs which are not specifically commissioned by private enterprise publicly accessible on the

Re: Harnad's faulty thinking on OA deposit and APA policy

2008-07-24 Thread Thomas Krichel
Arthur Sale writes ~SUniversities are delinquent in their duty of public accountability if they do not make all their research outputs which are not specifically commissioned by private enterprise publicly accessible on the Internet.~T That's what you think is their duty. There are

RE�: Re: Harnad's faulty thinking on OA deposit and APA policy

2008-07-24 Thread Gu�don Jean-Claude
I believe Arthur is right on his first point. This said, the issue of university autonomy varies enormously from one country to another and that must also be taken into account. In some countries, universities simply do not have the needed margin of maneuver to create institutional repositories

Re: Harnad's faulty thinking on OA deposit and APA policy

2008-07-24 Thread Stevan Harnad
On Thu, Jul 24, 2008 at 9:10 AM, Thomas Krichel kric...@openlib.org wrote:  Arthur Sale: Funders can nominate where they want the research they fund to  be deposited, but in reality, to do so other than in the institutional repository simply creates extra work

RE�: Re: Harnad's faulty thinking on OA deposit and APA policy

2008-07-24 Thread Gu�don Jean-Claude
Leaving aside the bandwidth-wasting remarks about the inability of people to read what Harnad writes, I still find Harnad's answer unsatisfactory. The reason is that he and I agree that a repository without a mandate is ineffective. Consequently, arguing that one is not against

RE�: Re: Harnad's faulty thinking on OA deposit and APA policy

2008-07-24 Thread Gu�don Jean-Claude
One more exercise of turning in circles. The main point is that the NIH mandate does not affect at all the way in which institutional repositories develop. If it did, I would like to have very precise and concrete examples... Let's go once more: How does 3 follow from 2 in the first response?

Re: RE : Re: Harnad's faulty thinking on OA deposit and APA policy

2008-07-24 Thread Stevan Harnad
On Thu, Jul 24, 2008 at 6:29 PM, Guédon Jean-Claude jean.claude.gue...@umontreal.ca wrote: How does 3 follow from 2 in the first response? There is a logical gap here which indeed does not register. A Simple Way to Optimize the NIH Public Access Policy (Oct 2004) Please Don't Copy-Cat Clone

RE�: Re: RE : Re: Harnad's faulty thinking on OA deposit and APA policy

2008-07-24 Thread Gu�don Jean-Claude
I ask for an explanation about what appears like a logical gap to me. All I get in response is a series of references which reiterate the same thesis over and over. This must be Stevan Harnad's notion of what a civil debate must be like... It goes roughly like this: I (SH) am right. If they

Re: Harnad's faulty thinking on OA deposit and APA policy

2008-07-24 Thread Stevan Harnad
On Thu, Jul 24, 2008 at 8:07 PM, Guédon Jean-Claude jean.claude.gue...@umontreal.ca wrote: I still do not understand how a mandate to deposit NIH-financed articles into the NIH repository interferes with the development of IR's. But I believe I know why I do not understand: there is nothing