I'm at a loss. I have libtool-2.4 installed in /usr/local and I get this
error when 'make'ing after running
../configure --prefix=/usr/local --libdir=/usr/local/lib \
--with-libreadline-prefix=/usr/local
[ making lots of stuff ...]
CCLD libguile-2.0.la
../libtool: line 5989
Hello Guile types,
The README for guile-2.0.11 gives a non-existent URL for libgc. This should
probably be changed to http://www.hboehm.info/gc/
Ian
The problem seems to be the presence of -L\(libdir\) on the libtool
command lines. See makev-guile-2.0.11 for output of make V=1
But, I get the same problem when building glib-2.4, so it is unlikely
that it's a guile problem, more likely something weird about my system
(it's an old ubuntu distrib
t the garbage collector. What can we do
about that? One solution would be to try to get the maintainers of
these libraries to make them proper GNU software, but perhaps that
would be difficult, or impossible legally.
On Mon, Apr 21, 2014 at 11:10 PM, Ian Grant
wrote:
> It's because I
For the record, the readline problem was because I had not
./configure'ed readline ---with-curses. I think that guile's autoconf
test program makes this assumption. The assumption is probably
reasonable if most distributions do this, but it is strictly speaking
a bug in the autoconf detection of re
Hello Guile types,
I have been experimenting with using libguile from within another byte-code
interpreter: Moscow ML. I have a version of Moscow ML with an GNU lightning
interface in which I JIT compile primitives to give access to libguile
functions from Standard ML.
Moscow ML uses an old versi
nd_handler.
Is there a way to implement what I want with fluids?
Ian
On Fri, Aug 15, 2014 at 6:13 PM, Ian Grant
wrote:
> Hello Guile types,
>
> I have been experimenting with using libguile from within another
> byte-code interpreter: Moscow ML. I have a version of Moscow ML with
Dear Lightning/Guile types,
I wrote this to try to motivate people to steer projects in mutually
beneficial directions. The two projects I had forremost in mind where GNU
Lightning and Guile. Can we discuss possible future development of these
two projects _together?_ If we can, then I think that
was
set? It sounds like it used to evaluate the handler in the dynamic context
of the destination, like a continuation.
Ian
On Wed, Aug 20, 2014 at 2:02 PM, Neil Jerram
wrote:
> On 2014-08-18 03:14, Ian Grant wrote:
>
>> Hi Neil,
>>
>> Sorry, I am replying to my me
Sorry about that. I have limited resources and am restricted to using free
services. Here is a link to GitHub, I don't know if that is any better ...
probably. GitHub seems far better organised than Google.
https://github.com/IanANGrant/red-october/raw/master/thunder.pdf
Ian
On Sun, Aug 24
On Sun, Aug 24, 2014 at 12:07 AM, Richard Stallman wrote:
> The research is all done. We just need to implement it.
>
> I would describe this as a domain for research, because it is
> far from clear whether it could possibly work in practice;
> if it could, it is not obvious how to make it w
The following is probably the USAF report on Multics security that Thompson
mentions in his "Reflections in Trusting Trust" talk.
This has been known for forty years now. What do you reckon is the
probability that it has been tried? What system/compiler would be the most
likely target for such an
> It is probably harder to do this to GCC than to a proprietary compiler.
> But there is no way to be totally sure.
The source code to the proprietary compilers is not published, so I
think it's much easier to attack the GNU and OpenBSD tools than the
proprietary ones. It doesn't matter how often
On 8/30/14, Richard Stallman wrote:
> Are you saying that someone could have put a Ritchie hack
> into the proprietary compilers [...]
Perhaps you know more about the origins of the hack than I do, I was
going to call it a Schell script.
> [...] that would detect the code
> that GCC was going to
> That hack recognized specific syntax. Any change in the wrong
> place would break it.
Which hack was that? The one Thompson is reported to have actually
implemented in Unix? You are assuming what you are trying to
prove: you are assuming there has only ever been one instance of this
class of at
> That hack recognized specific syntax. Any change in the wrong
> place would break it.
Which hack was that? The one Thompson is reported to have actually
implemented in Unix? You are assuming what you are trying to prove: you are
assuming there has only ever been one instance of this class of at
Perhaps people would enjoy reading about how one could inject trojan
semantics into a compiler in such a way that they have some resilience
to all but quite major structural changes to the target source code?
This is not just for the purposes of frightening the birds. It will
show how useful tools
ability of compromise to any positive epsilon. I didn't
mention this because I thought it better not to make the manifesto a
political one, but of course it is a political one.
Feel free to pass it around.
Best wishes
wrote:
> On 4 September 2014 11:57, Ian Grant wrote:
&g
ting
real code that works, and which interprets languages and does stuff. It's
fun. If you try it, then I think you'll believe me.
> Happy hacking :-)
>
Thank you! You too.
Ian
>
>
>
> On 4 September 2014 18:33, Ian Grant wrote:
>
>> Perhaps people would enjoy
Well, I don't know Prolog either, which is why I typed in that code. I
don't know about available funding either, I have been trying for over two
years now to get people interested in this, and I ran out of financial
resources a while ago. I have been living by extorting money from my
friends and f
On Thu, Sep 4, 2014 at 9:50 PM, Richard Stallman wrote:
> There are limits to how much effort we should make to deal with the
> imponderable possibilities of sabotage. Especially since there is so
> much else we know that we need to do. To throw away all our software
> because of these possibil
On Sun, Aug 24, 2014 at 12:07 AM, Richard Stallman wrote:
> [[[ To any NSA and FBI agents reading my email: please consider]]]
> [[[ whether defending the US Constitution against all enemies, ]]]
> [[[ foreign or domestic, requires you to follow Snowden's example. ]]]
>
The answer seems
Here is the basis of a lightning interface for Guile. The example shows
that I seem to be able to JIT compile a foreign function binding and call
it, at least once!
The rest is data that I generated using the rather awful hack at
https://github.com/IanANGrant/red-october/blob/master/src/dynlibs/
ically implemented
in any language for which we have written the list functionals like map,
find, partition, etc.
And so on and so forth ... I am feeling like I have said rather a lot on
these two list lately and should shut up for a while ...
Ian
On Sat, Sep 6, 2014 at 7:40 PM, Ian Grant
wrote:
On Sun, Sep 7, 2014 at 9:18 AM, Taylan Ulrich Bayirli/Kammer <
taylanbayi...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Also, since we define a simple semantics for which a new evaluator could
> be implemented at any time in any language, it becomes ever more and
> more implausible that *all* tools everywhere have been
> #|
> Basically a stream is
> [x,y,z,...]
> But we want to gc the tail of the stream if not reachable. How to do this?
I don't understand. The tail is infinitely long. When do you want to GC it?
When your infinite memory is 50% full, or 75% full :-)
I think you probably have a good idea, but it
we want the results to be
_very_ reliable.
Happy hacking.
On Fri, Sep 12, 2014 at 4:08 PM, Ian Grant
wrote:
> > #|
> > Basically a stream is
> > [x,y,z,...]
>
> > But we want to gc the tail of the stream if not reachable. How to do
> this?
>
> I don&#
On Sat, Sep 13, 2014 at 7:19 AM, Stefan Israelsson Tampe <
stefan.ita...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Anyhow today I think that programming in C should be done like in my
> c-lambda repo at gitorius.
>
I can't find it. Can you send me a URL?
I have actually copied sbcl's assebler for amd64. you can find
LALR parser generators are not the last word in parsing technology. Many
unambiguous context-free languages are not well suited to LALR parsing. The
C language is an exception: the C grammar from the ISO standard can be
typed almost verbatim into a YACC/Bison file, and it will produce just the
one
On Sat, Sep 13, 2014 at 7:13 AM, Stefan Israelsson Tampe <
stefan.ita...@gmail.com> wrote:
> it is saved from gc by havinga special reference and that we also can see
> if the cons cell have been referenced outside of the
> special references. Then in the sweep phase one can decide to modify the
>
On Mon, Sep 15, 2014 at 2:29 PM, Stefan Israelsson Tampe <
stefan.ita...@gmail.com> wrote:
> i find that logic programs together with memoization and auto cut ideoms
> helps in making powerful parsers, really fun at least.
>
You should definitely look at Tom's paper then, the "director's cut" is
On Mon, Sep 15, 2014 at 3:59 PM, Ian Grant
wrote:
> The parser's cache can be used as a compact representation of
> the otherwise hyper-exponential size of the ASTs ...
This is wrong. They're not hyper-exponential, they're just exponential.
> it could explore non-determi
I'll make this the last reply to my own message.
Here is a memoizing (with 'eager' semantic actions) implementation of
Ridge's combinator parsers in 221 lines of Standard ML. Scheme wouldn't be
much more,
Adding the binarizing grammar generator and an Earley oracle wouldn't add
more than another 3
A while ago I posted this patch:
http://lists.gnu.org/archive/html/guile-devel/2014-08/msg00058.html
No-one had anything to say about it. But I would like to know what to do if
I want my code to work with the next release of Guile.
I think in retrospect this patch is too much. A better patch
I'm posting this because it explains beautifully why we don't need to
expend any great effort on getting GDB or other debuggers working with
Guile. If some code needs a debugger, then it invariably needs
re-writing much more than it needs the debugger. And _programmers_ who
need the debugger are in
ctional implementation of Hindley-Milner type inference:
http://prooftoys.org/ian-grant/hm/ and its performance is good. It can
infer the types of pathalogical examples such as Mairson's, in less than a
minute. This is a type expression which takes 50,000 lines of output on a
80-column terminal:
On Tue, Sep 16, 2014 at 8:57 PM, wrote:
> Note that the 42 minutes here is a dumbed-down scheme interpreter
> written in C building/boostrapping the compiler. The guile compiler
> (the Scheme one) is quite a bit faster than that.
I know, but it's not necessary. Guile could take the scheme code wh
On Tue, Sep 16, 2014 at 11:27 PM, Mark H Weaver wrote:
> Ian Grant writes:
>
> Are you suggesting that we compile our Scheme code to C, include that
> in our distribution, and then users would start by compiling that
> (non-source) C code? If so, I'm surprised to hear you s
On Tue, Sep 16, 2014 at 11:27 PM, Mark H Weaver wrote:
> A Thompson virus could be hiding in this intermediate C code that would
> be very hard to audit.
>
When did you last audit these 66,000 lines of intermediate code, which
people are encouraged to run as root? If you _had_ audited it, how wo
On Wed, Sep 17, 2014 at 1:29 PM, Mark H Weaver wrote:
> Hi Ian,
>
> I'm going to try to ignore your gratutious and unfounded insults,
They are indeed gratuitous. Think of them as a sort of free software.
> because I agree that the problem you are trying to solve is an important
> one, and believ
Here's some more logic that they don't teach kids these days.
It is now nearly a month since I posted an 8 page text explaining how
to vastly extend the life-expectancy of the Free Software Foundation.
In that time I have received a total of three items of evidence (let's
call them exhibits) whic
On Wed, Sep 17, 2014 at 1:29 PM, Mark H Weaver wrote:
> [...] I led the development of the scannable PGP source code books that
> allowed PGP to be legally exported from the US fo the first time, along
> with the tools needed to convert the paper books back into electronic
> form with modest effor
On Wed, Sep 17, 2014 at 5:32 PM, Ludovic Courtès wrote:
> Ian Grant skribis:
> Furthermore, while your ideas may be worth pursuing, it’s not OK to keep
> aggressively posting to so many people. Please come back to
> guile-devel@gnu.org when you have concrete proposals or co
On Wed, Sep 17, 2014 at 5:57 PM, Ian Grant
wrote:
> Now tell me how it is _you_ know that what you did doesn't earn you
> and Richard Stallman a fetching orange jump-suit each, and an
> all-expenses-paid vacation at a Government holiday camp in the South
> East Florida Keys, w
This is about the 66,00 lines of code that are in the confige script and
are not routinely audited and are typically run as root.
In http://lists.gnu.org/archive/html/guile-devel/2014-09/msg00098.html
Neil Jerram proclaims:
> People are absolutely NOT encouraged to run ./configure and
> make as r
From: Ed http://www.cs.utexas.edu/users/EWD/misc/vanVlissingenInterview.html
As to the programming products that are used by people, I hardly have first
hand experience, my impression is that an enormous amount of user time is
wasted figuring out what the system does and how to control it, which i
ible in a very
crude form. By the end of the period I knew that the design of
sophisticated digital systems was the perfect field of activity for
the Mathematical Engineer."
[1] Edsger W. Dijkstra. EWD1303
https://www.cs.utexas.edu/users/EWD/transcriptions/EWD13xx/EWD1303
ure that I'm not going to die tomorrow, but I think that being
> worried about that wouldn't make that last day of mine any better)
>
> The second suggestion is that perhaps instead of sending all those letters
> to some news groups, you should start a blog?
>
> That wa
On Fri, Sep 19, 2014 at 7:17 PM, Ian Grant
wrote: a bunch of stuff, and added:
I forgot to add "you fucking ignorant jumped-up little prick!" So now
you have _textual evidence_ that I really am impolite :-)
Best wishes
Ian
Back in 1998/1999 Gordon Matzigkeit posted a .tar.gz "source
distribution" package to the guile developers. As I recall it, this
archive unpacked one or more files into the guile source code
directory as well as its own subdirectory. Jim Blandy and/or Mikael
Djurfeldt ripped him a new asshole for i
http://livelogic.blogspot.com/2014/09/beware-good-and-wise.html
The following is a response to what some may think an implausible
suggestion made here:
http://lists.gnu.org/archive/html/guile-devel/2014-09/msg00124.html
The suggestion is that the system of education has been subverted so
that there are "unknown" physical laws which give "the unseen enemy"
> But it would nice to get some new major features. Screen is old.. 27 years is
> heck a lot of time. What about the next 27 years? ;)
As far as its _apparent_ functionality goes, GNU screen is one of the
best pieces of GNU software I know: there is an unmistakably twisted
sort of genius to what
Dear programming language types,
I wrote this to try once again to explain what is the nature of the
problem that one would have in verifying the integrity of _any_
software toolchain, whether it is aimed ultimately at the production
of other software, or of hardware.
http://livelogic.blogspo
On Fri, Oct 3, 2014 at 2:23 AM, Mark H Weaver wrote:
>> http://livelogic.blogspot.com/2014/10/the-foundation-part-i.html
> I downloaded the PDF linked in that blog entry and attempted to view it
> using Emacs's docview mode, which reported that the pdf->png process
> died with a segfault.
Thi
On Sat, Oct 4, 2014 at 1:37 AM, Mark H Weaver wrote:
> Ian, you are a _terrible_ communicator. IMO, your biggest problems are:
>
> 1. You present your ideas in a far too abstract way, making it hard for
>those of us who haven't already been long acquainted with your ideas
>to begin to und
On Sun, Oct 5, 2014 at 1:39 AM, Nala Ginrut wrote:
>
> The real problem here, is the provided PDF can't be opened normally. That's
> bad, for your idea. It's your mistake, not others.
Then tell me the name, the sha512sum of the file, the URL from which
you downloaded it and the size of the file a
On Sun, Oct 5, 2014 at 2:58 AM, Mike Gerwitz wrote:
> On Sat, Oct 04, 2014 at 09:35:09PM -0400, Ian Grant wrote:
>> Well, if I do succeed in distributing malware, it will be a good
>> demonstration of what I have been arguing for months now, which is
>> that your "cor
On Sun, Oct 5, 2014 at 11:15 AM, Nala Ginrut wrote:
>
> Alright, I changed a system and try it again with evince successfully.
> Anyway, I did't find any maths or special symbols in it, so it could be
> published on your blog as plain text. But you may insist on the opinion of
> PDF.
There is ano
Taylan wrote:
> In your PDF analogy, the solution is to write a spurious
> amount of PDF implementations. Or for C, to implement
> a spurious amount of C compilers. That is impractical
> because C is complex.
It's not as complex as you might think. In the space of a couple of
months, I wrote wha
On Sun, Oct 5, 2014 at 1:42 PM, Ian Grant wrote:
> [we] will be able to implement a C compiler in Microsoft Word BASIC, or in
> COBOL, and that will be capable of compiling GCC, if we had a year or
> so to wait while it does it ...
This is not true. Word BASIC or COBOL could easily wri
On Mon, Oct 6, 2014 at 12:23 AM, Mike Gerwitz wrote:
> On Sun, Oct 05, 2014 at 12:11:00PM -0400, Ian Grant wrote:
>> > As has been stated---your concerns are substantiated and understood,
>>
>> I wasn't aware that my concerns _have_ been substantiated. How? I
On Tue, Oct 7, 2014 at 1:28 PM, Mark H Weaver wrote:
> Ian, please stop posting to guile-devel. You've made your points, and
> I've even called attention to what I think is the best exposition of
> your ideas. At this point you're just repeating yourself and hurling
> gratuitous insults. Enough
ar to me that compared to how this project worked sixteen
or so years ago, it has completely lost its direction, and it has
hardly progressed at all. And I daresay this will provoke screams of
outrage from dozens of people that didn't even know what guile was
sixteen years ago, but that
This is the same idea: just as machine-readable formal semantics
abstract from concrete representation of language compilers, they
abstract from concrete language representation of applications.
The problem with web content management systems is they all cause
lock-in. Your data are locked into th
65 matches
Mail list logo
