Re: Stupid Language Designer Tricks

2012-05-19 Thread Aristotle Pagaltzis
* Michael G Schwern schw...@pobox.com [2012-05-19 18:50]: Or still using it, basically unchanged, as our primary system programming language in 2012. Indeed: why oh why… One has to wonder.

Re: Stupid Language Designer Tricks

2012-05-19 Thread Greg McCarroll
On 19 May 2012, at 21:38, Aristotle Pagaltzis wrote: * Michael G Schwern schw...@pobox.com [2012-05-19 18:50]: Or still using it, basically unchanged, as our primary system programming language in 2012. Indeed: why oh why… One has to wonder. Just to play the devil sitting on the devil's

Re: Stupid Language Designer Tricks

2012-05-19 Thread Peter da Silva
On 2012-05-18, at 15:07, Michael G Schwern wrote: Bagging on C is like bagging on Shakespeare. They were severely limited in hardware, didn't have a whole lot of prior art to go on and not a whole lot of people to talk to about it. Smalltalk, ML, Pascal, Prolog, Lisp and SQL all came out about

Re: Stupid Language Designer Tricks

2012-05-19 Thread Peter da Silva
On 2012-05-19, at 11:43, Michael G Schwern wrote: Or still using it, basically unchanged, as our primary system programming language in 2012. Yeh, it really sucks that in 50 years nobody has ever been able to develop a genuinely better alternative.

Re: Stupid Language Designer Tricks

2012-05-19 Thread Michael G Schwern
On 2012.5.19 1:46 PM, Peter da Silva wrote: Smalltalk came out ten years later. Smalltalk was in production in 72 making it a contemporary with C. Smalltalk 80 was the first released version, roughly coinciding with the KR book. And Simula had all the trappings of a modern OO language (and a

Re: Stupid Language Designer Tricks

2012-05-19 Thread Michael G Schwern
On 2012.5.15 1:41 PM, Jarkko Hietaniemi wrote: Otherwise I haven't come across this problem in other major languages... except maybe C. And original C has so many design flaws that the list would become useless. You will have to back that up somehow, laddie. And get offa my lawn. I've

Re: Stupid Language Designer Tricks

2012-05-19 Thread Aristotle Pagaltzis
* Greg McCarroll g...@mccarroll.org.uk [2012-05-19 23:00]: Lisp machines[1] didn't exactly take off. C++/STL didn't have anyone build upon it for other languages significantly (i'm sure i'm about to be proven wrong here) , just for sheer mischief i'll mention Topaz[2]. Bagging on C as a