Examples of translated RFCs

2005-12-06 Thread Harald Tveit Alvestrand
Check this site out: http://rfc-jp.nic.ad.jp/ I *think* it has at least a handful of RFCs translated into Japanese, but my Japanese skills aren't great enough to know if I found the ones that are there. There's also http://www.rfc-editor.org/language.html, with links to Spanish and French

Re: Examples of translated RFCs

2005-12-06 Thread JFC (Jefsey) Morfin
At 09:33 06/12/2005, Harald Tveit Alvestrand wrote: Check this site out: http://rfc-jp.nic.ad.jp/ I *think* it has at least a handful of RFCs translated into Japanese, but my Japanese skills aren't great enough to know if I found the ones that are there. There's also

Re: The IETF Trust License is too restricted

2005-12-06 Thread Brian E Carpenter
Hallam-Baker, Phillip wrote: From: Brian E Carpenter [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Its purpose is to give the IETF control of its own IPR, which has previously been held by 3rd parties. (That's not the legal statement of purpose in the formal Trust Agreement.) What we then do once we have

Re: The IETF Trust License is too restricted

2005-12-06 Thread Brian E Carpenter
Francis Dupont wrote: In your previous mail you wrote: The text in section 9.5 appear to me to make it permanently impossible to incorporate portions of RFC in both free or proprietary products. I believe that is unacceptable, and that it is counter to the needs of many in the

Re: I know I am dumb stupid but I am also dumb stubborn [was IETF Trust license is too restricted]

2005-12-06 Thread Brian E Carpenter
JFC (Jefsey) Morfin wrote: At 15:50 05/12/2005, Brian E Carpenter wrote: Simon, You are bit behind real time. We already updated this text. http://www1.ietf.org/mail-archive/web/ietf-announce/current/msg01837.html Dear Brian, Great! the three stupid points I am stubbornly interested in are

Re: Examples of translated RFCs

2005-12-06 Thread Masataka Ohta
JFC (Jefsey) Morfin wrote: I *think* it has at least a handful of RFCs translated into Japanese, but my Japanese skills aren't great enough to know if I found the ones that are there. There's also http://www.rfc-editor.org/language.html, with links to Spanish and French translation

Re: The IETF Trust License is too restricted

2005-12-06 Thread Simon Josefsson
Hallam-Baker, Phillip [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: From: Brian E Carpenter [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Its purpose is to give the IETF control of its own IPR, which has previously been held by 3rd parties. (That's not the legal statement of purpose in the formal Trust Agreement.) What we

Re: The IETF Trust License is too restricted

2005-12-06 Thread Harald Tveit Alvestrand
--On tirsdag, desember 06, 2005 13:07:50 +0100 Simon Josefsson [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I'd feel more comfortable if the outbounds right issue was settled, before all IPR is signed away to some external body that, to me, it seem unclear whether the IETF has total control over. Remember

Re: The IETF Trust License is too restricted

2005-12-06 Thread Brian E Carpenter
Simon Josefsson wrote: Hallam-Baker, Phillip [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: From: Brian E Carpenter [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Its purpose is to give the IETF control of its own IPR, which has previously been held by 3rd parties. (That's not the legal statement of purpose in the formal Trust

Re: The IETF Trust License is too restricted

2005-12-06 Thread Simon Josefsson
Harald Tveit Alvestrand [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: --On tirsdag, desember 06, 2005 13:07:50 +0100 Simon Josefsson [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I'd feel more comfortable if the outbounds right issue was settled, before all IPR is signed away to some external body that, to me, it seem unclear

Re: The IETF Trust License is too restricted

2005-12-06 Thread Simon Josefsson
Brian E Carpenter [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Simon Josefsson wrote: Hallam-Baker, Phillip [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: From: Brian E Carpenter [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Its purpose is to give the IETF control of its own IPR, which has previously been held by 3rd parties. (That's not the

RE: Examples of translated RFCs

2005-12-06 Thread Nelson, David
JFC (Jefsey) Morfin writes... So , IMHO, the IETF urgency is today the other way around: incorporating into RFC standards, practices or tables authoritatively written or thought in another language than English, or in English using normative non-ASCII art drafts or using term in a meaning

RE: The IETF Trust License is too restricted

2005-12-06 Thread Gray, Eric
Simon, As I understand it, the IETF has negotiated for nominal control of IPR vested in other organizations that was developed through IETF activities. Perhaps I misunderstand the purpose of the trust. However, if that is the situation, two things are easily apparent: 1) the

RE: Examples of translated RFCs

2005-12-06 Thread Gray, Eric
See below... -- -Original Message- -- From: Gray, Eric -- Sent: Tuesday, December 06, 2005 11:04 AM -- To: 'Nelson, David' -- Cc: ietf@ietf.org -- Subject: RE: Examples of translated RFCs -- -- David, -- -- Never-the-less, it can happen. Normative references - -- at least by some

RE: Examples of translated RFCs

2005-12-06 Thread Gray, Eric
David, Never-the-less, it can happen. Normative references - at least by some definitions of the term - can be to types of documents than RFCs. However, it is usually the case that papers and other documents written in French, Russian, German, etc. are made available in - or

Re: I-D file formats and internationalization

2005-12-06 Thread Harald Tveit Alvestrand
--On mandag, desember 05, 2005 09:17:08 -0500 Marshall Eubanks [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: You may have sent it in UTF-8, but arrived here as ASCII : Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed ^ ASCII? -+ And your

Re: I-D file formats and internationalization

2005-12-06 Thread Marshall Eubanks
Hello Harald; On Dec 6, 2005, at 11:37 AM, Harald Tveit Alvestrand wrote: --On mandag, desember 05, 2005 09:17:08 -0500 Marshall Eubanks [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: You may have sent it in UTF-8, but arrived here as ASCII : Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed

RE: Examples of translated RFCs

2005-12-06 Thread JFC (Jefsey) Morfin
At 16:55 06/12/2005, Nelson, David wrote: JFC (Jefsey) Morfin writes... So , IMHO, the IETF urgency is today the other way around: incorporating into RFC standards, practices or tables authoritatively written or thought in another language than English, or in English using normative

Re: Examples of translated RFCs

2005-12-06 Thread JFC (Jefsey) Morfin
At 12:41 06/12/2005, Masataka Ohta wrote: JFC (Jefsey) Morfin wrote: I *think* it has at least a handful of RFCs translated into Japanese, but my Japanese skills aren't great enough to know if I found the ones that are there. There's also http://www.rfc-editor.org/language.html, with links

Re: I know I am dumb stupid but I am also dumb stubborn [was IETF Trust license is too restricted]

2005-12-06 Thread JFC (Jefsey) Morfin
Dear Brian, thank you for your response. It calls for remarks (in the text). At 11:09 06/12/2005, Brian E Carpenter wrote: JFC (Jefsey) Morfin wrote: At 15:50 05/12/2005, Brian E Carpenter wrote: I don't understand the context of your question. All the announcements about the draft Trust

Re: Examples of translated RFCs

2005-12-06 Thread Masataka Ohta
JFC (Jefsey) Morfin wrote: I apologise if hurt your Japanese interest, There is no need of apologize. May be will you want to consider the IANA request: If you are a host, or are aware of an RFC foreign language site, please send us e-mail with the appropriate URLs.? This would avoid

Re: I-D file formats and internationalization

2005-12-06 Thread Frank Ellermann
Marshall Eubanks wrote: Even this seems to go back and forth OK. Of course, if it doesn't, it might be hard to reconstruct... Дов�й но пров�й ! ...test it. g Seriously, nobody but me uses a pre-UTF-8 MUA. Bye, Frank

Re: I-D file formats and internationalization

2005-12-06 Thread codewarrior
On Dec 6, 2005, at 11:08 PM, Frank Ellermann wrote: Marshall Eubanks wrote: Довяй но провяй ! Dont know what it means but it looks great to me...:-) ...test it. g Seriously, nobody but me uses a pre-UTF-8 MUA. Bye, Frank happy santa Santa Claus eve marc

Re: I-D file formats and internationalization

2005-12-06 Thread Frank Ellermann
Douglas Otis wrote: this could also mean utilizing graphical characters to create clean lines, boxes, and borders. This could be a matter of the character-repertoire going beyond ASCII in conjunction with a drawing application. This approach should permit a simple translation back into

Re: The IETF Trust License is too restricted

2005-12-06 Thread Frank Ellermann
Simon Josefsson wrote: unacceptable to the Debian and FreeBSD community. They are not in a legal position to grant the Trust all rights to derivative works of the work that include portions of RFCs. We're back at CC-BY vs. CC-BY-SA, aren't we ? If they are unwilling to share alike they

Re: I-D file formats and internationalization

2005-12-06 Thread Douglas Otis
On Dec 6, 2005, at 2:27 PM, Frank Ellermann wrote: Douglas Otis wrote: this could also mean utilizing graphical characters to create clean lines, boxes, and borders. This could be a matter of the character-repertoire going beyond ASCII in conjunction with a drawing application. This

Re: Examples of translated RFCs

2005-12-06 Thread Doug Ewell
Masataka Ohta mohta at necom830 dot hpcl dot titech dot ac dot jp wrote: On the other hand, with ISO 10646, I can't print Japanese characters in China. This is the same tired argument you have been advancing at least since RFC 1815, ten years ago, and it is no more true now than it was then

RE: I-D file formats and internationalization

2005-12-06 Thread Yaakov Stein
Character sets are important, but there is more. I have had bad experiences with right-to-left writing in environments not specifically designed to handle it. And the worst case is embedding of left-to-right expressions inside right-to-left text (or vice versa). האם עברית עוברת נכון ? Y(J)S

Re: Examples of translated RFCs

2005-12-06 Thread Masataka Ohta
Doug Ewell wrote: Masataka Ohta mohta at necom830 dot hpcl dot titech dot ac dot jp wrote: at? dot? On the other hand, with ISO 10646, I can't print Japanese characters in China. since most computers sold all over the world now come with at least one perfectly good Unicode-based font

Re: Examples of translated RFCs

2005-12-06 Thread Doug Ewell
Masataka Ohta mohta at necom830 dot hpcl dot titech dot ac dot jp wrote: Masataka Ohta mohta at necom830 dot hpcl dot titech dot ac dot jp wrote: at? dot? I tried to obfuscate your e-mail address from bots that search the Web-based archives. I do this to everyone. Sorry if it was

IAOC time commitment

2005-12-06 Thread IETF Chair
In response to the call for IAOC nominations at http://www1.ietf.org/mail-archive/web/ietf-announce/current/msg01819.html I was asked about the time commitment. Here's the answer: IAOC members need to attend several hours of meetings during each IETF week, including the Plenary and IAOC office