Re: Last Call: draft-aboba-sg-experiment (Experiment in Study Group Formation within the Internet Engineering Task Force (IETF)) to Experimental RFC

2007-10-09 Thread Olaf M. Kolkman
We also recommend that the evaluation criteria for success are made clear before the start of the experiment. Ok. I assume you mean evaluation criteria for the success of the experiment, not the success of an SG? Yes, the criteria for the success of the experiment. --Olaf

Re: Last Call: draft-aboba-sg-experiment (Experiment in Study Group Formation within the Internet Engineering Task Force (IETF)) to Experimental RFC

2007-10-08 Thread Olaf M. Kolkman
Dear Colleagues, The IAB has discussed the study group experiment proposed in draft- aboba-sg-experiment-02.txt. The IAB does not oppose a scoped experiment. However, As the IAB reviews BOFs and WG charters (see RFC 2850 section 2.1) as part of its architectural oversight function, we

Re: Last Call: draft-aboba-sg-experiment (Experiment in Study Group Formation within the Internet Engineering Task Force (IETF)) to Experimental RFC

2007-10-08 Thread Jari Arkko
Thanks to IAB for the review. Inline: The IAB does not oppose a scoped experiment. Great! However, As the IAB reviews BOFs and WG charters (see RFC 2850 section 2.1) as part of its architectural oversight function, we believe that the IAB should also review SG charters. Of course. I think

Re: Last Call: draft-aboba-sg-experiment (Experiment in Study Group Formation within the Internet Engineering Task Force (IETF)) to Experimental RFC

2007-09-11 Thread Jari Arkko
Keith, okay, just to be clear - I'm not sure it should be assumed that SGs follow the same rules as for WGs - especially if SGs can be closed or invitation only like design teams can. I like openness, but I also recognize that the IETF culture tends to interpret openness broadly enough to

Re: Last Call: draft-aboba-sg-experiment (Experiment in Study Group Formation within the Internet Engineering Task Force (IETF)) to Experimental RFC

2007-09-11 Thread Sam Hartman
I think we should explicitly say that SGs follow WG rules. ___ Ietf mailing list Ietf@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf

Re: Last Call: draft-aboba-sg-experiment (Experiment in Study Group Formation within the Internet Engineering Task Force (IETF)) to Experimental RFC

2007-09-11 Thread Bernard Aboba
I think we should explicitly say that SGs follow WG rules. I would agree. There are several reasons why this is probably the best way to go. Aside from the openness issues, the amount of extra work created for the IESG/Secretariat to have a different set of rules would be very substantial.

RE: Last Call: draft-aboba-sg-experiment (Experiment in Study Group Formation within the Internet Engineering Task Force (IETF)) to Experimental RFC

2007-09-11 Thread Hallam-Baker, Phillip
I would suggest that if a study goup is going to be effective it might well want to meet somewhere other than an IETF plenary. If you are going to study phishing then talk to bankers, lawyers and law enforcement. If you are going to study deployment of IPv6 talk to ISPs and to equipment

Re: Last Call: draft-aboba-sg-experiment (Experiment in Study Group Formation within the Internet Engineering Task Force (IETF)) to Experimental RFC

2007-09-10 Thread Keith Moore
I have a few questions about this proposal: - to what extent is a SG allowed to frame the problem to be solved in a way that would constrain a later WG if one were chartered? it's clear that they're not supposed to develop protocol specs, but what about requirements? goals? models of

Re: Last Call: draft-aboba-sg-experiment (Experiment in Study Group Formation within the Internet Engineering Task Force (IETF)) to Experimental RFC

2007-09-10 Thread Jari Arkko
Keith, I have a few questions about this proposal: - to what extent is a SG allowed to frame the problem to be solved in a way that would constrain a later WG if one were chartered? it's clear that they're not supposed to develop protocol specs, but what about requirements? goals? models

Re: Last Call: draft-aboba-sg-experiment (Experiment in Study Group Formation within the Internet Engineering Task Force (IETF)) to Experimental RFC

2007-09-10 Thread Keith Moore
okay, just to be clear - I'm not sure it should be assumed that SGs follow the same rules as for WGs - especially if SGs can be closed or invitation only like design teams can. I like openness, but I also recognize that the IETF culture tends to interpret openness broadly enough to mean that

Last Call: draft-aboba-sg-experiment (Experiment in Study Group Formation within the Internet Engineering Task Force (IETF)) to Experimental RFC

2007-09-10 Thread The IESG
The IESG has received a request from an individual submitter to consider the following document: - 'Experiment in Study Group Formation within the Internet Engineering Task Force (IETF) ' draft-aboba-sg-experiment-02.txt as an Experimental RFC The IESG plans to make a decision in the next