Another reason why I would not go with Campanula pallida var. tibetica right now, is that I think the sepals of that species are supposed to be erect, and not spreading. The picture in this link: http://www.planetefleurs.fr/Systematique/Campanulaceae/Campan16f.htm and also this illustration http://www.efloras.org/object_page.aspx?object_id=86676&flora_id=5 show erect sepals. - Tabish
On Mon, Nov 8, 2010 at 5:06 AM, Gurcharan Singh <singh...@gmail.com> wrote: > Ok Tabish ji > Let us hope we find truly representative C. cana some day. In the mean time > we will also keep a watch on two types of our plants: Mine and FOI one with > longer linear calyx lobes (which we have agreed to be C. pallida var. > pallida); and the other on FOI and Prashant ji's plant with toothed broader > calyx lobes. > By the way both latter specimens (C. pallida var. pallida of FOI; and > Prashant ji's second set) have broader calyx lobes, and both growing above > 10,000 ft. Won't it be more appropriate to call them var. tibetica (ignoring > the flower colour, and imagining that calyx lobes in C. pallida can be > toothed). Please give a thought to it. > > -- > Dr. Gurcharan Singh > Retired Associate Professor > SGTB Khalsa College, University of Delhi, Delhi-110007 > Res: 932 Anand Kunj, Vikas Puri, New Delhi-110018. > Phone: 011-25518297 Mob: 9810359089 > http://people.du.ac.in/~singhg45/ > > > On Sun, Nov 7, 2010 at 10:57 AM, Tabish <tabi...@gmail.com> wrote: >> >> Gurcharan ji, >> In F. Brit. Ind., the sepals of Campanula colorata are described as >> "lanceolate or triangular lanceolate, entire or toothed". Sepals of >> Campanula cana are also supposed to be coarsely toothed. So, I don't >> know how toothedness would distinguish the two species. >> - Tabish >> >> On Mon, Nov 8, 2010 at 12:17 AM, Gurcharan Singh <singh...@gmail.com> >> wrote: >> > Thank you Tabish ji >> > Please also give thought to distinctly toothed margin in both Prashant >> > ji's >> > second set and plant at FOI. >> > -- >> > Dr. Gurcharan Singh >> > Retired Associate Professor >> > SGTB Khalsa College, University of Delhi, Delhi-110007 >> > Res: 932 Anand Kunj, Vikas Puri, New Delhi-110018. >> > Phone: 011-25518297 Mob: 9810359089 >> > http://people.du.ac.in/~singhg45/ >> > >> > >> > On Sun, Nov 7, 2010 at 10:25 AM, Tabish <tabi...@gmail.com> wrote: >> >> >> >> Gurcharan ji, >> >> I concur with your thinking that your plant from Manali and the >> >> plant on FOI currently (will be corrected soon) as C. pallida var. >> >> tibetica are actually *Campanula pallida var. pallida*. >> >> Also, I agree that Prashant's flower and that on FOI currently as >> >> Campanula pallida var. pallida appear to belong to the same species. >> >> However, the sepals in the two sets may be better described as >> >> triangular, instead of broadly lanceolate. According to Flora of >> >> British India, the sepals of C. colorata (which is now considered a >> >> synonym of C. pallida var. pallida) are described as >> >> triangular-lanceolate to lanceolate. The sepals of C. cana are >> >> described as broadly lanceolate. The sepals in both the sets, seem to >> >> agree better (to my eye) with those in this picture of Campanula >> >> colorata >> >> http://plantsoftibet.lifedesks.org/image/view/2263/_original >> >> rather than the sepals seen in these pictures of Campanual cana >> >> http://www.efloras.org/object_page.aspx?object_id=104630&flora_id=800 >> >> http://www.efloras.org/object_page.aspx?object_id=104631&flora_id=800 >> >> It appears to me that C. pallida var. pallida has two types of plants >> >> - one with narrow lanceshaped sepals and pale-purple or whitish >> >> flowers - the other with more triangular sepals and purple flowers. >> >> - Tabish >> >> >> >> On Sun, Nov 7, 2010 at 10:50 PM, Gurcharan Singh <singh...@gmail.com> >> >> wrote: >> >> > Tabish ji >> >> > Even before replying to another mail on C. cana, I had initiated this >> >> > mail. >> >> > Today I chanced upon this link which prompts me to rethink on the >> >> > above >> >> > thread, and identity of above two sets of photographs uploaded by >> >> > Prashant >> >> > ji, and my plant from Manali, which I had initially identified as C. >> >> > pallida, but subsequently C. cana provisionally. >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > http://www.planetefleurs.fr/Systematique/Campanulaceae/Campanula_pallida.htm >> >> > If we look at the description in Flora of British India, Flora >> >> > Simlensis, >> >> > and the above link, one thing is clear: C. pallida var. pallida is a >> >> > plant >> >> > of lower altitudes and has narrower and longer calyx lobes, not >> >> > overlapping >> >> > at base. My plant from Manali and the plant on FOI as C. pallida var. >> >> > tibetica satisfy this criteria and are according to me are C. pallida >> >> > var. >> >> > pallida (the plant at FOI as var. tibetica is from mussoorie, a much >> >> > lower >> >> > altitude for this variety). I have yet to see true C. pallida var. >> >> > tibetica >> >> > resembling above link. >> >> > For a moment forget flower colour. It may be purple or lighter. The >> >> > first >> >> > set of plants by Prashant ji is considerably dry, but second set is >> >> > very >> >> > clear. It has calyx lobes much broader like var. tibetica but they >> >> > are >> >> > clearly toothed along margin. Same is true for plant depicted at FOI >> >> > as >> >> > C. >> >> > pallida var. pallida. For me both belong to Campanula cana, which >> >> > according >> >> > to FB has broader calyx lobes with toothed margin. >> >> > Your comments on these please >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > -- >> >> > Dr. Gurcharan Singh >> >> > Retired Associate Professor >> >> > SGTB Khalsa College, University of Delhi, Delhi-110007 >> >> > Res: 932 Anand Kunj, Vikas Puri, New Delhi-110018. >> >> > Phone: 011-25518297 Mob: 9810359089 >> >> > http://people.du.ac.in/~singhg45/ >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > On Mon, Oct 18, 2010 at 11:01 PM, shrikant ingalhalikar >> >> > <le...@rediffmail.com> wrote: >> >> >> >> >> >> Good, after a lot of brain storming my wild card ID seems validated. >> >> >> My guess was not too wild. I have observed C. colorata on stone >> >> >> walls >> >> >> of Sinhagad near Pune. The pecularity of this plant has been that >> >> >> stamens in some flowers were missing or in some cases the corolla >> >> >> itself was missing. The fruits get formed inside the calyx without >> >> >> any >> >> >> corolla. C. dimorphantha is found on Purandar fort. I wonder about >> >> >> what is dimorphic in the flowers of this sp. I am aware that this >> >> >> thread has gone far enough but someone can help me sort out some >> >> >> loose >> >> >> ends. Regards, Shrikant >> >> >> >> >> >> On Oct 18, 2:11 pm, Prashant awale <pkaw...@gmail.com> wrote: >> >> >> > Dear Friends, >> >> >> > This i found in the rock crevices at the altitude of approx. 11500 >> >> >> > ft >> >> >> > on >> >> >> > the >> >> >> > way to Hampta pass. Flowers were very attractive in appearance. >> >> >> > Enclosing >> >> >> > the snaps of flowers, leaves and stem. >> >> >> > >> >> >> > Date/Time: 27-09-2010 / 09:45AM >> >> >> > Location: On the way to Hampta Pass at approx. 11500 ft altitude >> >> >> > Habitat: Wild >> >> >> > Plant Habit: Herb >> >> >> > Stem reddish brown, hairy >> >> >> > >> >> >> > regards >> >> >> > Prashant >> >> >> > >> >> >> > IMG_1342cr.jpg >> >> >> > 133KViewDownload >> >> >> > >> >> >> > IMG_1343side.jpg >> >> >> > 166KViewDownload >> >> >> > >> >> >> > IMG_1341.jpg >> >> >> > 191KViewDownload >> >> >> > >> >> >> > IMG_1342leafstem.jpg >> >> >> > 159KViewDownload >> >> >> > >> >> >> > IMG_1343.jpg >> >> >> > 168KViewDownload >> >> >> > >> >> >> > IMG_1344.jpg >> >> >> > 173KViewDownload >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > > > > >
