Re: [IPsec] PSK mode

2015-08-24 Thread Paul Wouters
On Mon, 24 Aug 2015, Tero Kivinen wrote: I think we should continue pushing the draft-nagayama-ipsecme-ipsec-with-qkd forward, and specify it as generic method where out of band shared keys can be brought in to the SKEYSEED or KEYMAT. +1 Paul ___

Re: [IPsec] PSK mode

2015-08-24 Thread Tero Kivinen
Valery Smyslov writes: SKEYSEED = prf(Ni | Nr, g^ir) {SK_d | SK_ai | SK_ar | SK_ei | SK_er | SK_pi | SK_pr} = prf+ (SKEYSEED, Ni | Nr | SPIi | SPIr) This change was intentional, it was made by Hugo Krawczyk during work on IKEv2 due to complaints from the community that if IKEv1 PSK auth

Re: [IPsec] PSK mode

2015-08-24 Thread Yaron Sheffer
Even in a world where quantum computers are a risk that we need to consider in our crypto, QKD will still remain a niche. So to go back to the original question, NTRU+BLISS are a possible solution if we care about this problem. QKD is not. Thanks, Yaron On 08/24/2015 06:36 PM, Paul

Re: [IPsec] PSK mode

2015-08-24 Thread Michael Richardson
Andreas Steffen andreas.stef...@strongswan.org wrote: an NTRU Encryption-based IKEv2 key exchange is actually what the strongSwan open source VPN software has been offering with the ntru plugin for more than a year: https://wiki.strongswan.org/projects/strongswan/wiki/NTRU I

Re: [IPsec] PSK mode

2015-08-20 Thread Valery Smyslov
: IPsecME WG ipsec@ietf.org Subject: Re: [IPsec] PSK mode Dan Harkins dhark...@lounge.org wrote: https://www.nsa.gov/ia/programs/suiteb_cryptography/index.shtml CSfC deployments involving an IKE/IPsec layer may use RFC 2409-conformant implementations of the IKE standard (IKEv1) together

Re: [IPsec] PSK mode

2015-08-20 Thread Mike Borza
...@sandelman.ca [mailto:m...@sandelman.ca] On Behalf Of Michael Richardson Sent: Wednesday, August 19, 2015 22:05 To: Mike Borza mbo...@elliptictech.com Cc: Dan Harkins dhark...@lounge.org; IPsecME WG ipsec@ietf.org Subject: Re: [IPsec] PSK mode Mike Borza mbo...@elliptictech.com wrote

Re: [IPsec] PSK mode

2015-08-20 Thread Scott Fluhrer (sfluhrer)
-Original Message- From: IPsec [mailto:ipsec-boun...@ietf.org] On Behalf Of Valery Smyslov Sent: Thursday, August 20, 2015 3:24 AM To: Mike Borza; Michael Richardson; Dan Harkins Cc: IPsecME WG Subject: Re: [IPsec] PSK mode Hi, IKEv2 has symmetrick PSK authentication method

Re: [IPsec] PSK mode

2015-08-20 Thread Paul Hoffman
We should ask the NSA authors or their proxies before we do anything. Heck, maybe some NSA folks might even want to contribute to such an extension to IKEv2. We are in absolutely no rush, given how long it will be before serious researchers think there are practical quantum computers. --Paul

Re: [IPsec] PSK mode

2015-08-20 Thread Andreas Steffen
Hi Scott, an NTRU Encryption-based IKEv2 key exchange is actually what the strongSwan open source VPN software has been offering with the ntru plugin for more than a year: https://wiki.strongswan.org/projects/strongswan/wiki/NTRU For the four security strengths of 112, 128, 192 and 256 bits

Re: [IPsec] PSK mode

2015-08-20 Thread Paul_Koning
On Aug 20, 2015, at 10:26 AM, Scott Fluhrer (sfluhrer) sfluh...@cisco.com wrote: ... Does NSA mean this difference when claiming that IKEv1 PSK mode is the only QC-safe protocol? I believe so. Should we add similar mode to IKEv2? I believe that there is an easier alternative; the

Re: [IPsec] PSK mode

2015-08-19 Thread Mike Borza
of that capability in the five to ten years timeframe. Mike -Original Message- From: IPsec [mailto:ipsec-boun...@ietf.org] On Behalf Of Michael Richardson Sent: Wednesday, August 19, 2015 13:17 To: Dan Harkins dhark...@lounge.org Cc: IPsecME WG ipsec@ietf.org Subject: Re: [IPsec] PSK mode

Re: [IPsec] PSK mode

2015-08-19 Thread Michael Richardson
Dan Harkins dhark...@lounge.org wrote: https://www.nsa.gov/ia/programs/suiteb_cryptography/index.shtml CSfC deployments involving an IKE/IPsec layer may use RFC 2409-conformant implementations of the IKE standard (IKEv1) together with large, high-entropy, pre-shared keys and

Re: [IPsec] PSK mode

2015-08-19 Thread Mike Borza
: [IPsec] PSK mode On Aug 19, 2015, at 1:32 PM, Mike Borza mbo...@elliptictech.com wrote: They don't mention IKEv2. I don't know IKEv2 well enough to know whether there are any symmetric PSK authentication schemes, but if not, perhaps there should be. The point they're making

Re: [IPsec] PSK mode

2015-08-19 Thread Michael Richardson
Mike Borza mbo...@elliptictech.com wrote: They don't mention IKEv2. I don't know IKEv2 well enough to know whether there are any symmetric PSK authentication schemes, but if not, perhaps there should be. The point they're making is that the There are PSK methods. But, all the

[IPsec] PSK mode

2015-08-18 Thread Dan Harkins
https://www.nsa.gov/ia/programs/suiteb_cryptography/index.shtml CSfC deployments involving an IKE/IPsec layer may use RFC 2409-conformant implementations of the IKE standard (IKEv1) together with large, high-entropy, pre-shared keys and the AES-256 encryption algorithm. RFC 2409 is