Re: [Lightning-dev] A proposal for up-front payments.

2019-11-22 Thread Rusty Russell
Bastien TEINTURIER writes: > I think there's another alternative than upfront payments to prevent spam, > which is maybe less > controversial (but potentially less effective as well - to be investigated). > > Why not adapt what has been done with email spam and PoW/merkle puzzles? If we can't com

Re: [Lightning-dev] A proposal for up-front payments.

2019-11-22 Thread Orfeas Stefanos Thyfronitis Litos
Good morning ZmnSCPxj, > requiring a fee is equivalent to requiring proof-of-work, incentive-wise. Not necessarily, given that 1) there is a finite bitcoin supply but an eventually infinite PoW supply (relevant in the unlikely case fees are burned) 2) sats are transferrable, whereas PoW isn't (re

Re: [Lightning-dev] A proposal for up-front payments.

2019-11-22 Thread Bastien TEINTURIER
While I agree with most of your points, I think there are subtleties to explore before completely rejecting the idea. every use of proof-of-work today (other than to power Bitcoin itself, as > Bitcoin cannot support itself) can instead be done by using Bitcoins to > impose this economic cost. > T

Re: [Lightning-dev] A proposal for up-front payments.

2019-11-22 Thread ZmnSCPxj via Lightning-dev
Good morning Bastien, > I think there's another alternative than upfront payments to prevent spam, > which is maybe lessĀ  > controversial (but potentially less effective as well - to be investigated). > > Why not adapt what has been done with email spam and PoW/merkle puzzles? > The high-level id

Re: [Lightning-dev] A proposal for up-front payments.

2019-11-22 Thread Pierre
> The high-level idea would be that the sender must solve a small PoW puzzle ___ Lightning-dev mailing list Lightning-dev@lists.linuxfoundation.org https://lists.linuxfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/lightning-dev

Re: [Lightning-dev] A proposal for up-front payments.

2019-11-22 Thread Bastien TEINTURIER
I think there's another alternative than upfront payments to prevent spam, which is maybe less controversial (but potentially less effective as well - to be investigated). Why not adapt what has been done with email spam and PoW/merkle puzzles? The high-level idea would be that the sender must sol