On Sun, 2004-12-12 at 12:03 +0100, Esben Stien wrote:
> Frank Barknecht <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
>
> > So basically they want to protect their investment in getting
> > knowledge of how to implement a powerful firewire interface from the
> > eyes of other hardware manufacturers.
>
> A society
Lee Revell wrote:
> Christ, what the fuck country do you live in? Don't you understand the
> concept of people having bills to pay? Or do you just assume the RME
> guys are independenly wealthy and just design sound cards for fun?
Interestingly some people seem to be existing who are working on
Frank Barknecht <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
> So basically they want to protect their investment in getting
> knowledge of how to implement a powerful firewire interface from the
> eyes of other hardware manufacturers.
A society where you put money higher than cooperating with other
people is no
Hello!
Though I read about 50 percent of this thread, I don't know where exactly to
add this replay. So I put it topmost.
Eric S. Raymond has an opinion about that in his paper called "The Magic
Cauldron" (17. Appendix: Why Closing Drivers Loses A Vender Money):
http://www.catb.org/~esr/writ
Eliot Blennerhassett <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
> we at audioscience
I will certainly put my eyes on audioscience now.
Having a company working so close with the community is really great.
--
Esben Stien is [EMAIL PROTECTED]
http://www.esben-stien.name
irc://irc.esben-stien.name/%23contact
Hallo,
Mark Knecht hat gesagt: // Mark Knecht wrote:
> On Sun, 28 Nov 2004 22:09:17 +0100, Frank Barknecht <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> >
> > Nobody can steal free software, because they already own it. (As long
> > as they follow the rules as stated in the GPL etc.)
>
> This is so patently
On Sun, 2004-11-28 at 20:19, Marek Peteraj wrote:
> On Mon, 2004-11-29 at 10:27, Eliot Blennerhassett wrote:
> > > > > Ah i don't know. I mean, you guys have put a lot of time into what
> > > > > your
> > > > > doing anyway. And in my case the trust in rme turned out to be a
> > > > > bummer
> >
al info. I did not purchase the card
> > > because of RME telling me it would be OK to use the card under Linux.
> > > They never stated such things.
> >
> > Unfortunately they did. To quote a part of their response:
> > "> [linux-audio-dev] RME is n
n such case claiming
> > that they do support alsa is just plain unfair.
>
> RME never 'supported' the card under Linux. The 'supported' the
> developers by providing technical info. I did not purchase the card
> because of RME telling me it would be OK to use the card under Linux.
> They never stated such things.
Unfortunately they did. To quote a part of their response:
"> [linux-audio-dev] RME is no more
Complete BS. We have and will support Linux/Alsa as before. The only
excluded product is the Fireface."
Marek
On Mon, 2004-11-29 at 10:27, Eliot Blennerhassett wrote:
> > > > Ah i don't know. I mean, you guys have put a lot of time into what your
> > > > doing anyway. And in my case the trust in rme turned out to be a bummer
> > > > just becasue i was thinking that they have trust in the open source
> > >
On Sun, 2004-11-28 at 21:31, Mark Knecht wrote:
> On Sun, 28 Nov 2004 15:20:33 -0500, Lee Revell <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > On Sun, 2004-11-28 at 12:06 -0800, Mark Knecht wrote:
> >
> >
> > > > Fine with me. If I shelled out for RME hardware I better be able to
> > > > call RME for support,
On Sun, 2004-11-28 at 22:09 +0100, Frank Barknecht wrote:
> Hallo,
> Lee Revell hat gesagt: // Lee Revell wrote:
>
> > Nvidia has a lot more valuable IP at stake than VIA when they
> > release an open source driver for their 3D gear. If you don't
> > understand why, I can't help you.
>
> I do un
On Mon, Nov 29, 2004 at 09:27:46AM +1300, Eliot Blennerhassett wrote:
> So, what is the difference between our current offerings and what you'd like
> to see in a "pro audio card"?
I don't see any gross difference except the input/output connectors.
Bundle the 5042 or 5044 with adapters or break
Hallo,
Lee Revell hat gesagt: // Lee Revell wrote:
> Nvidia has a lot more valuable IP at stake than VIA when they
> release an open source driver for their 3D gear. If you don't
> understand why, I can't help you.
I do understand this very well. Because this is the central conflict:
I will not
> > > Ah i don't know. I mean, you guys have put a lot of time into what your
> > > doing anyway. And in my case the trust in rme turned out to be a bummer
> > > just becasue i was thinking that they have trust in the open source
> > > developers. If they did have such trust, something like this w
On Sun, 2004-11-28 at 18:12 +0100, Frank Barknecht wrote:
> And who the heck cares, that you
> cannot buy a single modern 3D-card anymore, which has open source
> drivers, by any manufacturer?
Sure you can. The VIA unichrome cards have open 3D drivers. But, of
course, it's not the best 3D hardwa
On Sun, 2004-11-28 at 19:53, Jan Depner wrote:
> On Sun, 2004-11-28 at 10:15, Marek Peteraj wrote:
> > On Sun, 2004-11-28 at 14:50, Tim Goetze wrote:
> > > [Marek Peteraj]
> > > >> RME has provided
> > > >> "Pro" grade audio hardware when Linux Audio needed it
> > > >> in order to become a legitima
On Sun, 2004-11-28 at 10:15, Marek Peteraj wrote:
> On Sun, 2004-11-28 at 14:50, Tim Goetze wrote:
> > [Marek Peteraj]
> > >> RME has provided
> > >> "Pro" grade audio hardware when Linux Audio needed it
> > >> in order to become a legitimate alternative to
> > >> proprietary solutions.
> > >
> > >
Marek Peteraj wrote:
Oh BTW, just in case :)
http://www.petitiononline.com/atipet/petition.html
Free as in Nelson Mandela :)
~ Simon
> Why? Because with the availability of closed drivers the (market)
> demand for open source drivers suddenly becomes as small as the
> handful of Libre Software supporters like I am one. The "just make my
> hardware work" type of Linux users is not interested in Open Source
> drivers anymore, so w
Hallo,
Jan Depner hat gesagt: // Jan Depner wrote:
> On Sat, 2004-11-27 at 15:36, Lee Revell wrote:
> > IMO the issue is not whether RME's concern is valid - clearly it is.
> > Sorry, but arguing otherwise makes us look stupid and naive. The issue
> > is how to address this concern. If that mean
On Sun, 2004-11-28 at 14:50, Tim Goetze wrote:
> [Marek Peteraj]
> >> RME has provided
> >> "Pro" grade audio hardware when Linux Audio needed it
> >> in order to become a legitimate alternative to
> >> proprietary solutions.
> >
> >Not really. It was Paul, Thomas, and one other guy(don't remember
[Marek Peteraj]
>> RME has provided
>> "Pro" grade audio hardware when Linux Audio needed it
>> in order to become a legitimate alternative to
>> proprietary solutions.
>
>Not really. It was Paul, Thomas, and one other guy(don't remember the
>name) who did. Remember it was almost no investment from
On Sun, 2004-11-28 at 14:03, tim hall wrote:
> Last Saturday 27 November 2004 21:36, Lee Revell was like:
> > On Sat, 2004-11-27 at 15:43 -0500, Lee Revell wrote:
> > > > Did this happen?
> > >
> > > Maybe not to them but look at Mackie and Behringer.
> >
> > Just to save people some googling here
On Sun, 2004-11-28 at 13:35, R Parker wrote:
> --- Marek Peteraj <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > On Sat, 2004-11-27 at 23:21, Lee Revell wrote:
> > > On Sat, 2004-11-27 at 16:22 -0600, Jan Depner
> > wrote:
> > > > Man, I've been waiting all day for someone to
> > say this. Personally,
>
On Sat, 2004-11-27 at 22:36, Lee Revell wrote:
> On Sat, 2004-11-27 at 15:43 -0500, Lee Revell wrote:
> > > Did this happen?
> >
> > Maybe not to them but look at Mackie and Behringer.
>
> Just to save people some googling here is a thread that documents the
> long and colorful history of pro aud
On Sat, 2004-11-27 at 23:21, Lee Revell wrote:
> On Sat, 2004-11-27 at 16:22 -0600, Jan Depner wrote:
> > Man, I've been waiting all day for someone to say this. Personally,
> > open source is not a religion for me so a closed source driver would be
> > fine and dandy. Let the flames commence
On Sat, 2004-11-27 at 21:43, Lee Revell wrote:
> On Sat, 2004-11-27 at 01:51 +0100, Marek Peteraj wrote:
> > > They create software to support it and make it work. Then all the
> > > technical information goes into the public domain and some low cost
> > > manufacturer from Taiwan or Russia or some
On Sat, 2004-11-27 at 16:22 -0600, Jan Depner wrote:
> Man, I've been waiting all day for someone to say this. Personally,
> open source is not a religion for me so a closed source driver would be
> fine and dandy. Let the flames commence - now where did I put my
> asbestos underwear?
Eh,
On Sat, 2004-11-27 at 15:36, Lee Revell wrote:
> On Sat, 2004-11-27 at 15:43 -0500, Lee Revell wrote:
> > > Did this happen?
> >
> > Maybe not to them but look at Mackie and Behringer.
>
> Just to save people some googling here is a thread that documents the
> long and colorful history of pro aud
On Sat, 2004-11-27 at 15:43 -0500, Lee Revell wrote:
> > Did this happen?
>
> Maybe not to them but look at Mackie and Behringer.
Just to save people some googling here is a thread that documents the
long and colorful history of pro audio hardware manufacturers blatantly
ripping each other off, o
On Sat, 2004-11-27 at 01:51 +0100, Marek Peteraj wrote:
> > They create software to support it and make it work. Then all the
> > technical information goes into the public domain and some low cost
> > manufacturer from Taiwan or Russia or somewhere else knocks off a copy
> > and sells it for 1/2 t
On Fri, 2004-11-26 at 11:05 -0800, Florin Andrei wrote:
> On Fri, 2004-11-26 at 01:20 +0100, CK wrote:
>
> > I still don't see the point, the GPL _protects_ their IP rights
>
> It only protects the source of the driver.
>
> > if I
> > was the evil corporation trying to rip off rme I could aswell
sorry I'll do this at once:
I read:
> On Fri, 2004-11-26 at 23:17, Mark Knecht wrote:
> > This I agree with, but the best way to fight for it (speaking as a
> > business man) is to develop a real market for it. We need thousands of
> > buyers. Develop the market and hardware manufacturers will com
On Fri, 2004-11-26 at 22:48, Tim Hockin wrote:
> On Sat, Nov 27, 2004 at 12:34:17AM +0100, Marek Peteraj wrote:
> > Which seems like it's the beginning of end for linux pro-audio hw
> > support if we don't fight for it. Right now it concerns just me, but it
> > might concern everyone in the near fu
On Fri, 2004-11-26 at 23:17, Mark Knecht wrote:
> On Sat, 27 Nov 2004 00:34:17 +0100, Marek Peteraj <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > 2. I can only understand the point of view of open source developers
> > here, since they also invested an awfull lot of time (and money that
> > they didn't get bac
On Sat, Nov 27, 2004 at 12:34:17AM +0100, Marek Peteraj wrote:
> Which seems like it's the beginning of end for linux pro-audio hw
> support if we don't fight for it. Right now it concerns just me, but it
> might concern everyone in the near future.
How can we fight it? I've been holding off on
>
> I assume that RME has developped their own protocols, which they don't
> want to share. And frankly I can understand their point of view, because
> I think an awfull lot of time (=money) must have been spent to develop
> an efficient protocol.
1. So they haven't invested the a comparable
On Fri, 2004-11-26 at 19:36, Georg Rudolph wrote:
> Please, let's not be too harsh. I recently bought the pcmcia based
> multiface from RME, only because it has linux support, and it works
> great, on both kernels. Of course, firewire is cooler, but there is this
> way out.
Not for me. :)
any
On Fri, 2004-11-26 at 01:20 +0100, CK wrote:
> I still don't see the point, the GPL _protects_ their IP rights
It only protects the source of the driver.
> if I
> was the evil corporation trying to rip off rme I could aswell rip the
> thing apart and reverse engineer the code and the protocol,
139Uwe Koloska wrote:
CK wrote:
I read:
for the record, i sent a mail to rme as well and got exactly the same
answer (in german) which i saw before here on this list.
I still don't see the point, the GPL _protects_ their IP rights, if I
was the evil corporation trying to rip off rme I could aswel
I read:
> Is this true, that a firewire driver for one card can be used with
> equal power for another card?
what I was referring to is rather the idea to sell the same hardware with
minor modification at very different prices and putting the limitations in
the binary only driver (miro dc10 and d
CK wrote:
I read:
for the record, i sent a mail to rme as well and got exactly the same
answer (in german) which i saw before here on this list.
I still don't see the point, the GPL _protects_ their IP rights, if I
was the evil corporation trying to rip off rme I could aswell rip the
thing apart a
On Fri, Nov 26, 2004 at 01:20:25AM +0100, CK wrote:
> I read:
> > for the record, i sent a mail to rme as well and got exactly the same
> > answer (in german) which i saw before here on this list.
>
> I still don't see the point, the GPL _protects_ their IP rights, if I
> was the evil corporation
I read:
> for the record, i sent a mail to rme as well and got exactly the same
> answer (in german) which i saw before here on this list.
I still don't see the point, the GPL _protects_ their IP rights, if I
was the evil corporation trying to rip off rme I could aswell rip the
thing apart and re
On Fri, Nov 26, 2004 at 12:54:01AM +0100, Marek Peteraj wrote:
> I knew exactly it wasn't at the time i bought it, i just took it for
> granted. I talked to Thomas Charbonnel back in april at the ZKM and it
> seemed that they were positive about alsa support for fireface.
same for me, with the sub
On Thu, 2004-11-25 at 20:50, Florin Andrei wrote:
> On Thu, 2004-11-25 at 04:22 -0500, Rick B wrote:
>
> > I kind of got the impression that the annoucement was just pertaining to
> > RME *Firewire* audio interfaces.
Consider that they have released some specs for their HDSP hammerfall
series, w
On Thu, Nov 25, 2004 at 07:53:18PM +0100, Frank Barknecht wrote:
> So basically they want to protect their investment in getting
> knowledge of how to implement a powerful firewire interface from the
> eyes of other hardware manufacturers. It's a pity, of course, but also
> somehow understandable.
Hallo,
Tim Blechmann hat gesagt: // Tim Blechmann wrote:
> > FW Audio gibt es derzeit unter Alsa gar nicht. Und sehr viel von dem,
> > was beim FF800 FW-technisch unter Windows geschieht, ist
> > Eigenentwicklung. Wir würden also mit einem OS-ALSA-Treiber bzw. der
> > dafür notwendigen Hardware-Do
> The official statement is that there will be no support for ALSA
> (Linux) FireWire drivers from RME. In other words there will be no
> such drivers, as it is impossible to write them without tons of
> hardware and software documentation from RME. And we won't share these
> information with anyon
On Thu, 2004-11-25 at 02:49 +0300, Dmitry Baikov wrote:
> Time to develop really open (FireWire?) audio interface, free as in speech.
Developing and manufacturing hardware is very different from doing the
same things for software.
Economic models that work for one may or may not work for the other
"The Firefox Crew" is referring to the team that have recently released
version 1.0 of Firefox [http://www.mozilla.org/products/firefox/], an
Internet browser based on Mozilla [http://www.mozilla.org].
They recently rallied to fundraise money to fund a full page
advertisement in the New York Times
On tor, 2004-11-25 at 11:53 +1100, Dan Harper wrote:
> Maybe we should start a sooper dooper fundraising scheme like what the
> firefox crew did ;)
Well, my 20¤ is here, but who would you like me to send them to?.
Preferrably to someone not going to Goa next week.
On the other hand, I am not at
Maybe we should start a sooper dooper fundraising scheme like what the
firefox crew did ;)
On Thu, 2004-11-25 at 01:42 +0100, Jens M Andreasen wrote:
> On tor, 2004-11-25 at 02:49 +0300, Dmitry Baikov wrote:
> > Time to develop really open (FireWire?) audio interface, free as in speech.
>
> As y
On tor, 2004-11-25 at 02:49 +0300, Dmitry Baikov wrote:
> Time to develop really open (FireWire?) audio interface, free as in speech.
As you might have already noticed, free (as in freedom) designs for
hardware have been discussed here lately.
There is a fee for prototyping though! I believe tha
Hi all,
I will also make my official statement to all sound card manufacturers.
I will only buy sound cards that are fully operational with my operating
system of choice - Linux. Around 6 months ago I did just this, I was in
the market for a professional multichannel sound card interface for my
l
Time to develop really open (FireWire?) audio interface, free as in speech.
On Thu, Nov 25, 2004 at 02:14:11AM +0100, Marek Peteraj wrote:
> The official statement is that there will be no support for ALSA (Linux)
> FireWire drivers from RME. In other words there will be no such drivers,
> as it is impossible to write them without tons of hardware and software
> documenta
Hi all,
The official statement is that there will be no support for RME from
me. In other words I will buy no hardware or software from RME because
it is impossible for me to share my hard earned money with a company
that is unwilling to support my operating system of choice. But I'll
ce
Hi all,
sorry for crossposting, just wanted to let everybody know:
The official statement is that there will be no support for ALSA (Linux)
FireWire drivers from RME. In other words there will be no such drivers,
as it is impossible to write them without tons of hardware and software
documentati
60 matches
Mail list logo
