RE: The latest Microsoft FUD. This time from BillG, himself.

2001-07-01 Thread Greg Rollins
Microsoft FUD. This time from BillG, himself. On Sat, 30 Jun 2001, Dmitri Pogosyan wrote: > Well, this is an old as world argument used to take your freedom away - > 'law obeying citizens have nothing to fear' except that you are opting in, by purchasing the product. > Why not all

RE: The latest Microsoft FUD. This time from BillG, himself.

2001-07-01 Thread Greg Rollins
Microsoft FUD. This time from BillG, himself. On Sat, 30 Jun 2001, Dmitri Pogosyan wrote: Well, this is an old as world argument used to take your freedom away - 'law obeying citizens have nothing to fear' except that you are opting in, by purchasing the product. Why not allow police to search

[OT] Re: The latest Microsoft FUD. This time from BillG, himself.

2001-06-30 Thread Daniel Phillips
On Saturday 30 June 2001 16:22, Dmitri Pogosyan wrote: > Well, this is an old as world argument used to take your freedom away - > 'law obeying citizens have nothing to fear' While I'm as interested as anyone else in the exact steps Microsoft takes to drive users to us, I don't see what this

Re: The latest Microsoft FUD. This time from BillG, himself.

2001-06-30 Thread Ted Unangst
On Sat, 30 Jun 2001, Dmitri Pogosyan wrote: > Well, this is an old as world argument used to take your freedom away - > 'law obeying citizens have nothing to fear' except that you are opting in, by purchasing the product. > Why not allow police to search your car at every moment they wish ? >

Re: The latest Microsoft FUD. This time from BillG, himself.

2001-06-30 Thread Dmitri Pogosyan
Lionel Elie Mamane wrote: > > On Fri, Jun 29, 2001 at 07:50:36PM -0700, David Schwartz wrote: > > > More likely, Microsoft will display escalating suspicion with > > each install, If they find out that a key is definitely being > > abused, they will stop issuing unlock codes for it. In

Re: The latest Microsoft FUD. This time from BillG, himself.

2001-06-30 Thread Lionel Elie Mamane
On Fri, Jun 29, 2001 at 07:50:36PM -0700, David Schwartz wrote: > More likely, Microsoft will display escalating suspicion with > each install, If they find out that a key is definitely being > abused, they will stop issuing unlock codes for it. In other words, > they will cause great

Re: The latest Microsoft FUD. This time from BillG, himself.

2001-06-30 Thread Lionel Elie Mamane
On Fri, Jun 29, 2001 at 07:50:36PM -0700, David Schwartz wrote: More likely, Microsoft will display escalating suspicion with each install, If they find out that a key is definitely being abused, they will stop issuing unlock codes for it. In other words, they will cause great

Re: The latest Microsoft FUD. This time from BillG, himself.

2001-06-30 Thread Dmitri Pogosyan
Lionel Elie Mamane wrote: On Fri, Jun 29, 2001 at 07:50:36PM -0700, David Schwartz wrote: More likely, Microsoft will display escalating suspicion with each install, If they find out that a key is definitely being abused, they will stop issuing unlock codes for it. In other

Re: The latest Microsoft FUD. This time from BillG, himself.

2001-06-30 Thread Ted Unangst
On Sat, 30 Jun 2001, Dmitri Pogosyan wrote: Well, this is an old as world argument used to take your freedom away - 'law obeying citizens have nothing to fear' except that you are opting in, by purchasing the product. Why not allow police to search your car at every moment they wish ? If

[OT] Re: The latest Microsoft FUD. This time from BillG, himself.

2001-06-30 Thread Daniel Phillips
On Saturday 30 June 2001 16:22, Dmitri Pogosyan wrote: Well, this is an old as world argument used to take your freedom away - 'law obeying citizens have nothing to fear' While I'm as interested as anyone else in the exact steps Microsoft takes to drive users to us, I don't see what this has

RE: The latest Microsoft FUD. This time from BillG, himself.

2001-06-29 Thread David Schwartz
Lew Wolfgang wrote: > It is something that I read somewhere. If memory serves, Microsoft > will allow two installs on the same CD-key. Note that this is > different from the old MS key manager, all you had to do there > was enter the CD-key. There were no real-time checks on how > many times

RE: The latest Microsoft FUD. This time from BillG, himself.

2001-06-29 Thread Lew Wolfgang
On Fri, 29 Jun 2001, David Schwartz wrote: > > If the > > CD key is used again they just refuse to send the final key. > > Do you have any evidence to support this statement or is it an assumption? > This is almost never the way such schemes are implemented. The policy is to > send the final key

RE: The latest Microsoft FUD. This time from BillG, himself.

2001-06-29 Thread David Schwartz
> If the > CD key is used again they just refuse to send the final key. Do you have any evidence to support this statement or is it an assumption? This is almost never the way such schemes are implemented. The policy is to send the final key unless there's clear evidence of abuse (such

Re: The latest Microsoft FUD. This time from BillG, himself.

2001-06-29 Thread Rob Landley
P. Schmiedehausen; > > [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > Subject: Re: The latest Microsoft FUD. This time from BillG, himself. > > > > > Is this accurate? I never knew NT was mach-based. I do not think NT > > > 1-3 were actually ever shipped, first was NT 3.5 right? >

Re: The latest Microsoft FUD. This time from BillG, himself.

2001-06-29 Thread Lew Wolfgang
On Fri, 29 Jun 2001, Pavel Machek wrote: > > The biggest improvement would be that users could remain with a version > > that works for them and NOT be forced to pay more money for the same > > functionality (watch out for the XP license virus... also known as > > a logic bomb). > > What is XP

RE: The latest Microsoft FUD. This time from BillG, himself.

2001-06-29 Thread Android
> >I still have my 3.1 package all boxed up in the basement. I remember >impatiently waiting for its arrival. What a disappointment it turned >out to be. > >Mark To say the least. The big thing in the current Windows OS's these days is FAT 32. NT 3.1 and NT 3.5 won't even acknowledge this

RE: The latest Microsoft FUD. This time from BillG, himself.

2001-06-29 Thread Clayton, Mark
> -Original Message- > From: Paul Fulghum [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] > Sent: Friday, June 29, 2001 4:02 PM > To: Pavel Machek; [EMAIL PROTECTED]; Schilling, Richard; > [EMAIL PROTECTED]; Henning P. Schmiedehausen; > [EMAIL PROTECTED] > Subject: Re: The latest Microsof

Re: The latest Microsoft FUD. This time from BillG, himself.

2001-06-29 Thread Paul Fulghum
> Is this accurate? I never knew NT was mach-based. I do not think NT > 1-3 were actually ever shipped, first was NT 3.5 right? > Pavel NT 3.1 was the 1st to ship. Paul Fulghum [EMAIL PROTECTED] Microgate Corporation www.microgate.com - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line

Re: The latest Microsoft FUD. This time from BillG, himself.

2001-06-29 Thread Pavel Machek
Hi! > > I'm unimpressed with what Microsoft calls an operating system and > > I'm equally unimpressed with what Unix calls an application layer. > > For the last 10 years, Unix has gotten the OS right and the apps wrong > > and Microsoft has gotten the apps right and the OS wrong. Seems like >

Re: The latest Microsoft FUD. This time from BillG, himself.

2001-06-29 Thread Pavel Machek
Hi! > Hmm. This *is* the company that has at least one guy full-time working on > merging their changes back into gcc (with the right Copyright > assignments), and where the guy in question does discuss how to make gcc > work nice with both Apple's application framework and the GPL clone

Re: The latest Microsoft FUD. This time from BillG, himself.

2001-06-29 Thread Pavel Machek
Hi! > I wouldn't be at all suprised if they did. It'd fit in with the history of > NT. (Version numbers really approximate, I don't have my notes with me.) > > NT 1.0: the inherited OS/2 1.x code ported to 32 bit mode, sort of. > > NT 2.0: 1.0 didn't work so let's try porting it to the mach

Re: The latest Microsoft FUD. This time from BillG, himself.

2001-06-29 Thread Pavel Machek
Hi! I wouldn't be at all suprised if they did. It'd fit in with the history of NT. (Version numbers really approximate, I don't have my notes with me.) NT 1.0: the inherited OS/2 1.x code ported to 32 bit mode, sort of. NT 2.0: 1.0 didn't work so let's try porting it to the mach

Re: The latest Microsoft FUD. This time from BillG, himself.

2001-06-29 Thread Pavel Machek
Hi! Hmm. This *is* the company that has at least one guy full-time working on merging their changes back into gcc (with the right Copyright assignments), and where the guy in question does discuss how to make gcc work nice with both Apple's application framework and the GPL clone of

Re: The latest Microsoft FUD. This time from BillG, himself.

2001-06-29 Thread Pavel Machek
Hi! I'm unimpressed with what Microsoft calls an operating system and I'm equally unimpressed with what Unix calls an application layer. For the last 10 years, Unix has gotten the OS right and the apps wrong and Microsoft has gotten the apps right and the OS wrong. Seems like there is

Re: The latest Microsoft FUD. This time from BillG, himself.

2001-06-29 Thread Paul Fulghum
Is this accurate? I never knew NT was mach-based. I do not think NT 1-3 were actually ever shipped, first was NT 3.5 right? Pavel NT 3.1 was the 1st to ship. Paul Fulghum [EMAIL PROTECTED] Microgate Corporation www.microgate.com - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line unsubscribe

RE: The latest Microsoft FUD. This time from BillG, himself.

2001-06-29 Thread Clayton, Mark
-Original Message- From: Paul Fulghum [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Friday, June 29, 2001 4:02 PM To: Pavel Machek; [EMAIL PROTECTED]; Schilling, Richard; [EMAIL PROTECTED]; Henning P. Schmiedehausen; [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: The latest Microsoft FUD. This time from BillG

Re: The latest Microsoft FUD. This time from BillG, himself.

2001-06-29 Thread Lew Wolfgang
On Fri, 29 Jun 2001, Pavel Machek wrote: The biggest improvement would be that users could remain with a version that works for them and NOT be forced to pay more money for the same functionality (watch out for the XP license virus... also known as a logic bomb). What is XP license

RE: The latest Microsoft FUD. This time from BillG, himself.

2001-06-29 Thread Android
I still have my 3.1 package all boxed up in the basement. I remember impatiently waiting for its arrival. What a disappointment it turned out to be. Mark To say the least. The big thing in the current Windows OS's these days is FAT 32. NT 3.1 and NT 3.5 won't even acknowledge this file

Re: The latest Microsoft FUD. This time from BillG, himself.

2001-06-29 Thread Rob Landley
] Subject: Re: The latest Microsoft FUD. This time from BillG, himself. Is this accurate? I never knew NT was mach-based. I do not think NT 1-3 were actually ever shipped, first was NT 3.5 right? Pavel NT 3.1 was the 1st to ship. I still have my 3.1 package all boxed up in the basement

RE: The latest Microsoft FUD. This time from BillG, himself.

2001-06-29 Thread David Schwartz
If the CD key is used again they just refuse to send the final key. Do you have any evidence to support this statement or is it an assumption? This is almost never the way such schemes are implemented. The policy is to send the final key unless there's clear evidence of abuse (such as

RE: The latest Microsoft FUD. This time from BillG, himself.

2001-06-29 Thread Lew Wolfgang
On Fri, 29 Jun 2001, David Schwartz wrote: If the CD key is used again they just refuse to send the final key. Do you have any evidence to support this statement or is it an assumption? This is almost never the way such schemes are implemented. The policy is to send the final key unless

RE: The latest Microsoft FUD. This time from BillG, himself.

2001-06-29 Thread David Schwartz
Lew Wolfgang wrote: It is something that I read somewhere. If memory serves, Microsoft will allow two installs on the same CD-key. Note that this is different from the old MS key manager, all you had to do there was enter the CD-key. There were no real-time checks on how many times it

Re: The latest Microsoft FUD. This time from BillG, himself.

2001-06-26 Thread john slee
On Mon, Jun 25, 2001 at 08:05:41PM +0200, Andreas Bombe wrote: > On Thu, Jun 21, 2001 at 02:21:18PM -0400, Rob Landley wrote: > > Name one thing Microsoft actually invented. Other than Microsoft Bob. > > were listed and where they bought or stole it from. The only things > that were really

Re: The latest Microsoft FUD. This time from BillG, himself.

2001-06-26 Thread john slee
On Mon, Jun 25, 2001 at 08:05:41PM +0200, Andreas Bombe wrote: On Thu, Jun 21, 2001 at 02:21:18PM -0400, Rob Landley wrote: Name one thing Microsoft actually invented. Other than Microsoft Bob. were listed and where they bought or stole it from. The only things that were really

Re: The latest Microsoft FUD. This time from BillG, himself.

2001-06-25 Thread Andreas Bombe
On Thu, Jun 21, 2001 at 02:21:18PM -0400, Rob Landley wrote: > Name one thing Microsoft actually invented. Other than Microsoft Bob. I remember there being a web page where all of Microsoft's "innovations" were listed and where they bought or stole it from. The only things that were really

Re: The latest Microsoft FUD. This time from BillG, himself.

2001-06-25 Thread Andreas Bombe
On Thu, Jun 21, 2001 at 02:21:18PM -0400, Rob Landley wrote: Name one thing Microsoft actually invented. Other than Microsoft Bob. I remember there being a web page where all of Microsoft's innovations were listed and where they bought or stole it from. The only things that were really

Re: The latest Microsoft FUD. This time from BillG, himself.

2001-06-23 Thread watermodem
Alan Cox wrote: > > > > Do they include the source? There's a CD of source that you can buy > > > for $20 but gcc isn't listed > > > > I'm not sure if they are allowed to do that. See clause 1 (c): > > > > http://msdn.microsoft.com/msdn-files/027/001/516/eula_mit.htm > Minor note: 1) The

Re: The latest Microsoft FUD. This time from BillG, himself.

2001-06-23 Thread watermodem
Alan Cox wrote: Do they include the source? There's a CD of source that you can buy for $20 but gcc isn't listed I'm not sure if they are allowed to do that. See clause 1 (c): http://msdn.microsoft.com/msdn-files/027/001/516/eula_mit.htm Minor note: 1) The above link is

Re: The latest Microsoft FUD. This time from BillG, himself.

2001-06-22 Thread Kai Henningsen
[EMAIL PROTECTED] (Rob Landley) wrote on 22.06.01 in <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>: > On Thursday 21 June 2001 18:49, Alan Cox wrote: > > > > Except that Apple keeps the old code open. Probably because > > > they'll gain nothing from it, and at best, they can appeal to > > > the techies. > > > > A

Re: The latest Microsoft FUD. This time from BillG, himself.

2001-06-22 Thread Rob Landley
On Thursday 21 June 2001 18:49, Alan Cox wrote: > > Except that Apple keeps the old code open. Probably because > > they'll gain nothing from it, and at best, they can appeal to > > the techies. > > A company that seems to write 'you shall not work on open source projects > in your spare time'

RE: The latest Microsoft FUD. This time from BillG, himself.

2001-06-22 Thread Holzrichter, Bruce
>Did I mention I'm writing a book on all this? (The history of linux and the >computer industry, going back to World War II...) This makes me the only >person I know who's excited about finding ~50 issues of "Compute" and >"Compute's gazette" from the mid 80's at a garage sale. An the

RE: The latest Microsoft FUD. This time from BillG, himself.

2001-06-22 Thread Holzrichter, Bruce
Did I mention I'm writing a book on all this? (The history of linux and the computer industry, going back to World War II...) This makes me the only person I know who's excited about finding ~50 issues of Compute and Compute's gazette from the mid 80's at a garage sale. An the university

Re: The latest Microsoft FUD. This time from BillG, himself.

2001-06-22 Thread Rob Landley
On Thursday 21 June 2001 18:49, Alan Cox wrote: Except that Apple keeps the old code open. Probably because they'll gain nothing from it, and at best, they can appeal to the techies. A company that seems to write 'you shall not work on open source projects in your spare time' into its

Re: The latest Microsoft FUD. This time from BillG, himself.

2001-06-22 Thread Kai Henningsen
[EMAIL PROTECTED] (Rob Landley) wrote on 22.06.01 in [EMAIL PROTECTED]: On Thursday 21 June 2001 18:49, Alan Cox wrote: Except that Apple keeps the old code open. Probably because they'll gain nothing from it, and at best, they can appeal to the techies. A company that seems to

Re: The latest Microsoft FUD. This time from BillG, himself.

2001-06-21 Thread Rob Landley
On Thursday 21 June 2001 17:49, Schilling, Richard wrote: > > -Original Message- > > From: Rob Landley > > Sent: Thursday, June 21, 2001 9:25 AM > > [snip] > > > BSD forked to death in the 80's. Everybody from AT to Sun > > to IBM who saw > > money in it spun off their own incompatable,

Re: The latest Microsoft FUD. This time from BillG, himself.

2001-06-21 Thread Alan Cox
> Apple's doing it right now. Hardly.. > Except that Apple keeps the old code open. Probably because > they'll gain nothing from it, and at best, they can appeal to > the techies. A company that seems to write 'you shall not work on open source projects in your spare time' into its employment

Re: The latest Microsoft FUD. This time from BillG, himself.

2001-06-21 Thread Rob Landley
On Thursday 21 June 2001 04:50, Henning P. Schmiedehausen wrote: > Rob Landley <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: > >Ooh, do I get to say "I told you so"? (LinuxToday buried my submission > > way back under a blurb about caldera, but still...) > > And the quote of "stealing the TCP stack from BSD" is

Re: The latest Microsoft FUD. This time from BillG, himself.

2001-06-21 Thread Rob Landley
On Thursday 21 June 2001 04:37, Henning P. Schmiedehausen wrote: > > Devils' advocate position: If Linux would not be under GPL but under > BSD license, M$ may have already done so. But consider them porting > one of their monster applications and release it just to find out that > they've linked

Re: The latest Microsoft FUD. This time from BillG, himself.

2001-06-21 Thread Miles Lane
On 21 Jun 2001 15:48:11 +0200, Daniel Phillips wrote: > On Thursday 21 June 2001 10:46, Henning P. Schmiedehausen wrote: > > My last LinuxExpo talk was also made with PP, > > This makes about as much sense as going to a cocktail party with nose glasses > on. One of the mantras that get

Re: The latest Microsoft FUD. This time from BillG, himself.

2001-06-21 Thread chuckw
> > You can scream all you want that "it isn't free software" but the fact > > of the matter is that you all scream that and then go do your slides for > > your Linux talks in PowerPoint. > > I think this is an unfair generalization. Not really. In Linus's book he describes that his

Re: The latest Microsoft FUD. This time from BillG, himself.

2001-06-21 Thread Alan Cox
> > Do they include the source? There's a CD of source that you can buy > > for $20 but gcc isn't listed > > I'm not sure if they are allowed to do that. See clause 1 (c): > > http://msdn.microsoft.com/msdn-files/027/001/516/eula_mit.htm Slight oops on their part, but then that license is

Re: The latest Microsoft FUD. This time from BillG, himself.

2001-06-21 Thread Daniel Phillips
On Thursday 21 June 2001 10:46, Henning P. Schmiedehausen wrote: > My last LinuxExpo talk was also made with PP, This makes about as much sense as going to a cocktail party with nose glasses on. -- Daniel - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe linux-kernel" in the body of

Re: The latest Microsoft FUD. This time from BillG, himself.

2001-06-21 Thread Helge Hafting
Larry McVoy wrote: > You can scream all you want that "it isn't free software" but the fact > of the matter is that you all scream that and then go do your slides for > your Linux talks in PowerPoint. Never used powerpoint. If I need slides I use a (linux-based) word processor and a bigger

Re: The latest Microsoft FUD. This time from BillG, himself.

2001-06-21 Thread Rik van Riel
On Thu, 21 Jun 2001, Paul Flinders wrote: > Alan Cox wrote: > > > > http://www.zdnet.com/zdnn/stories/news/0,4586,5092935,00.html > > > > > Of course the URL that goes with that is : > > http://www.microsoft.com/windows2000/interix/features.asp > > > > Yes., Microsoft ship GNU C (quite

Re: The latest Microsoft FUD. This time from BillG, himself.

2001-06-21 Thread Jesse Pollard
> > On Wed, Jun 20, 2001 at 11:09:10PM +0100, Alan Cox wrote: > > > http://www.zdnet.com/zdnn/stories/news/0,4586,5092935,00.html > > > > > Of course the URL that goes with that is : > > http://www.microsoft.com/windows2000/interix/features.asp > > > > Yes., Microsoft ship GNU C (quite

Re: The latest Microsoft FUD. This time from BillG, himself.

2001-06-21 Thread Paul Flinders
Alan Cox wrote: > > http://www.zdnet.com/zdnn/stories/news/0,4586,5092935,00.html > > > Of course the URL that goes with that is : > http://www.microsoft.com/windows2000/interix/features.asp > > Yes., Microsoft ship GNU C (quite legally) as part of their offerings... Do they include the

Re: The latest Microsoft FUD. This time from BillG, himself.

2001-06-21 Thread Daniel Stone
On Wed, Jun 20, 2001 at 05:53:44PM -0500, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: > Not I. The slides for my last meeting were done as TIFF files and I used xv to > display them. Plus, the most recent documentation I wrote for one of our > mainframe applications was done with vi and LaTeX. "What, in addition

Re: The latest Microsoft FUD. This time from BillG, himself.

2001-06-21 Thread Daniel Stone
On Wed, Jun 20, 2001 at 05:53:44PM -0500, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Not I. The slides for my last meeting were done as TIFF files and I used xv to display them. Plus, the most recent documentation I wrote for one of our mainframe applications was done with vi and LaTeX. What, in addition to

Re: The latest Microsoft FUD. This time from BillG, himself.

2001-06-21 Thread Paul Flinders
Alan Cox wrote: http://www.zdnet.com/zdnn/stories/news/0,4586,5092935,00.html Of course the URL that goes with that is : http://www.microsoft.com/windows2000/interix/features.asp Yes., Microsoft ship GNU C (quite legally) as part of their offerings... Do they include the source?

Re: The latest Microsoft FUD. This time from BillG, himself.

2001-06-21 Thread Rik van Riel
On Thu, 21 Jun 2001, Paul Flinders wrote: Alan Cox wrote: http://www.zdnet.com/zdnn/stories/news/0,4586,5092935,00.html Of course the URL that goes with that is : http://www.microsoft.com/windows2000/interix/features.asp Yes., Microsoft ship GNU C (quite legally) as part

Re: The latest Microsoft FUD. This time from BillG, himself.

2001-06-21 Thread Jesse Pollard
On Wed, Jun 20, 2001 at 11:09:10PM +0100, Alan Cox wrote: http://www.zdnet.com/zdnn/stories/news/0,4586,5092935,00.html Of course the URL that goes with that is : http://www.microsoft.com/windows2000/interix/features.asp Yes., Microsoft ship GNU C (quite legally) as part

Re: The latest Microsoft FUD. This time from BillG, himself.

2001-06-21 Thread Helge Hafting
Larry McVoy wrote: You can scream all you want that it isn't free software but the fact of the matter is that you all scream that and then go do your slides for your Linux talks in PowerPoint. Never used powerpoint. If I need slides I use a (linux-based) word processor and a bigger font

Re: The latest Microsoft FUD. This time from BillG, himself.

2001-06-21 Thread Daniel Phillips
On Thursday 21 June 2001 10:46, Henning P. Schmiedehausen wrote: My last LinuxExpo talk was also made with PP, This makes about as much sense as going to a cocktail party with nose glasses on. -- Daniel - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line unsubscribe linux-kernel in the body of a

Re: The latest Microsoft FUD. This time from BillG, himself.

2001-06-21 Thread chuckw
You can scream all you want that it isn't free software but the fact of the matter is that you all scream that and then go do your slides for your Linux talks in PowerPoint. I think this is an unfair generalization. Not really. In Linus's book he describes that his presentations used

Re: The latest Microsoft FUD. This time from BillG, himself.

2001-06-21 Thread Miles Lane
On 21 Jun 2001 15:48:11 +0200, Daniel Phillips wrote: On Thursday 21 June 2001 10:46, Henning P. Schmiedehausen wrote: My last LinuxExpo talk was also made with PP, This makes about as much sense as going to a cocktail party with nose glasses on. One of the mantras that get hammered into

Re: The latest Microsoft FUD. This time from BillG, himself.

2001-06-21 Thread Rob Landley
On Thursday 21 June 2001 04:37, Henning P. Schmiedehausen wrote: Devils' advocate position: If Linux would not be under GPL but under BSD license, M$ may have already done so. But consider them porting one of their monster applications and release it just to find out that they've linked to

Re: The latest Microsoft FUD. This time from BillG, himself.

2001-06-21 Thread Rob Landley
On Thursday 21 June 2001 04:50, Henning P. Schmiedehausen wrote: Rob Landley [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Ooh, do I get to say I told you so? (LinuxToday buried my submission way back under a blurb about caldera, but still...) And the quote of stealing the TCP stack from BSD is still wrong.

Re: The latest Microsoft FUD. This time from BillG, himself.

2001-06-21 Thread Rob Landley
On Thursday 21 June 2001 17:49, Schilling, Richard wrote: -Original Message- From: Rob Landley Sent: Thursday, June 21, 2001 9:25 AM [snip] BSD forked to death in the 80's. Everybody from ATT to Sun to IBM who saw money in it spun off their own incompatable, proprietary

Re: The latest Microsoft FUD. This time from BillG, himself.

2001-06-21 Thread Alan Cox
Do they include the source? There's a CD of source that you can buy for $20 but gcc isn't listed I'm not sure if they are allowed to do that. See clause 1 (c): http://msdn.microsoft.com/msdn-files/027/001/516/eula_mit.htm Slight oops on their part, but then that license is fairly new.

Re: The latest Microsoft FUD. This time from BillG, himself.

2001-06-21 Thread Alan Cox
Apple's doing it right now. Hardly.. Except that Apple keeps the old code open. Probably because they'll gain nothing from it, and at best, they can appeal to the techies. A company that seems to write 'you shall not work on open source projects in your spare time' into its employment

Re: The latest Microsoft FUD. This time from BillG, himself.

2001-06-20 Thread Rob Landley
On Wednesday 20 June 2001 18:31, Daniel Phillips wrote: > On Wednesday 20 June 2001 23:33, Rik van Riel wrote: > > On 20 Jun 2001, Miles Lane wrote: > > > http://www.zdnet.com/zdnn/stories/news/0,4586,5092935,00.html > > > > Yes, he sure knows how to bring Linux to the attention > > of people ;)

Re: The latest Microsoft FUD. This time from BillG, himself.

2001-06-20 Thread Michael Bacarella
On Wed, Jun 20, 2001 at 03:33:45PM -0700, Larry McVoy wrote: > You can scream all you want that "it isn't free software" but the fact > of the matter is that you all scream that and then go do your slides for > your Linux talks in PowerPoint. I think this is an unfair generalization. I'm not

Re: The latest Microsoft FUD. This time from BillG, himself.

2001-06-20 Thread Daniel Phillips
On Thursday 21 June 2001 00:33, Larry McVoy wrote: > You can scream all you want that "it isn't free software" but the fact > of the matter is that you all scream that and then go do your slides for > your Linux talks in PowerPoint. Bad example Larry, most of us do our talks with MagicPoint.

Re: The latest Microsoft FUD. This time from BillG, himself.

2001-06-20 Thread Richard Gooch
Larry McVoy writes: > On Wed, Jun 20, 2001 at 11:09:10PM +0100, Alan Cox wrote: > > > http://www.zdnet.com/zdnn/stories/news/0,4586,5092935,00.html > > > > > Of course the URL that goes with that is : > > http://www.microsoft.com/windows2000/interix/features.asp > > > > Yes., Microsoft

Re: The latest Microsoft FUD. This time from BillG, himself.

2001-06-20 Thread William T Wilson
On Wed, 20 Jun 2001, Larry McVoy wrote: > For the last 10 years, Unix has gotten the OS right and the apps wrong > and Microsoft has gotten the apps right and the OS wrong. Seems like > there is potential for a win-win. I've been hoping for this ever since the rumors of "Microsoft Linux"

Re: The latest Microsoft FUD. This time from BillG, himself.

2001-06-20 Thread Khalid Aziz
Larry McVoy wrote: > > You can scream all you want that "it isn't free software" but the fact > of the matter is that you all scream that and then go do your slides for > your Linux talks in PowerPoint. At the Linux SuperClusters 2000 Conference, MadDog and I were the the only ones with slides

Re: The latest Microsoft FUD. This time from BillG, himself.

2001-06-20 Thread Jonathan Morton
>You can scream all you want that "it isn't free software" but the fact >of the matter is that you all scream that and then go do your slides for >your Linux talks in PowerPoint. Or AppleWorks (Mac), in my case. Or, if I wanted to be flashy, I'd make the slides up in CorelXARA (which

Re: The latest Microsoft FUD. This time from BillG, himself.

2001-06-20 Thread Wayne . Brown
On 06/20/2001 at 05:33:45 PM Larry McVoy <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: >You can scream all you want that "it isn't free software" but the fact >of the matter is that you all scream that and then go do your slides for >your Linux talks in PowerPoint. Not I. The slides for my last meeting were

Re: The latest Microsoft FUD. This time from BillG, himself.

2001-06-20 Thread Alan Cox
> What would be wrong with Microsoft/Linux? It would be: > > a) the Linux kernel > b) the Microsoft API ported to X > c) Microsoft apps > d) Linux apps Providing they follow the standards, the GPL and work with the community I certainly have no problems with it. Its not really

Re: The latest Microsoft FUD. This time from BillG, himself.

2001-06-20 Thread Larry McVoy
On Wed, Jun 20, 2001 at 11:09:10PM +0100, Alan Cox wrote: > > http://www.zdnet.com/zdnn/stories/news/0,4586,5092935,00.html > > > Of course the URL that goes with that is : > http://www.microsoft.com/windows2000/interix/features.asp > > Yes., Microsoft ship GNU C (quite legally) as part

Re: The latest Microsoft FUD. This time from BillG, himself.

2001-06-20 Thread Daniel Phillips
On Wednesday 20 June 2001 23:33, Rik van Riel wrote: > On 20 Jun 2001, Miles Lane wrote: > > http://www.zdnet.com/zdnn/stories/news/0,4586,5092935,00.html > > Yes, he sure knows how to bring Linux to the attention > of people ;) Not to mention the GPL, which I can guarantee you, before today my

Re: The latest Microsoft FUD. This time from BillG, himself.

2001-06-20 Thread Alan Olsen
On Wed, 20 Jun 2001, Alan Cox wrote: > > http://www.zdnet.com/zdnn/stories/news/0,4586,5092935,00.html > > > Of course the URL that goes with that is : > http://www.microsoft.com/windows2000/interix/features.asp > > Yes., Microsoft ship GNU C (quite legally) as part of their

Re: The latest Microsoft FUD. This time from BillG, himself.

2001-06-20 Thread Alan Cox
> http://www.zdnet.com/zdnn/stories/news/0,4586,5092935,00.html > Of course the URL that goes with that is : http://www.microsoft.com/windows2000/interix/features.asp Yes., Microsoft ship GNU C (quite legally) as part of their offerings... Alan - To unsubscribe from this list: send

Re: The latest Microsoft FUD. This time from BillG, himself.

2001-06-20 Thread Rik van Riel
On 20 Jun 2001, Miles Lane wrote: > http://www.zdnet.com/zdnn/stories/news/0,4586,5092935,00.html Yes, he sure knows how to bring Linux to the attention of people ;) Rik -- Executive summary of a recent Microsoft press release: "we are concerned about the GNU General Public License (GPL)"

The latest Microsoft FUD. This time from BillG, himself.

2001-06-20 Thread Miles Lane
http://www.zdnet.com/zdnn/stories/news/0,4586,5092935,00.html - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe linux-kernel" in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] More majordomo info at http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html Please read the FAQ at

The latest Microsoft FUD. This time from BillG, himself.

2001-06-20 Thread Miles Lane
http://www.zdnet.com/zdnn/stories/news/0,4586,5092935,00.html - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line unsubscribe linux-kernel in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] More majordomo info at http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html Please read the FAQ at

Re: The latest Microsoft FUD. This time from BillG, himself.

2001-06-20 Thread Rik van Riel
On 20 Jun 2001, Miles Lane wrote: http://www.zdnet.com/zdnn/stories/news/0,4586,5092935,00.html Yes, he sure knows how to bring Linux to the attention of people ;) Rik -- Executive summary of a recent Microsoft press release: we are concerned about the GNU General Public License (GPL)

Re: The latest Microsoft FUD. This time from BillG, himself.

2001-06-20 Thread Daniel Phillips
On Wednesday 20 June 2001 23:33, Rik van Riel wrote: On 20 Jun 2001, Miles Lane wrote: http://www.zdnet.com/zdnn/stories/news/0,4586,5092935,00.html Yes, he sure knows how to bring Linux to the attention of people ;) Not to mention the GPL, which I can guarantee you, before today my mom

Re: The latest Microsoft FUD. This time from BillG, himself.

2001-06-20 Thread Wayne . Brown
On 06/20/2001 at 05:33:45 PM Larry McVoy [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: You can scream all you want that it isn't free software but the fact of the matter is that you all scream that and then go do your slides for your Linux talks in PowerPoint. Not I. The slides for my last meeting were done as

Re: The latest Microsoft FUD. This time from BillG, himself.

2001-06-20 Thread William T Wilson
On Wed, 20 Jun 2001, Larry McVoy wrote: For the last 10 years, Unix has gotten the OS right and the apps wrong and Microsoft has gotten the apps right and the OS wrong. Seems like there is potential for a win-win. I've been hoping for this ever since the rumors of Microsoft Linux started

Re: The latest Microsoft FUD. This time from BillG, himself.

2001-06-20 Thread Michael Bacarella
On Wed, Jun 20, 2001 at 03:33:45PM -0700, Larry McVoy wrote: You can scream all you want that it isn't free software but the fact of the matter is that you all scream that and then go do your slides for your Linux talks in PowerPoint. I think this is an unfair generalization. I'm not even

Re: The latest Microsoft FUD. This time from BillG, himself.

2001-06-20 Thread Rob Landley
On Wednesday 20 June 2001 18:31, Daniel Phillips wrote: On Wednesday 20 June 2001 23:33, Rik van Riel wrote: On 20 Jun 2001, Miles Lane wrote: http://www.zdnet.com/zdnn/stories/news/0,4586,5092935,00.html Yes, he sure knows how to bring Linux to the attention of people ;) Not to

Re: The latest Microsoft FUD. This time from BillG, himself.

2001-06-20 Thread Alan Olsen
On Wed, 20 Jun 2001, Alan Cox wrote: http://www.zdnet.com/zdnn/stories/news/0,4586,5092935,00.html Of course the URL that goes with that is : http://www.microsoft.com/windows2000/interix/features.asp Yes., Microsoft ship GNU C (quite legally) as part of their offerings... As

Re: The latest Microsoft FUD. This time from BillG, himself.

2001-06-20 Thread Larry McVoy
On Wed, Jun 20, 2001 at 11:09:10PM +0100, Alan Cox wrote: http://www.zdnet.com/zdnn/stories/news/0,4586,5092935,00.html Of course the URL that goes with that is : http://www.microsoft.com/windows2000/interix/features.asp Yes., Microsoft ship GNU C (quite legally) as part of their

Re: The latest Microsoft FUD. This time from BillG, himself.

2001-06-20 Thread Alan Cox
What would be wrong with Microsoft/Linux? It would be: a) the Linux kernel b) the Microsoft API ported to X c) Microsoft apps d) Linux apps Providing they follow the standards, the GPL and work with the community I certainly have no problems with it. Its not really any

Re: The latest Microsoft FUD. This time from BillG, himself.

2001-06-20 Thread Jonathan Morton
You can scream all you want that it isn't free software but the fact of the matter is that you all scream that and then go do your slides for your Linux talks in PowerPoint. Or AppleWorks (Mac), in my case. Or, if I wanted to be flashy, I'd make the slides up in CorelXARA (which originated on

Re: The latest Microsoft FUD. This time from BillG, himself.

2001-06-20 Thread Khalid Aziz
Larry McVoy wrote: You can scream all you want that it isn't free software but the fact of the matter is that you all scream that and then go do your slides for your Linux talks in PowerPoint. At the Linux SuperClusters 2000 Conference, MadDog and I were the the only ones with slides done

Re: The latest Microsoft FUD. This time from BillG, himself.

2001-06-20 Thread Richard Gooch
Larry McVoy writes: On Wed, Jun 20, 2001 at 11:09:10PM +0100, Alan Cox wrote: http://www.zdnet.com/zdnn/stories/news/0,4586,5092935,00.html Of course the URL that goes with that is : http://www.microsoft.com/windows2000/interix/features.asp Yes., Microsoft ship GNU C (quite

Re: The latest Microsoft FUD. This time from BillG, himself.

2001-06-20 Thread Daniel Phillips
On Thursday 21 June 2001 00:33, Larry McVoy wrote: You can scream all you want that it isn't free software but the fact of the matter is that you all scream that and then go do your slides for your Linux talks in PowerPoint. Bad example Larry, most of us do our talks with MagicPoint. I'll

Re: The latest Microsoft FUD. This time from BillG, himself.

2001-06-20 Thread Alan Cox
http://www.zdnet.com/zdnn/stories/news/0,4586,5092935,00.html Of course the URL that goes with that is : http://www.microsoft.com/windows2000/interix/features.asp Yes., Microsoft ship GNU C (quite legally) as part of their offerings... Alan - To unsubscribe from this list: send the

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