Re: [uf-discuss] Comments from IBM/Lotus rep about Microformats

The biggest problem is when two (lowercase) microformats get developed by authors having no knowledge of the other, and then each microformats gets adopted by different constituents. I'm not quite sure what you mean here. Is there a difference between lowercase microformats and uppercase microf

RE: [uf-discuss] Comments from IBM/Lotus rep about Microformats

> Forgive me if I have missed something, but could a parser not > understand multiple formats if the HTML used was also > meaningful? For example a blocklevel element (say a ) > could contain some content that was marked up with one > microformat, and another blocklevel element could contain

Re: how-to-play, community, tone (was Re: [uf-discuss] New wiki page summarily deleted)

On 12/9/06, Lucas Gonze <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: On 12/9/06, Andy Mabbett <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > In message <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, Tantek Çelik > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes > >I think in general we can self-regulate, but I am now open to removing > >people who are consistently abusive from

Re: how-to-play, community, tone (was Re: [uf-discuss] New wiki page summarily deleted)

On 9 Dec 2006, at 23:35, Lucas Gonze wrote: On 12/9/06, Andy Mabbett <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: In message <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, Tantek Çelik <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes >I think in general we can self-regulate, but I am now open to removing >people who are consistently abusive from the list i

Re: how-to-play, community, tone (was Re: [uf-discuss] New wiki page summarily deleted)

On 12/9/06, Andy Mabbett <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: In message <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, Tantek Çelik <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes >I think in general we can self-regulate, but I am now open to removing >people who are consistently abusive from the list if necessary. Are you threatening me? Is that how

false claim regarding relevance of topics on this list (was: [admin] Declaring end of thread (was Re: [uf-discuss] Comments from IBM/Lotus rep about Microformats))

In message <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, Tantek Çelik <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes >1. Parsing is OFF-TOPIC for microformats-discuss. Furthermore, your assertion is not supported by: A mailing list for general discussion of microformats nor:

admins, prefix exceptions (was Re: [admin] Declaring end of thread (was Re: [uf-discuss] Comments from IBM/Lotus rep about Microformats))

In message <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, Tantek Çelik <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes >>> I am ending this thread of >50 messages now >> >> That's interesting - with what authority do you "declare end of thread". >> Isn't this supposed to be a community, and isn't that or the community >> to do? >> >> If there

admins, prefix exceptions (was Re: [admin] Declaring end of thread (was Re: [uf-discuss] Comments from IBM/Lotus rep about Microformats))

On 12/9/06 12:11 PM, "Andy Mabbett" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > In message <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, Tantek Çelik > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes > >> I am ending this thread of >50 messages now > > That's interesting - with what authority do you "declare end of thread". > Isn't this supposed to be a c

Re: how-to-play, community, tone (was Re: [uf-discuss] New wiki page summarily deleted)

In message <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, Tantek Çelik <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes >On 12/9/06 11:04 AM, "Andy Mabbett" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > >> >> I spent some time today, creating a 'wiki' page about unAPI, documenting >> the microformat proposed there , > >To be clear, it

[admin] Declaring end of thread (was Re: [uf-discuss] Comments from IBM/Lotus rep about Microformats)

In message <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, Tantek Çelik <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes >I am ending this thread of >50 messages now That's interesting - with what authority do you "declare end of thread". Isn't this supposed to be a community, and isn't that or the community to do? If there is an autocracy (or

Re: [uf-discuss] Unambiguous class names

On 12/9/06, Tantek Çelik <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: On 12/9/06 8:44 AM, "Brian Suda" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > --- i thought there was some substantical documentation - maybe it is > not under the topic/name i thought it was/should be. > This page goes into it in some detail: http://microfo

Re: [uf-discuss] Unambiguous class names

On 12/9/06 11:57 AM, "David Janes" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > On 12/9/06, Tantek Çelik <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: >> On 12/9/06 8:44 AM, "Brian Suda" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: >>> --- i thought there was some substantical documentation - maybe it is >>> not under the topic/name i thought it was

Re: [uf-discuss] Unambiguous class names

On 12/9/06 8:44 AM, "Brian Suda" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > On 12/9/06, David Janes <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > >> Second question :-): but this isn't explicitly documented anywhere, correct? > > --- i thought there was some substantical documentation - maybe it is > not under the topic/name

how-to-play, community, tone (was Re: [uf-discuss] New wiki page summarily deleted)

On 12/9/06 11:04 AM, "Andy Mabbett" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > I spent some time today, creating a 'wiki' page about unAPI, documenting > the microformat proposed there , To be clear, it is not a microformat. It is not based on real world publishing examples, it do

[admin] Declaring end of thread (was Re: [uf-discuss] Comments from IBM/Lotus rep about Microformats)

On 12/9/06 9:40 AM, "Scott Reynen" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > On Dec 9, 2006, at 10:45 AM, Elias Torres wrote: > >> However, more importantly, I need to find an >> important enough instance of the so-called problem that needs us to >> resolve the "general microformat(s)" case instead of hoping

[uf-discuss] New wiki page summarily deleted

I spent some time today, creating a 'wiki' page about unAPI, documenting the microformat proposed there , in a neutral way - not to support it, but to enable others to see and discuss it and, if appropriate, refute or reject the proposal. I have not yet had a response to

Re: [uf-discuss] Unambiguous class names

In message <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, Brian Suda <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes >On 12/9/06, David Janes <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: >> I was just looking at a discussion about "citation" and came across >> this example. > >--- do you have a URL where you found this example? It comes from this mailing list

Re: [uf-discuss] Comments from IBM/Lotus rep about Microformats

On Dec 9, 2006, at 10:45 AM, Elias Torres wrote: However, more importantly, I need to find an important enough instance of the so-called problem that needs us to resolve the "general microformat(s)" case instead of hoping that if we build it, they will come. Exactly. That's my primary concern

Re: Re: Re: Re: [uf-discuss] Comments from IBM/Lotus rep about Microformats

Thanks Elias for weighing in, i was getting abit worried that people might have been "putting words in your mouth", it is glad to know you are on the list to clear-up any potential confusions. -brian On 12/9/06, Elias Torres <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: On 12/9/06, David Janes <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>

Re: Re: Re: [uf-discuss] Comments from IBM/Lotus rep about Microformats

On 12/9/06, David Janes <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: On 12/9/06, Brian Suda <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: [snip] We're not talking about the same thing but I think the case you're making here is pretty strong. The issue that I've been trying to solve in my mind (and I'm sure we're all on the same

Re: Re: Re: Re: [uf-discuss] Unambiguous class names

On 12/9/06, David Janes <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: Second question :-): but this isn't explicitly documented anywhere, correct? --- i thought there was some substantical documentation - maybe it is not under the topic/name i thought it was/should be. The best thing i found was on the Main_pag

Re: [uf-discuss] Comments from IBM/Lotus rep about Microformats

In message <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, David Janes <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes >> >- never look for attributes inside BLOCKQUOTE or Q >> >> Why not? > >Because their definitions in the HTML spec [1] say that these are for >pulling in data from elsewhere. From this one concludes that it's >likely that this

[uf-discuss] Nested Microformats

On 12/9/06, David Janes <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: The issue that I've been trying to solve in my mind (and I'm sure we're all on the same page here) is given an attribute A nested in micrformats M, N and P (from inner to outer), is "what does A belong to". If the answer is "all of them" then the

Re: Re: Re: [uf-discuss] Unambiguous class names

Cool. Second question :-): but this isn't explicitly documented anywhere, correct? Regards, etc... David On 12/9/06, Brian Suda <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: On 12/9/06, David Janes <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Is this a true or false statement? class names should have an > unambiguous meaning ac

Re: Re: Re: [uf-discuss] Comments from IBM/Lotus rep about Microformats

On 12/9/06, Brian Suda <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: i still think/feel that excluding embeded microformats inside other microformats is a bad idea. The whole point of NOT having namespaces is that the property values that we put into class/rel/rev have the same consistent meaning across all format

Re: [uf-discuss] Comments from IBM/Lotus rep about Microformats

>- never look for attributes inside BLOCKQUOTE or Q Why not? Because their definitions in the HTML spec [1] say that these are for pulling in data from elsewhere. From this one concludes that it's likely that this data is not necessarily going to be marked up in a way consistent with the curre

Re: Re: Re: [uf-discuss] Unambiguous class names

On 12/9/06, David Janes <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: Is this a true or false statement? class names should have an unambiguous meaning across all microformats. true. -- brian suda http://suda.co.uk ___ microformats-discuss mailing list microformats-dis

Re: Re: Re: [uf-discuss] Comments from IBM/Lotus rep about Microformats

On 12/9/06, David Janes <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: How would someone marking up a hCalendar with a hCard make the location empty under those rules? The hCard is part of the hCalendar, both as part of the spec [1] and implicitly because it's there. You wrote earlier: An "outer" microformat shoul

Re: Re: [uf-discuss] Unambiguous class names

On 12/9/06, Brian Suda <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: On 12/9/06, David Janes <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > 3. Is this documented somewhere or is it something that everyone is > > > supposed to know (or am I just wrong)? > > > > --- is what documented? the fact that property values are the same >

Re: [uf-discuss] [implied hCards] Examples and wiki pages

In message <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, Brian Suda <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes >For example: > >http://www.example.com/";>John Doe > >quickly becomes: > > >http://www.example.com/";> >John > >Doe > > > > >The first example of an 'a' element would STILL require some sort of >'block-level' element for the pa

Re: Re: [uf-discuss] Unambiguous class names

On 12/9/06, David Janes <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > 3. Is this documented somewhere or is it something that everyone is > > supposed to know (or am I just wrong)? > > --- is what documented? the fact that property values are the same > across all microformats? or the values for the citation fo

Re: Re: [uf-discuss] Comments from IBM/Lotus rep about Microformats

On 12/9/06, Brian Suda <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: On 12/9/06, David Janes <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > My recent thinking has been that the following rules may work: > > An "outer" microformat should > - never look for attributes inside nested microformats (particularly > hCard, hCalendar, hAtom

Re: [uf-discuss] [implied hCards] Examples and wiki pages

On 12/8/06, Ryan Cannon <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: Greetings, In lieu of working on my finals I decided to start a few wiki pages in reponse to Ryan King's call for research: --- have had a look through some of the pages, i don't assume you are finished, but i disagree with several of the poin

Re: [uf-discuss] Unambiguous class names

On 12/9/06, Brian Suda <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: On 12/9/06, David Janes <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: --- no, this is probably a very old example. > 2. Are not class names supposed to have a single meaning across _all_ > microformats? I remember this from hAtom discussions, but ... --- yes, that

Re: Re: [uf-discuss] Comments from IBM/Lotus rep about Microformats

On 12/9/06, David Janes <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: My recent thinking has been that the following rules may work: An "outer" microformat should - never look for attributes inside nested microformats (particularly hCard, hCalendar, hAtom and xFolk) --- i would also disagree with this because t

Re: [uf-discuss] Unambiguous class names

On 12/9/06, David Janes <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: I was just looking at a discussion about "citation" and came across this example. --- do you have a URL where you found this example? Questions: 1. Is citation really considering using "title" for the title of a book? --- no, this is proba

Re: [uf-discuss] Unambiguous class names

In message <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, David Janes <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes >2. Are not class names supposed to have a single meaning across _all_ >microformats? Even if they are, care still needs to be taken, where the class name is likely to occur, in other contexts, such as "title", "var", "bin" "c

Re: [uf-discuss] Comments from IBM/Lotus rep about Microformats

In message <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, David Janes <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes >My recent thinking has been that the following rules may work: > >An "outer" microformat should >- never look for attributes inside nested microformats (particularly >hCard, hCalendar, hAtom and xFolk) You immediately hit pro

Re: [uf-discuss] [admin] mailing list policies reminder

>How about URLs should be placed in footnotes [1]. Because this is >72-character wide text only mailing list, I'm finding often that I >need to reconstruct URLs that are getting split over multiple lines. >This rarely happens when URLs are placed in footnotes. I prefer not to do so, but place ea

Re: [uf-discuss] [admin] mailing list policies reminder

On 10/20/06, Ryan King <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: This is a just a friendly reminder for everyone to read our mailing list policies - http://microformats.org/mailinglists-policies/ . The reason for the reminder is that this list has grown, a lot and many of the policies are meant to help everyone

Re: [uf-discuss] Comments from IBM/Lotus rep about Microformats

The preceeding discussion about which class names apply to which microformatted object ties into the conversation we were having nine months ago (or so) about opacity; much is documented here [1]. My recent thinking has been that the following rules may work: An "outer" microformat should - neve

[uf-discuss] Unambiguous class names

I was just looking at a discussion about "citation" and came across this example. Running an ISP for Idiots Internet Expert Questions: 1. Is citation really considering using "title" for the t

Re: [uf-discuss] Comments from IBM/Lotus rep about Microformats

In message <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, Tim Hodson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes >> Several possible solutions are available to us: >> >>1Declare that, if the attribute is inside a microformat (in this >> case hCard), then it always applies to that uF, but not the >> parent uF (in thi

Re: [uf-discuss] [admin] mailing list policies reminder

In message <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, Ryan King <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes >On Dec 8, 2006, at 3:06 PM, Andy Mabbett wrote: >> In message <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, Ryan >> King <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes You've ignored the key part of my post, and responded only to a secondary matter. >> and why were

Re: [uf-discuss] Comments from IBM/Lotus rep about Microformats

On 09/12/06, Andy Mabbett <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: Running an ISP for Idiots Internet Expert [1] There is a danger that "Internet Expert" might be recorded as the title

Re: [uf-discuss] Adapting existing links as tags

In message <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, Andy Mabbett <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes > >I currently have several instances of pages in a sub-directory, such >as: > >http://www.westmidlandbirdclub.com/staffs/tittesworth/index.htm >http://www.westmidlandbirdclub.com/staffs/tittesworth/latest.ht >

Re: [uf-discuss] Comments from IBM/Lotus rep about Microformats

In message <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, Tim Hodson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes >A parser could easily identify child relationships within >the HTML and extrapolate. > >Granted this wouldn't be so easy if two microformats were muddled >together on the same page. AIUI the concerns are about using the same c

Re: [uf-discuss] Comments from IBM/Lotus rep about Microformats

Forgive me if I have missed something, but could a parser not understand multiple formats if the HTML used was also meaningful? For example a blocklevel element (say a ) could contain some content that was marked up with one microformat, and another blocklevel element could contain content marked