Re: Is the export policy selective under valley-free?

2008-09-03 Thread Iljitsch van Beijnum
On 3 sep 2008, at 1:45, Kai Chen wrote: Just want to ask a direct question. Will an AS export all it gets from its customers and itself to its providers? Or even under valley-free, the BGP export policy is also selective? I get the valley-free but not the selective. :-) Iljitsch

Re: Is the export policy selective under valley-free?

2008-09-03 Thread William Waites
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 Le 08-09-03 à 11:08, Iljitsch van Beijnum a écrit : On 3 sep 2008, at 1:45, Kai Chen wrote: Just want to ask a direct question. Will an AS export all it gets from its customers and itself to its providers? Or even under valley-free, the BGP

Re: Is the export policy selective under valley-free?

2008-09-03 Thread Randy Bush
I think that yes, the valley-free property is a necessary but not sufficient criteria for generating the set of in-reality-valid paths on the Internet. i assure you that the actual topology is not valley free. e.g. there are many backup or political hack transit paths [0] between otherwise

Re: Is the export policy selective under valley-free?

2008-09-03 Thread William Waites
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 On 08-09-03 at 11:40, Randy Bush on holiday and should not be reading nanog, let alone responding wrote : i assure you that the actual topology is not valley free. e.g. there are many backup or political hack transit paths

Re: Is the export policy selective under valley-free?

2008-09-03 Thread Iljitsch van Beijnum
On 3 sep 2008, at 11:40, Randy Bush wrote: I think that yes, the valley-free property is a necessary but not sufficient criteria for generating the set of in-reality-valid paths on the Internet. i assure you that the actual topology is not valley free. e.g. there are many backup or

Re: Is the export policy selective under valley-free?

2008-09-03 Thread Kai Chen
On Wed, Sep 3, 2008 at 4:29 AM, William Waites [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 Le 08-09-03 à 11:08, Iljitsch van Beijnum a écrit : On 3 sep 2008, at 1:45, Kai Chen wrote: Just want to ask a direct question. Will an AS export all it gets from its

Re: Is the export policy selective under valley-free?

2008-09-03 Thread Valdis . Kletnieks
On Wed, 03 Sep 2008 10:36:52 +0200, William Waites said: Valley-free is a property of AS mesh models that says that, where edges are classified as peering (p2p) or transit (c2p) that a valid path contains zero or one peering link and that the peering link occurs adjacent to the top of the

Re: Is the export policy selective under valley-free?

2008-09-03 Thread Randy Bush
i assure you that the actual topology is not valley free. e.g. there are many backup or political hack transit paths [0] Sorry to further impinge on your vacation, but was there a footnote there? apologies. one publicly known (because someone used traceroute) example is mentioned in

Re: Is the export policy selective under valley-free?

2008-09-03 Thread Valdis . Kletnieks
On Wed, 03 Sep 2008 19:42:34 +0200, William Waites said: Cases of partial transit, where B might repeat C's routes to peers but not to upstrem providers are not, AFAIK treated in the model. Ahh... that's the part I was missing. Thanks... (All the scenarios I though of were basically different

Re: Is the export policy selective under valley-free?

2008-09-03 Thread Iljitsch van Beijnum
On 3 sep 2008, at 23:08, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Cases of partial transit, where B might repeat C's routes to peers but not to upstrem providers are not, AFAIK treated in the model. Ahh... that's the part I was missing. Thanks... (All the scenarios I though of were basically different

Re: Is the export policy selective under valley-free?

2008-09-02 Thread Paul Wall
Kai, That's correct. A network purchasing transit will advertise its internally-originated prefixes, as well as those it's learning from downstream customers, to its provider. (At least that's the theory. It's not terribly uncommon for transit purchasers to advertise a full table, or for their

Re: Is the export policy selective under valley-free?

2008-09-02 Thread Aaron Glenn
On Tue, Sep 2, 2008 at 4:45 PM, Kai Chen [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Just want to ask a direct question. Will an AS export all it gets from its customers and itself to its providers? Or even under valley-free, the BGP export policy is also selective? that's the idea. but your use of valley-free