On Apr 7, 2005 9:59 AM, Josh Coates <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> >Would Berkeley Data
> >Systems (www.berkeleydata.net) take a hit monetarily if the website
> >wasn't powered by Linux, Apache, Perl, OpenSSL, and PHP?
>
> i don't know what the internet archive or bds has to do with this
> discussi
On Thu, 2005-04-07 at 09:59 -0600, Josh Coates wrote:
> the question was: "to what degree is OSS responsible for the economic
> strength of the US."
>
> my answer? it's not responsible in the slightest.
I don't know if I would go as far as saying "in the slightest". BSD
software in particular ha
ril 07, 2005 10:09 AM
To: Provo Linux Users Group Mailing List
Subject: Re: Slashdot feed...
On Thursday 07 April 2005 09:59, Josh Coates wrote:
> oh, and we don't use perl at bds.
Don't be so sure about that :-p
--
Jayce^
.===.
| This has been a P.L.
On Thursday 07 April 2005 09:59, Josh Coates wrote:
> oh, and we don't use perl at bds.
Don't be so sure about that :-p
--
Jayce^
pgpVLTWJxH22p.pgp
Description: PGP signature
.===.
| This has been a P.L.U.G. mailing. |
| Don't Fear the Penguin. |
| IRC
t, but be my guest.
Josh Coates
www.jcoates.org
-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of
Thad Van Ry
Sent: Thursday, April 07, 2005 9:28 AM
To: Provo Linux Users Group Mailing List
Subject: Re: Slashdot feed...
On Apr 6, 2005 8:35 PM, Josh Coates &l
On Wed, 2005-04-06 at 20:14 -0600, Josh Coates wrote:
> i think there are some parallels to the OSS/proprietary software debate and
> political/economic systems, but i'm not sure you have them matched up
> correctly. you'd have to expand on your reasons to convince me that OSS is
> more like capit
On Apr 6, 2005 8:35 PM, Josh Coates <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> this is what makes the US economy strong, that and a population of 300M
> wealthy (globally relative) producers and consumers doesn't hurt.
The big three can't sell trucks to people who can't afford to buy
them. THAT is what makes th
On Wednesday 06 April 2005 18:35, Charles Curley wrote:
> That cheaper $ does not bode
> well for a strong American economy.
Actually, it bodes extremely well for American manufacturing economy, as long
as they are buying supplies also from American manufacturing companies. Same
reason Japan wo
On Wed, 6 Apr 2005 at 18:11 -0600, Josh Coates wrote:
>
> >Josh, you seem to be a BitKeeper apologist. If you don't like that
> >label, please explain to us why you're not because we want to give you
> >the benefit of the doubt.
>
> i'm not sure what i said to make me seem like a bitkeeper apolo
ur careers and personal economics - but let's try to
stay grounded. ;-)
Josh Coates
www.jcoates.org
-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of
Charles Curley
Sent: Wednesday, April 06, 2005 6:36 PM
To: Provo Linux Users Group Mailing List
Subject: Re: Sla
On Wed, Apr 06, 2005 at 05:01:52PM -0600, Josh Coates wrote:
>
> what i see is "OSDL employee break the law"
Violating a EULA is not breaking the law. Reverse engineering wasn't
breaking the law until DMCA, and probably isn't even in this case
since it doesn't involve the MPAA or RIAA.
> and im
ww.jcoates.org
-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of
Stuart Jansen
Sent: Wednesday, April 06, 2005 6:12 PM
To: Provo Linux Users Group Mailing List
Subject: RE: Slashdot feed...
Josh, you amaze me. Sometimes you're a top posting, non-tri
On Wed, 2005-04-06 at 17:44 -0600, Hans Fugal wrote:
> The take-home lesson here is that a proprietary license for
> a beer-free product can not be trusted like an open source license can.
Exactly. (With, of course, the OSS v. Free Software semantics.)
No matter how much it looks like the owner
On Wed, Apr 06, 2005 at 03:53:53PM -0600, Eric Jensen wrote:
> Stuart Jansen wrote:
>
> I can understand the "repeat victim" part. We have all experienced that
> plenty. But the economy part is a bit of a stretch. America's economy
> is one of, if not the, strongest economy in the world and I
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of
Hans Fugal
Sent: Wednesday, April 06, 2005 5:45 PM
To: plug@plug.org
Subject: Re: Slashdot feed...
Josh, you seem to be a BitKeeper apologist. If you don't like that
label, please explain to us why you're not because we want
Josh, you amaze me. Sometimes you're a top posting, non-trimming
vagabond wandering around unshaven and burping. This time you've
carefully and thoughtfully folded three message into a single response.
Everything looks great--you've shaved recently, your shirt is tucked
in--but as you leave we disc
Stuart Jansen wrote:
I was wearing my "repeat victim of proprietary software
just trying to accomplish something and move the economy forward
productively" glasses.
Way to move your cause forward by tacking on a positive but unproven
clause to your argument. How does avoiding proprietary software
Josh, you seem to be a BitKeeper apologist. If you don't like that
label, please explain to us why you're not because we want to give you
the benefit of the doubt.
"Larry explained that a contracter still under pay from OSDL for an
unrelated project was also actively working on reverse engineering
On Wed, 2005-04-06 at 15:53 -0600, Eric Jensen wrote:
> Stuart Jansen wrote:
> >On Wed, 2005-04-06 at 14:14 -0600, Josh Coates wrote:
> >I was wearing my "repeat victim of proprietary software
> >just trying to accomplish something and move the economy forward
> >productively" glasses.
> >
> I can
Josh Coates wrote:
>i think it's more likely that you mean "US economic strength is due to
>yankee ingenuity, finding a need and filling it, improving on the status
>quo, etc." and that you equate all that with "OSS mindset".
>
>Josh Coates
>www.jcoates.org
>
>
>
That's actually what I was sayin
ot; and that you equate all that with "OSS mindset".
Josh Coates
www.jcoates.org
-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of
Michael L Torrie
Sent: Wednesday, April 06, 2005 4:16 PM
To: Provo Linux Users Group Mailing List
Subject: Re:
On Wed, 2005-04-06 at 15:53 -0600, Eric Jensen wrote:
> I can understand the "repeat victim" part. We have all experienced that
> plenty. But the economy part is a bit of a stretch. America's economy
> is one of, if not the, strongest economy in the world and I'm pretty
> sure it wasn't because
On Apr 6, 2005 3:06 PM, Josh Coates <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> >It's not illegal per se.
>
> AYAL? IANAL.
>
> but i'm pretty sure if you willfully violate an EULA (which typically has
> the "don't reverse engineer this" clause), and/or copy someones intellectual
> property, then you are brea
Stuart Jansen wrote:
>On Wed, 2005-04-06 at 14:14 -0600, Josh Coates wrote:
>
>
>I was wearing my "repeat victim of proprietary software
>just trying to accomplish something and move the economy forward
>productively" glasses.
>
>
>
I can understand the "repeat victim" part. We have all exper
On Wed, 2005-04-06 at 14:14 -0600, Josh Coates wrote:
> >When you use proprietary software, you are selling your future. At least
> >Larry McVoy is being friendly about things.
>
> what i got out of the article was something a little different.
Because you were looking at it while wearing your "A
On Wed, Apr 06, 2005 at 03:01:21PM -0600, Roberto Mello wrote:
> On Wed, Apr 06, 2005 at 02:14:50PM -0600, Josh Coates wrote:
> >
> > what i got out of the article was something a little different.
> >
> > i read "open source zealots ripped off (ie. stole) bitkeeper by illegally
> > reverse engin
rom: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
> Behalf Of Jayce^
> Sent: Wednesday, April 06, 2005 5:14 PM
> To: Provo Linux Users Group Mailing List
> Subject: Re: Slashdot feed...
>
> On Wednesday 06 April 2005 15:04, Steve Dibb wrote:
> > Okay, that makes sense
On Wednesday 06 April 2005 15:04, Steve Dibb wrote:
> Okay, that makes sense then ... and explain why it mentioned the OSDL
> employees in the article, which, at first it seemed like it wouldn't
> matter.
They just came down on them because Employee A works at OSDL, but at night, he
works on a di
moral victory.
Josh Coates
www.jcoates.org
-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of
Gary Thornock
Sent: Wednesday, April 06, 2005 2:47 PM
To: Provo Linux Users Group Mailing List
Subject: RE: Slashdot feed...
> -Original Message-
> From
Gary Thornock wrote:
It's not illegal per se. If it were, BitMover would be suing
(or, at least, they'd have legal standing to sue) OSDL. On the
other hand, it does go against the original agreement between
BitMover and Linus, where they said "we'll provide you with our
product and space on our s
On Wed, 2005-04-06 at 14:47 -0600, Gary Thornock wrote:
> .| This has been a P.L.U.G. mailing. |
> | Don't Fear the Penguin. |
> | IRC: #utah at irc.freenode.net |
> `
How come your footer looks different then this one:
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| This has been a P.L.U.G.
On Wed, Apr 06, 2005 at 02:14:50PM -0600, Josh Coates wrote:
>
> what i got out of the article was something a little different.
>
> i read "open source zealots ripped off (ie. stole) bitkeeper by illegally
> reverse engineering it, which resulted in bitmover killing their free
> version of the p
> -Original Message-
> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
> Behalf Of Steve Dibb
> Sent: Wednesday, April 06, 2005 14:41
> To: Provo Linux Users Group Mailing List
> Subject: Re: Slashdot feed...
>
> Josh Coates wrote:
>> i read "
Josh Coates wrote:
i read "open source zealots ripped off (ie. stole) bitkeeper by illegally
reverse engineering it, which resulted in bitmover killing their free
version of the product."
So, is it really illegal to reverse engineer something even if its a
license agreement (non-signed contract)?
www.jcoates.org
-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of
Stuart Jansen
Sent: Wednesday, April 06, 2005 1:52 PM
To: Provo Linux Users Group Mailing List
Subject: Re: Slashdot feed...
On Wed, 2005-04-06 at 13:34 -0600, Gabriel Gunderson wrote:
> OK, so
On Wed, 2005-04-06 at 12:51 -0700, Stuart Jansen wrote:
> I've already handed out some "I told you so"s on #utah, but I guess
> I'm still good for a few more.
Was there any doubt?
;)
Gabe
.===.
| This has been a P.L.U.G. mailing. |
| Don't Fear the Penguin.
On Wed, 2005-04-06 at 13:34 -0600, Gabriel Gunderson wrote:
> OK, so I know you all read /. and don't need me to point this out. In
> case you didn't see it, this is pretty interesting:
>
> http://kerneltrap.org/node/4966
>
> It will be interesting to see how things work out. I feel both good a
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