Re: validation of complexity metrics as measure for ease of comprehension?

2009-12-11 Thread Rudi Lutz
This may be of interest too for an information theoretic measure of the first kind: http://linkinghub.elsevier.com/retrieve/pii/S1383762101000194 Regards, Rudi 2009/12/11 Israel Herraiz : > Excerpts from Alan Blackwell's message of Thu Dec 10 19:00:29 +0100 2009: >> A) the entropy in

Re: validation of complexity metrics as measure for ease of comprehension?

2009-12-11 Thread Israel Herraiz
Excerpts from Alan Blackwell's message of Thu Dec 10 19:00:29 +0100 2009: > A) the entropy in the program itself (e.g. graph of control structure, > data structure, type structure etc) > > B) the entropy in the programming tools being used (language > syntax, execution model, libraries etc) > >

Re: validation of complexity metrics as measure for ease of comprehension?

2009-12-10 Thread James Howison
On Dec 10, 2009, at 12:50, Israel Herraiz wrote: Excerpts from Alan Blackwell's message of Thu Dec 10 18:28:22 +0100 2009: Absolutely. So the Harrison paper is "An entropy-based measure of software complexity" from IEEE Trans Software Eng, 18(11) 1025-1029. That paper might be a good startin

Re: validation of complexity metrics as measure for ease of comprehension?

2009-12-10 Thread Derek M Jones
Alan, The cost, to the reader, of obtaining the information is also an important issue. That paper might be a good starting point for a discussion of what would be a meaningful information content measure in comparing software source code. If the software was written by French speakers the id

Re: validation of complexity metrics as measure for ease of comprehension?

2009-12-10 Thread Alan Blackwell
Thanks Israel - will read with interest. So that measure might provide a good basis for cognitive comparison in the way that Chris and I were proposing. By the way, we need to keep in mind that there are two sources of entropy that seem to get conflated in discussion of program metrics: A) the

Re: validation of complexity metrics as measure for ease of comprehension?

2009-12-10 Thread Alan Blackwell
c.do...@open.ac.uk said: > the notion of cognitive complexity (whatever that may be). In terms of experimental measures that are derived from an operationalised cognitive theory, one could consider: 1. Memory (reconstruction/recall/recognition) measures 2. Information-finding measures 3. Problem

Re: validation of complexity metrics as measure for ease of comprehension?

2009-12-10 Thread Israel Herraiz
Excerpts from Alan Blackwell's message of Thu Dec 10 18:28:22 +0100 2009: > Absolutely. So the Harrison paper is "An entropy-based measure of > software complexity" from IEEE Trans Software Eng, 18(11) > 1025-1029. > > That paper might be a good starting point for a discussion of > what would be

RE: validation of complexity metrics as measure for ease of comprehension?

2009-12-10 Thread C.Douce
---Original Message- From: Derek M Jones [mailto:de...@knosof.co.uk] Sent: 10 December 2009 17:13 To: Ppig-Discuss-List Subject: Re: validation of complexity metrics as measure for ease of comprehension? Alan, > My own experience, based on recent investigation with a grad > student to compil

Re: validation of complexity metrics as measure for ease of comprehension?

2009-12-10 Thread James Howison
On Dec 10, 2009, at 11:57, Alan Blackwell wrote: My own experience, based on recent investigation with a grad student to compile more evidence for his claims regarding complexity metrics (in this case Harrison's entropy-based measure rather than McCabe) was that the closer we looked at the mea

Re: validation of complexity metrics as measure for ease of comprehension?

2009-12-10 Thread Alan Blackwell
> I think that information content is the way to go. Absolutely. So the Harrison paper is "An entropy-based measure of software complexity" from IEEE Trans Software Eng, 18(11) 1025-1029. That paper might be a good starting point for a discussion of what would be a meaningful information content

Re: validation of complexity metrics as measure for ease of comprehension?

2009-12-10 Thread Derek M Jones
Alan, My own experience, based on recent investigation with a grad student to compile more evidence for his claims regarding complexity metrics (in this case Harrison's entropy-based measure rather than McCabe) was that the closer we looked at the measure I think that information content is th

Re: validation of complexity metrics as measure for ease of comprehension?

2009-12-10 Thread Alan Blackwell
My own experience, based on recent investigation with a grad student to compile more evidence for his claims regarding complexity metrics (in this case Harrison's entropy-based measure rather than McCabe) was that the closer we looked at the measure itself, the more flawed it seemed to be - both o

Re: validation of complexity metrics as measure for ease of comprehension?

2009-12-10 Thread Derek M Jones
James, metric is useful to predict bugs, but I often hear the further interpretation that complexity actually causes more bugs (or inhibits their fixes) because the code is harder to understand. That interpretation seems to need stronger validation than the correlational studies. The probl

validation of complexity metrics as measure for ease of comprehension?

2009-12-10 Thread James Howison
Over on the libresoft mailing list we're having a conversation about interpretation of complexity metrics (e.g. McCabe cyclometic complexity etc). The studies that we know on this metric demonstrate that the metric is useful to predict bugs, but I often hear the further interpretation that