[issue13582] IDLE and pythonw.exe stderr problem

Terry J. Reedy added the comment: Good question. There are two issues when starting IDLE with pythonw.exe, so that sys.__stderr__ and sys.stderr are initially None. 1. None.write is an attribute error that crashes Python. Therefore, don't do that. Instead use print. By default, and when

[issue13582] IDLE and pythonw.exe stderr problem

anthony shaw added the comment: Revisiting this issue as it's still open. The original patch was for 3.3a0, there have been many changes to both IDLE and the Windows build since, including the recent IDLE entry point in the new Windows installer. Steve, Terry, please could you review to

[issue13582] IDLE and pythonw.exe stderr problem

Changes by Terry J. Reedy : -- assignee: -> terry.reedy stage: test needed -> patch review versions: +Python 3.6, Python 3.7 -Python 2.7, Python 3.3, Python 3.4 ___ Python tracker

[issue13582] IDLE and pythonw.exe stderr problem

Terry J. Reedy added the comment: Idle start up seems unnecessarily fragmented into multiple files. idlelib/__main__.py idlelib/idle.py idlelib/idlew.py can all be started from the command line by name with either python or pythonw or run once by import. idlelib/__main__.py can also be

[issue13582] IDLE and pythonw.exe stderr problem

Todd Rovito added the comment: Terry, Bottom line I can't seem to get this patch to do anything for me. Before the patch is applied IDLE seems to be handling warnings and exceptions just fine in PyShell on the Mac. I get no crash and the output matches the normal console. Here is a

[issue13582] IDLE and pythonw.exe stderr problem

Dev Player added the comment: I may be mistaken but I thought, as of not too long ago, that pythonw.exe is no longer needed by current versions. 2.7.5 -- nosy: +devplayer ___ Python tracker rep...@bugs.python.org http://bugs.python.org/issue13582

[issue13582] IDLE and pythonw.exe stderr problem

Terry J. Reedy added the comment: No change. pythonw.exe is still present and in use. -- ___ Python tracker rep...@bugs.python.org http://bugs.python.org/issue13582 ___

[issue13582] IDLE and pythonw.exe stderr problem

Terry J. Reedy added the comment: Todd, do you have a Mac to test this on? This patch treat sending messages to a widget as a backup option. In 18318 I propose we make Idle a true gui app, with all messages other than 'No tkinter' handled by the gui. Console writing, when available, would

[issue13582] IDLE and pythonw.exe stderr problem

Todd Rovito added the comment: Yes I have a Mac and I am glad to help, so I gave it a test run tonight. The first thing I did was apply the patch then I ran idle from the console like so: ./python.exe Lib/idlelib/idle.py For testing I used a simple print command to print to stderr:

[issue13582] IDLE and pythonw.exe stderr problem

Terry J. Reedy added the comment: Print in the user process goes to shell window. You need to stimulate (or just add) print or warn in the idle process, which normally goes to console, or nowhere. It is hard (intentionally, I am sure) to dynamically manipulate idle process code. Roger said

[issue13582] IDLE and pythonw.exe stderr problem

Changes by Gabriel Genellina ggenell...@gmail.com: -- nosy: +ggenellina ___ Python tracker rep...@bugs.python.org http://bugs.python.org/issue13582 ___ ___

[issue13582] IDLE and pythonw.exe stderr problem

Changes by Terry J. Reedy tjre...@udel.edu: -- versions: +Python 3.4 -Python 3.2 ___ Python tracker rep...@bugs.python.org http://bugs.python.org/issue13582 ___ ___

[issue13582] IDLE and pythonw.exe stderr problem

Changes by Andrew Svetlov andrew.svet...@gmail.com: -- nosy: +asvetlov ___ Python tracker rep...@bugs.python.org http://bugs.python.org/issue13582 ___ ___

[issue13582] IDLE and pythonw.exe stderr problem

Changes by Terry J. Reedy tjre...@udel.edu: -- nosy: +terry.reedy ___ Python tracker rep...@bugs.python.org http://bugs.python.org/issue13582 ___ ___ Python-bugs-list

[issue13582] IDLE and pythonw.exe stderr problem

Roger Serwy roger.se...@gmail.com added the comment: I don't have a Mac to test against. Is there anything I need to do to improve the patch? -- ___ Python tracker rep...@bugs.python.org http://bugs.python.org/issue13582

[issue13582] IDLE and pythonw.exe stderr problem

Roger Serwy roger.se...@gmail.com added the comment: Here is a list of open issues that describe IDLE suddenly crashing, which can be traced back to pythonw.exe: #4765, #5707, #6257, #6739, #9404, #9925, #10365, #11437, #12274, #12988, #13052, #13071, #13078, #13153 This patch does not fix

[issue13582] IDLE and pythonw.exe stderr problem

Ned Deily n...@acm.org added the comment: IDLE.app on OS X also has the issue of stderr messages not being presented to users unless you know to look in the system log where they get written. So writing to stderr is not fatal but displaying them in a popup would be an improvement.

[issue13582] IDLE and pythonw.exe stderr problem

Amaury Forgeot d'Arc amaur...@gmail.com added the comment: terminate abruptly? I thought that print(file=None) silently returned, without printing but without an error. A delayed popup to display (otherwise discarded) output is a nice feature, though. -- nosy: +amaury.forgeotdarc

[issue13582] IDLE and pythonw.exe stderr problem

Roger Serwy roger.se...@gmail.com added the comment: You can try triggering bug #8900 quite simply. From a shell or an editor, press Ctrl+N and then Ctrl+O. Open a file and watch IDLE terminate abruptly. Also, see #12274. If you want to play with this problem further, try adding a raise

[issue13582] IDLE and pythonw.exe stderr problem

New submission from Roger Serwy roger.se...@gmail.com: Running IDLE on Windows typically uses pythonw.exe. Unfortunately any error messages written to stderr will cause IDLE to terminate abruptly without an error message. This is due to __stderr__ == None. Attached is a patch against 3.3a0