Re: [Python-Dev] PEP 594: update 1

2019-05-24 Thread Glenn Linderman
On 5/24/2019 9:09 PM, Random832 wrote: On Thu, May 23, 2019, at 15:27, Steve Holden wrote: Besides which, it would be lovely to have a major release that didn't involve any pain at all for the majority of users! Our erstwhile BDFL always eschewed two-digit version identifiers- due to the

Re: [Python-Dev] PEP 594: update 1

2019-05-24 Thread Random832
On Thu, May 23, 2019, at 15:27, Steve Holden wrote: > Besides which, it would be lovely to have a major release that didn't > involve any pain at all for the majority of users! > > Our erstwhile BDFL always eschewed two-digit version identifiers- due > to the possibility for confusion about

Re: [Python-Dev] Have a big machine and spare time? Here's a possible Python bug.

2019-05-24 Thread Tim Peters
[Tim] > Key invariants: > ... > 2. nfp2lasta[pa->nfreepools] == pa if and only if pa is the only arena > in usable_arenas with that many free pools. Ack! Scratch that. I need a nap :-( In fact if that equality holds, it means that nfp2lasta entry has to change if pa is moved and pa->prevarena

Re: [Python-Dev] Have a big machine and spare time? Here's a possible Python bug.

2019-05-24 Thread Tim Peters
[Tim] > I'll note that the approach I very briefly sketched before > (restructure the list of arenas to partition it into multiple lists > partitioned by number of free pools) "should make" obmalloc > competitive with malloc here ... But it's also intrusive, breaking up a simple linked list into

Re: [Python-Dev] [python-committers] PEP 595: Improving bugs.python.org

2019-05-24 Thread Ezio Melotti
On Fri, May 24, 2019, 23:14 Gregory P. Smith wrote: > > > On Fri, May 24, 2019 at 1:48 PM Ezio Melotti > wrote: > >> >> On Fri, May 24, 2019, 20:23 Gregory P. Smith wrote: >> >>> -cc: committers to avoid crossposting. >>> >> >> +1 (I wanted to include committers, since the announcement about

Re: [Python-Dev] [python-committers] PEP 595: Improving bugs.python.org

2019-05-24 Thread Gregory P. Smith
On Fri, May 24, 2019 at 1:48 PM Ezio Melotti wrote: > > On Fri, May 24, 2019, 20:23 Gregory P. Smith wrote: > >> -cc: committers to avoid crossposting. >> > > +1 (I wanted to include committers, since the announcement about PEP 581 > was posted there too, but it's better to keep the discussion

Re: [Python-Dev] [python-committers] PEP 595: Improving bugs.python.org

2019-05-24 Thread Ezio Melotti
On Fri, May 24, 2019, 20:23 Gregory P. Smith wrote: > -cc: committers to avoid crossposting. > +1 (I wanted to include committers, since the announcement about PEP 581 was posted there too, but it's better to keep the discussion here) > I have feedback for roundup as experienced on BPO that

Re: [Python-Dev] we will probably be having an difficult discussion about the stdlib after PEP 594 is done (was: PEP 594: Removing dead batteries from the standard library)

2019-05-24 Thread Nathaniel Smith
On Thu, May 23, 2019 at 2:18 PM Brett Cannon wrote: > I'm personally viewing it as a first step in addressing the maintenance > burden we have with such a large stdlib. Christian started this work over a > year ago and I think it's worth seeing through. After that we should probably > have a

Re: [Python-Dev] we will probably be having an difficult discussion about the stdlib after PEP 594 is done

2019-05-24 Thread Brett Cannon
On Fri, May 24, 2019 at 11:07 AM Nathaniel Smith wrote: > On Fri, May 24, 2019, 08:08 Ben Cail wrote: > >> >> Why not have the PSF hire someone (or multiple people) to be paid to >> work on the maintenance burden? This could be similar to the Django >> fellows: >>

Re: [Python-Dev] PEP 594 -- Bundling libraries?

2019-05-24 Thread Brett Cannon
On Fri, May 24, 2019 at 12:20 AM Inada Naoki wrote: > When removing libraries from stdlib, can we bundle > removed libraries and install it like ensurepip does? > I think that would require people picking those modules up and maintaining them. But even then I don't know how easy it would be to

Re: [Python-Dev] PEP 594: update 1

2019-05-24 Thread Brett Cannon
On Thu, May 23, 2019 at 5:45 PM Steven D'Aprano wrote: > On Thu, May 23, 2019 at 02:06:13PM -0700, Brett Cannon wrote: > > On Wed, May 22, 2019 at 1:23 PM Sean Wallitsch < > > sean.wallit...@dreamworks.com> wrote: > > > > > My apologies for that oversight. My understanding is that many of the >

Re: [Python-Dev] [python-committers] PEP 595: Improving bugs.python.org

2019-05-24 Thread Gregory P. Smith
-cc: committers to avoid crossposting. I have feedback for roundup as experienced on BPO that should be represented within PEP 595 if we are going to have a summary of "improving roundup for BPO" captured in a PEP (presumably already rejected given 581? But good to have documented regardless so

[Python-Dev] Summary of Python tracker Issues

2019-05-24 Thread Python tracker
ACTIVITY SUMMARY (2019-05-17 - 2019-05-24) Python tracker at https://bugs.python.org/ To view or respond to any of the issues listed below, click on the issue. Do NOT respond to this message. Issues counts and deltas: open7067 ( +0) closed 41721 (+88) total 48788 (+88) Open issues

Re: [Python-Dev] we will probably be having an difficult discussion about the stdlib after PEP 594 is done

2019-05-24 Thread Nathaniel Smith
On Fri, May 24, 2019, 08:08 Ben Cail wrote: > > Why not have the PSF hire someone (or multiple people) to be paid to > work on the maintenance burden? This could be similar to the Django > fellows: > https://www.djangoproject.com/fundraising/#who-is-the-django-fellow. It > seems like a good

Re: [Python-Dev] Python in next Windows 10 update

2019-05-24 Thread Giampaolo Rodola'
On Wed, 22 May 2019 at 03:30, Steve Dower wrote: > Hi all > > Just sharing this here because I think it's important for us to be aware > of it - I'm not trying to promote or sell anything here :) (Those who > were at the language summit have seen this already.) > > In the next Windows 10 update

Re: [Python-Dev] Have a big machine and spare time? Here's a possible Python bug.

2019-05-24 Thread Tim Peters
[Inada Naoki ] > For the record, result for 10M nodes, Ubuntu 18.04 on AWS r5a.4xlarge: I'm unclear on what "nodes" means. If you mean you changed 27M to 10M in this line: for token in random_strings(27_000_000): that's fine, but there are about 40 times more than that `Node` objects

Re: [Python-Dev] PEP 594 - a proposal for unmaintained modules

2019-05-24 Thread Steve Dower
On 23May2019 2355, Steven D'Aprano wrote: I don't know if this is a good idea or a terrible idea or somewhere in between, so I'm throwing it out to see if anyone likes it. Let's add a third option to PEP 594 between "keep" and "remove": explicitly flagging a module as unmaintained. Unmaintained

Re: [Python-Dev] Python in next Windows 10 update

2019-05-24 Thread Steve Dower
On 24May2019 0220, Baptiste Carvello wrote: Hello, Le 21/05/2019 à 22:30, Steve Dower a écrit : [...] * the Python 3.7 installed from the store will not auto-update to 3.8, but when 3.8 is released we (Microsoft) will update the redirect to point at it * if you pass arguments to the redirect

Re: [Python-Dev] we will probably be having an difficult discussion about the stdlib after PEP 594 is done

2019-05-24 Thread Ben Cail
First, thanks to all the python core devs (and others) who work on Python - many, many people (myself included) benefit from your work. Suggestion below... On 5/23/19 9:02 PM, Barry Warsaw wrote: On May 23, 2019, at 14:17, Brett Cannon wrote: I'm personally viewing it as a first step in

Re: [Python-Dev] Python in next Windows 10 update

2019-05-24 Thread Baptiste Carvello
Hello, Le 21/05/2019 à 22:30, Steve Dower a écrit : > > [...] > > * the Python 3.7 installed from the store will not auto-update to 3.8, > but when 3.8 is released we (Microsoft) will update the redirect to > point at it > * if you pass arguments to the redirect command, it just exits with an >

Re: [Python-Dev] Have a big machine and spare time? Here's a possible Python bug.

2019-05-24 Thread Thomas Wouters
On Thu, May 23, 2019 at 5:15 PM Steve Dower wrote: > On 23May2019 0542, Inada Naoki wrote: > > 1. perf shows 95% of CPU time is eaten by _PyObject_Free, not kernel > space. > > 2. This loop is cleary hot: > > >

Re: [Python-Dev] Have a big machine and spare time? Here's a possible Python bug.

2019-05-24 Thread Victor Stinner
Le ven. 24 mai 2019 à 09:41, Inada Naoki a écrit : > For the record, result for 10M nodes, Ubuntu 18.04 on AWS r5a.4xlarge: > > $ local/bin/python3 t1.py # default > 1138.1123778309993 -- end train, start del > 688.7927911250008 -- end > > $ arena-1m/bin/python3 t1.py # Changed ARENA_SIZE to

Re: [Python-Dev] Have a big machine and spare time? Here's a possible Python bug.

2019-05-24 Thread Inada Naoki
> > > > > > It's relatively easy to test replacing our custom allocators with the > > > system ones, yes? Can we try those to see whether they have the same > > > characteristic? > > > > > > > Yes. > > > > PYTHONMALLOC=malloc LD_PRELOAD=/path/to/jemalloc.so python script.py > > > > I will try it

[Python-Dev] PEP 594 -- Bundling libraries?

2019-05-24 Thread Inada Naoki
When removing libraries from stdlib, can we bundle removed libraries and install it like ensurepip does? Ruby does similar thing, called "Gemification". See https://rubykaigi.org/2017/presentations/hsbt.html When people don't use venv, scripts importing nntplib or aifc runs correctly. When

[Python-Dev] PEP 594 - a proposal for unmaintained modules

2019-05-24 Thread Steven D'Aprano
I don't know if this is a good idea or a terrible idea or somewhere in between, so I'm throwing it out to see if anyone likes it. Let's add a third option to PEP 594 between "keep" and "remove": explicitly flagging a module as unmaintained. Unmaintained modules: - will raise a warning when