[Python-Dev] Re: "immortal" objects and how they would help per-interpreter GIL

2021-12-18 Thread Greg Ewing
On 17/12/21 6:58 pm, Steven D'Aprano wrote: Or a Doctor Who episode. Doctor Who and the Immortal Instances of Doom. Hmmm... and Guido has a time machine... Is it possible he's secretly a Time Lord? -- Greg ___ Python-Dev mailing list --

[Python-Dev] Re: The python command help is too long

2021-12-18 Thread Guido van Rossum
On Sat, Dec 18, 2021 at 2:16 PM Serhiy Storchaka wrote: > The output of "python -h" is 104 lines long now. It was only 51 lines in > 3.6. 35% of it is about the -X option, and 30% about environment > variables. Also some lines in the -X option description are too long > (102 columns). Both

[Python-Dev] The python command help is too long

2021-12-18 Thread Serhiy Storchaka
The output of "python -h" is 104 lines long now. It was only 51 lines in 3.6. 35% of it is about the -X option, and 30% about environment variables. Also some lines in the -X option description are too long (102 columns). Both topics are "advanced" and mostly interested for debugging. I suggest to

[Python-Dev] Re: RFC on Callable Syntax PEP

2021-12-18 Thread Batuhan Taskaya
I think I've posted it as a standalone reply (sorry for my bad mailing list skills), so linking my thread about potential concerns/reservations: https://mail.python.org/archives/list/python-dev@python.org/thread/FI4AFU3I25PECARIH2EVKAD5C5RJRE2N/ ___

[Python-Dev] Re: RFC on Callable Syntax PEP

2021-12-18 Thread Paul Moore
I agree. The same concerns and reservations apply for me. On Sat, 18 Dec 2021 at 21:13, Terry Reedy wrote: > > Batuhan expresses my concerns better than I could, so I just add my > agreement. > > On 12/18/2021 3:13 PM, Batuhan Taskaya wrote: > > > tl;dr: I find it very troubling that we are

[Python-Dev] Re: RFC on Callable Syntax PEP

2021-12-18 Thread Terry Reedy
Batuhan expresses my concerns better than I could, so I just add my agreement. On 12/18/2021 3:13 PM, Batuhan Taskaya wrote: tl;dr: I find it very troubling that we are going on a path where need to increase the language complexity (syntax) only in the cause 'easier' typing. So I am opposed

[Python-Dev] Re: RFC on Callable Syntax PEP

2021-12-18 Thread Batuhan Taskaya
First of all, thank you for authoring a really well-written PEP. tl;dr: I find it very troubling that we are going on a path where need to increase the language complexity (syntax) only in the cause 'easier' typing. So I am opposed to this change. Most of the native typing use cases until now

[Python-Dev] Re: "immortal" objects and how they would help per-interpreter GIL

2021-12-18 Thread Antoine Pitrou
On Sat, 18 Dec 2021 08:40:57 - "Jim J. Jewett" wrote: > Why are Immutability and transitive Immortality needed to share an object > across interpreters? Immutability is a functional requirement: you don't want one interpreter to be able to change the state of another one by mistake. Unlike

[Python-Dev] Re: "immortal" objects and how they would help per-interpreter GIL

2021-12-18 Thread Jim J. Jewett
Why are Immutability and transitive Immortality needed to share an object across interpreters? Are you assuming that a change in one interpreter should not be seen by others? (Typical case, but not always true.) Or are you saying that there is a technical problem such that a change --