Re: [Python-Dev] PEP 3121, 384 Refactoring Issues

2014-07-15 Thread Nick Coghlan
On 14 Jul 2014 11:41, Brett Cannon br...@python.org wrote: I agree for PEP 3121 which is the initialization/finalization work. The stable ABi is not necessary. So maybe we should re-examine the patches and accept the bits that clean up init/finalization and leave out any ABi-related changes.

Re: [Python-Dev] PEP 3121, 384 Refactoring Issues

2014-07-14 Thread Martin v. Löwis
Am 12.07.14 17:19, schrieb Nick Coghlan: Using the stable ABI for standard library extensions also serves to decouple them further from the internal details of the CPython runtime, making it more likely they will be able to run correctly on alternative interpreters (since emulating or

Re: [Python-Dev] PEP 3121, 384 Refactoring Issues

2014-07-14 Thread Brett Cannon
On Mon Jul 14 2014 at 11:27:34 AM, Martin v. Löwis mar...@v.loewis.de wrote: Am 12.07.14 17:19, schrieb Nick Coghlan: Using the stable ABI for standard library extensions also serves to decouple them further from the internal details of the CPython runtime, making it more likely they will

Re: [Python-Dev] PEP 3121, 384 Refactoring Issues

2014-07-14 Thread Alexander Belopolsky
On Mon, Jul 14, 2014 at 11:41 AM, Brett Cannon br...@python.org wrote: So maybe we should re-examine the patches and accept the bits that clean up init/finalization and leave out any ABI-related changes. This is precisely what I suggested two years ago.

Re: [Python-Dev] PEP 3121, 384 Refactoring Issues

2014-07-12 Thread Nick Coghlan
On 10 Jul 2014 19:59, Alexander Belopolsky alexander.belopol...@gmail.com wrote: On Thu, Jul 10, 2014 at 2:59 PM, Mark Lawrence breamore...@yahoo.co.uk wrote: I'm just curious as to why there are 54 open issues after both of these PEPs have been accepted and 384 is listed as finished. Did we

Re: [Python-Dev] PEP 3121, 384 Refactoring Issues

2014-07-12 Thread Alexander Belopolsky
On Sat, Jul 12, 2014 at 11:19 AM, Nick Coghlan ncogh...@gmail.com wrote: The main downside of do as we say, not as we do in this case is that we miss out on the feedback loop of what the stable ABI is like to *use*. I good start for improving the situation would be to convert the extension

Re: [Python-Dev] PEP 3121, 384 Refactoring Issues

2014-07-11 Thread Stefan Krah
Brett Cannon br...@python.org wrote: No, the PEPs were fine and were accepted properly. A huge portion of the open issues are from Robin Schreiber who as part of GSoC 2012 -- https:// www.google-melange.com/gsoc/project/details/google/gsoc2012/robin_hood/ 5668600916475904 -- went through and

[Python-Dev] PEP 3121, 384 Refactoring Issues

2014-07-10 Thread Mark Lawrence
I'm just curious as to why there are 54 open issues after both of these PEPs have been accepted and 384 is listed as finished. Did we hit some unforeseen technical problem which stalled development? For these and any other open issues if you need some Windows testing doing please feel free

Re: [Python-Dev] PEP 3121, 384 Refactoring Issues

2014-07-10 Thread Brett Cannon
[for those that don't know, 3121 is extension module inti/finalization and 384 is the stable ABI] On Thu Jul 10 2014 at 3:47:03 PM, Mark Lawrence breamore...@yahoo.co.uk wrote: I'm just curious as to why there are 54 open issues after both of these PEPs have been accepted and 384 is listed as

Re: [Python-Dev] PEP 3121, 384 Refactoring Issues

2014-07-10 Thread Guido van Rossum
I don't know the details, but I suspect that was the result of my general guideline don't start projects cleaning up lots of stdlib code just to satisfy some new style rule or just to use a new API -- which came from hard-won experience where such a cleanup project introduced some new bugs that

Re: [Python-Dev] PEP 3121, 384 Refactoring Issues

2014-07-10 Thread Alexander Belopolsky
On Thu, Jul 10, 2014 at 2:59 PM, Mark Lawrence breamore...@yahoo.co.uk wrote: I'm just curious as to why there are 54 open issues after both of these PEPs have been accepted and 384 is listed as finished. Did we hit some unforeseen technical problem which stalled development? I tried to

Re: [Python-Dev] PEP 3121, 384 Refactoring Issues

2014-07-10 Thread Ethan Furman
On 07/10/2014 04:57 PM, Alexander Belopolsky wrote: On Thu, Jul 10, 2014 at 2:59 PM, Mark Lawrence wrote: I'm just curious as to why there are 54 open issues after both of these PEPs have been accepted and 384 is listed as finished. Did we hit some unforeseen technical problem which stalled