Re: teacher need help!

2015-10-18 Thread Jason Friedman
> Can I suggest you find the turtle.py module in c:\windows\system32, move it > to somewhere more suitable and try the code again? Or, copy it, rather than move it? It may be that for some students turtle.py is in a terrific place already. -- https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list

Re: Converting tuple of lists of variable length into dictionary

2015-10-18 Thread Denis McMahon
On Sun, 18 Oct 2015 03:17:18 -0700, Beppe wrote: > hi to everybody, I must turn a tuple of lists into a dictionary. I went down a different path to Peter, and discovered something perplexing: This failed: d = { i: deepcopy(l).remove(i) for l in t for i in l } So I tried to expand it out to

[issue25435] Wrong function calls and referring to not removed concepts in descriptor HowTo (documentation)

2015-10-18 Thread Martin Panter
Martin Panter added the comment: Thanks for the patch. I left a few comments on the code review. I think the class is meant to represent a real function object, not a wrapper. And it would be good to update the following paragraphs about unbound methods. Also, it looks like the rest of that

Re: teacher need help!

2015-10-18 Thread Chris Angelico
On Mon, Oct 19, 2015 at 11:50 AM, Jason Friedman wrote: >> Can I suggest you find the turtle.py module in c:\windows\system32, move it >> to somewhere more suitable and try the code again? > > Or, copy it, rather than move it? > It may be that for some students turtle.py is in

Re: teacher need help!

2015-10-18 Thread Michael Torrie
On 10/17/2015 05:46 PM, Storey, Geneva wrote: > I am teaching a coding class to students grades 7-12. We have been > using Python, which seems to be a perfect fit. Everything was going > great until this week when I began teaching turtle. Suddenly, of the > 13 computers that I have, 3 began

[issue25437] Issue with ftplib.FTP_TLS and server forcing SSL connection reuse

2015-10-18 Thread Daniel Waites
Daniel Waites added the comment: Incidentally, there appears to be an old bug report with a similar error message, although the error is encountered in a different context. http://bugs.python.org/issue10808 . Evidently, errors encountered in libssl aren't necessarily being propagated up to

Re: Converting tuple of lists of variable length into dictionary

2015-10-18 Thread Denis McMahon
On Sun, 18 Oct 2015 20:38:26 +, Denis McMahon wrote: > On Sun, 18 Oct 2015 03:17:18 -0700, Beppe wrote: > >> hi to everybody, I must turn a tuple of lists into a dictionary. > > I went down a different path to Peter, and discovered something > perplexing: I just realised staring at it

Re: string class variable to sqlite3

2015-10-18 Thread Chris Angelico
On Mon, Oct 19, 2015 at 3:10 AM, andybrookestar--- via Python-list wrote: > I acknowledge the security points & also by the way I omitted using any Try > Catch statements , because at this stage coming from PHP I was more focused > on getting a select statement to

[issue13195] subprocess: args with shell=True is not documented on Windows

2015-10-18 Thread Martin Panter
Martin Panter added the comment: I think the documentation changes made for Issue 16115 should address your first question (shell=False). For shell=True, see the discussion at Issue 20344. Perhaps you can review my patch. -- dependencies: +test the executable arg to Popen() and

Re: Where is the menu bar for 3.5?

2015-10-18 Thread Michael Torrie
On 10/17/2015 09:27 PM, Peachy Keen wrote: > I am learning to code and I downloaded Python 3.5 32bit. But I can't > find the menu bar and after much frustration I uninstalled the > program. I would like to get started again so if you could assist it > would be appreciated. Python itself is in

[issue25437] Issue with ftplib.FTP_TLS and server forcing SSL connection reuse

2015-10-18 Thread Daniel Waites
New submission from Daniel Waites: There is an issue with the python FTPS module in the standard library which appears to be related to SSL session reuse. I noticed when I updated to a recent version of Pure-FTPd (1.0.42), python's FTPS library client stopped working and generated an error in

[issue25434] Fix typo in whatsnew/3.5

2015-10-18 Thread Berker Peksag
Berker Peksag added the comment: Good catch, fixed in 530846c3ebb4 and f020a27b5391. Thanks SilentGhost. -- ___ Python tracker ___

[issue25435] Wrong function calls and referring to not removed concepts in descriptor HowTo (documentation)

2015-10-18 Thread Martin Panter
Martin Panter added the comment: Also further up the page, “unbound methods . . . are . . . based on the descriptor protocol” is probably not really correct or useful. Issue 23702 is already open about mentioning unbound methods. -- ___ Python

[issue23702] docs.python.org/3/howto/descriptor.html still refers to "unbound methods"

2015-10-18 Thread Martin Panter
Martin Panter added the comment: Current patch for Issue 25435 addresses the code example. Changes to the text are also needed though. -- dependencies: +Wrong function calls and referring to not removed concepts in descriptor HowTo (documentation) nosy: +martin.panter

[issue25436] argparse.ArgumentError missing error message in __repr__

2015-10-18 Thread Berker Peksag
Changes by Berker Peksag : -- nosy: +berker.peksag stage: -> patch review type: -> behavior versions: +Python 3.4, Python 3.5, Python 3.6 ___ Python tracker

rJSmin 1.0.12

2015-10-18 Thread André Malo
Hello World, I'm pleased to announce version 1.0.12 of rJSmin. About rJSmin rJSmin is a javascript minifier written in python. The minifier is based on the semantics of jsmin.c by Douglas Crockford. The module is a re-implementation aiming for speed, so it can be used at runtime

Re: Converting tuple of lists of variable length into dictionary

2015-10-18 Thread Erik
On 18/10/15 21:38, Denis McMahon wrote: I'm not sure I understand why after m = deepcopy(l); m.remove(i); m is a different value to that which it as after m = deepcopy(l).remove(i). It's because list.remove() returns None, not 'self'. E. -- https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list

Re: teacher need help!

2015-10-18 Thread Chris Angelico
On Mon, Oct 19, 2015 at 12:32 PM, Storey, Geneva wrote: > Same issue! See attached. > Thanks! I can't really read it in the image. Can you copy and paste the text into the body of the email, please? But I think you still have a file called turtle.py. Avoid

[issue23391] Documentation of EnvironmentError (OSError) arguments disappeared

2015-10-18 Thread Serhiy Storchaka
Changes by Serhiy Storchaka : -- assignee: docs@python -> martin.panter stage: patch review -> commit review ___ Python tracker ___

[issue23391] Documentation of EnvironmentError (OSError) arguments disappeared

2015-10-18 Thread Serhiy Storchaka
Serhiy Storchaka added the comment: The patch LGTM. We should handle the problem with extra arguments in separate issue. -- ___ Python tracker ___

[issue23391] Documentation of EnvironmentError (OSError) arguments disappeared

2015-10-18 Thread Serhiy Storchaka
Changes by Serhiy Storchaka : -- Removed message: http://bugs.python.org/msg253170 ___ Python tracker ___

Re: teacher need help!

2015-10-18 Thread Storey, Geneva
Same issue! See attached. Thanks! Geneva Storey Fulton High School Spanish, Mathematics Bulldog Academy From: Jason Friedman Sent: Sunday, October 18, 2015 7:50 PM To: Tim Golden Cc: Storey, Geneva;

[issue23391] Documentation of EnvironmentError (OSError) arguments disappeared

2015-10-18 Thread Serhiy Storchaka
Serhiy Storchaka added the comment: Perhaps you missed my comments to previous patch on Rietveld. Besides this the patch LGTM. May be we should change weird behavior for 6+ arguments. But this is different issue. -- ___ Python tracker

[issue16785] Document the fact that constructing OSError with erron returns subclass if possible

2015-10-18 Thread Martin Panter
Martin Panter added the comment: My proposed patch at Issue 23391 addresses this -- dependencies: +Documentation of EnvironmentError (OSError) arguments disappeared nosy: +martin.panter ___ Python tracker

[issue25420] "import random" blocks on entropy collection on Linux with low entropy

2015-10-18 Thread STINNER Victor
STINNER Victor added the comment: "The RNG is seeded from os.urandom, which as of python 3.5 uses the potentially blocking getrandom() call." Hum ok, so your issue is specific to Linux. "This causes problems e.g. on our build VMs that don't have true entropy, so getrandom() blocks forever"

[issue25435] Wrong function calls and referring to not removed concepts in descriptor HowTo (documentation)

2015-10-18 Thread David Becher
New submission from David Becher: Since Python 3 removed unbound methods, I found some references using the old terminology in this HowTo about descriptors (https://docs.python.org/3/howto/descriptor.html). Also, since unbound methods have been removed, the function call types.MethodType now

[issue25435] Wrong function calls and referring to not removed concepts in descriptor HowTo (documentation)

2015-10-18 Thread SilentGhost
Changes by SilentGhost : -- nosy: +rhettinger ___ Python tracker ___ ___

[issue25436] argparse.ArgumentError missing error message in __repr__

2015-10-18 Thread Daniel Fortunov
New submission from Daniel Fortunov: ArgumentError's __init__() fails to call super(), meaning that the base exception doesn’t get a message, and thus repr() always returns “argparse.ArgumentError()” with no message. Not very helpful if that repr gets logged, or included in another error

teacher need help!

2015-10-18 Thread Storey, Geneva
[cid:116d034a-818f-4cfe-b051-5e19107197bb] Hello there, I am teaching a coding class to students grades 7-12. We have been using Python, which seems to be a perfect fit. Everything was going great until this week when I began teaching turtle. Suddenly, of the 13 computers that I have, 3

[issue25395] SIGSEGV using json.tool: highly nested OrderedDict

2015-10-18 Thread Martin Panter
Martin Panter added the comment: Here is a patch that seems to fix the problem for me. Can someone who knows more about tp_dealloc() methods and the Py_TRASHCAN_SAFE stuff have a look? All I know is that the body of the trashcan stuff can be deferred until an outer nested body is finished, so

[issue25410] Clean up and fix OrderedDict

2015-10-18 Thread Serhiy Storchaka
Serhiy Storchaka added the comment: Here is a patch that makes both implementations to use type(self) instead of self.__class__ in __repr__(), __reduce__() and copy(). There is a difference between current implementations. Python implementation uses self.__class__ in copy(), C implementation

Re: Problem with copy.deepcopy and multiprocessing.Queue

2015-10-18 Thread James DeVincentis
Seems I found the cause. os._exit() is used in ForkingMixIn for SocketServer and it’s child classes. Since os._exit() doesn’t flush buffers or clean anything up (hence not running the Finalize hooks that multiprocess.Queue use to make sure data gets flushed), this breaks multiprocess.Queue.

Re: Problem with copy.deepcopy and multiprocessing.Queue

2015-10-18 Thread James DeVincentis
I see, looks like I’ll have to use Queue.close() Didn’t think it would be necessary since I was assuming it would be garbage collected. Sigh. Bug, fixed. Thanks everyone! > On Oct 18, 2015, at 3:41 AM, James DeVincentis wrote: > > I get why it needs to be called, but this

Trying to build Python

2015-10-18 Thread Jeff Archer
I am trying to build Python on windows. I have gotten the source in compressed form, Python-3.5.0.tgz. Attempting to follow PCBuild\readme.txt Ran the get_externals.bat in the PCBuild folder. No apparent errors. Trying to build and getting errors: 1> abort: there is no Mercurial repository

Re: Where is the menu bar for 3.5?

2015-10-18 Thread Terry Reedy
On 10/17/2015 11:27 PM, Peachy Keen wrote: Good evening, I am learning to code and I downloaded Python 3.5 32bit. But I can't find the menu bar and after much frustration I uninstalled the program. I would like to get started again so if you could assist it would be appreciated. What OS?

[issue25410] Clean up and fix OrderedDict

2015-10-18 Thread Roundup Robot
Roundup Robot added the comment: New changeset b6e33798f82a by Serhiy Storchaka in branch '3.5': Issue #25410: Cleaned up and fixed minor bugs in C implementation of OrderedDict. https://hg.python.org/cpython/rev/b6e33798f82a New changeset 741ef17e9b86 by Serhiy Storchaka in branch 'default':

Re: Problem with copy.deepcopy and multiprocessing.Queue

2015-10-18 Thread James DeVincentis
I get why it needs to be called, but this looks like a serious annoyance. Now I need help figuring this out. socketserver.ForkingMixIn needs to use os._exit() so that the process never makes it past handling the request. However, if there is a thread running inside that process that manages a

Re: Problem with copy.deepcopy and multiprocessing.Queue

2015-10-18 Thread James DeVincentis
I’ve managed to partially confirm this theory. I switched the HTTPServer to use the ThreadingMixIn instead of the ForkingMixIn. This causes the queue to behave correctly. The queue is created before any items are forked, then all of the processes are forked out that support the HTTPServer. It

Re: teacher need help!

2015-10-18 Thread Tim Golden
On 18/10/2015 00:46, Storey, Geneva wrote: I am teaching a coding class to students grades 7-12. We have been using Python, which seems to be a perfect fit. Everything was going great until this week when I began teaching turtle. Suddenly, of the 13 computers that I have, 3 began giving the

Re: Python 3.5.0 Feedback

2015-10-18 Thread Christian Gollwitzer
Am 17.10.15 um 15:23 schrieb Nils-Hero Lindemann: Hallo, Zuerst mal, ein dickes Danke an alle, die an Python mitarbeiten! This is an English speaking newsgroup. If you want discussion in German, post to de.comp.lang.python I'm not on Windows myself, so I can't comment on many of your

Python 3.5.0 Feedback

2015-10-18 Thread Nils-Hero Lindemann via Python-list
Hallo, Zuerst mal, ein dickes Danke an alle, die an Python mitarbeiten! Hier ein paar Dinge, die mir an 3.5.0 aufgefallen sind (ich komme von 3.2.3): === Informitis === * Die Namen der Links im Startmenü und die erste Zeile der interaktiven Kommandozeile sind von (noch größerer) Informitis

Where is the menu bar for 3.5?

2015-10-18 Thread Peachy Keen
Good evening, I am learning to code and I downloaded Python 3.5 32bit. But I can't find the menu bar and after much frustration I uninstalled the program. I would like to get started again so if you could assist it would be appreciated. Peachy--

[issue7352] pythonx.y-config --ldflags out of /usr and missing -L

2015-10-18 Thread koobs
koobs added the comment: To clarify, the bug remains in all branches including default, but only 3.4+ use the .sh script, leaving 3.3, 3.2, 2.7 using the python implementation. -- versions: +Python 3.6 ___ Python tracker

[issue25395] SIGSEGV using json.tool: highly nested OrderedDict

2015-10-18 Thread Martin Panter
Martin Panter added the comment: The following simplified code produces the crash: from collections import OrderedDict obj = [] for _ in range(33): obj = OrderedDict(((None, obj),)) for _ in range(17): obj = [obj] print("Still alive, crash happens at interpreter finalization") This

[issue7352] pythonx.y-config --ldflags out of /usr and missing -L

2015-10-18 Thread koobs
koobs added the comment: The attached patch courtesy of Jan Beich @ FreeBSD minimally mimics (in the python version), the --ldflags output of the shell version of python-config(.sh). The ideal scenario of course would be to use the shell script across all versions, as per revision

[issue25395] SIGSEGV using json.tool: highly nested OrderedDict

2015-10-18 Thread Serhiy Storchaka
Serhiy Storchaka added the comment: I think there is no need to run the test in a subprocess. You can trigger the crash by "del obj". from collections import OrderedDict obj = None for _ in range(1000): obj = OrderedDict([(None, obj)]) del obj support.gc_collect() Unfortunately this test

[issue25395] SIGSEGV using json.tool: highly nested OrderedDict

2015-10-18 Thread Martin Panter
Martin Panter added the comment: Here is a new patch which uses Py_CLEAR() rather than Py_XDECREF(), which seems to cure the negative reference count problem. This change was only a guess based on looking at namespaceobject.c and the Py_CLEAR() documentation, so it would be good for someone

Re: Trying to build Python

2015-10-18 Thread Tim Golden
On 17/10/2015 17:25, Jeff Archer wrote: I am trying to build Python on windows. I have gotten the source in compressed form, Python-3.5.0.tgz. Attempting to follow PCBuild\readme.txt Ran the get_externals.bat in the PCBuild folder. No apparent errors. Trying to build and getting errors: 1>

Re: Converting tuple of lists of variable length into dictionary

2015-10-18 Thread Beppe
Il giorno domenica 18 ottobre 2015 14:35:53 UTC+2, Chris Angelico ha scritto: > On Sun, Oct 18, 2015 at 11:23 PM, Beppe wrote: > > hi Peter, you are right, no duplicates are admitted between lists, > > anyway your solution,works on python 3 but not on 2. > > however

Re: Converting tuple of lists of variable length into dictionary

2015-10-18 Thread Beppe
Il giorno domenica 18 ottobre 2015 14:47:34 UTC+2, Peter Otten ha scritto: > Beppe wrote: > > > Il giorno domenica 18 ottobre 2015 13:00:44 UTC+2, Peter Otten ha scritto: > >> Beppe wrote: > >> > >> > hi to everybody, I must turn a tuple of lists into a dictionary. > >> > > >> > something like

[issue25395] SIGSEGV using json.tool: highly nested OrderedDict

2015-10-18 Thread Serhiy Storchaka
Serhiy Storchaka added the comment: Using Py_CLEAR() fixes symptoms in this test, but the real issue is that deallocating code is executed twice for some objects (for every 25th OrderedDict). PyDict_Type.tp_dealloc() can deposit an object in the _PyTrash_delete_later list if

[issue25433] whitespace in strip()/lstrip()/rstrip()

2015-10-18 Thread Dimitri Papadopoulos Orfanos
New submission from Dimitri Papadopoulos Orfanos: The documentation of strip() / lstrip() / rstrip() should define "whitespace" more precisely. The Python 3 documentation refers to "ASCII whitespace" for bytes.strip() / bytes.lstrip() / bytes.rstrip() and "whitespace" for str.strip() /

Re: Converting tuple of lists of variable length into dictionary

2015-10-18 Thread Chris Angelico
On Sun, Oct 18, 2015 at 11:23 PM, Beppe wrote: > hi Peter, you are right, no duplicates are admitted between lists, > anyway your solution,works on python 3 but not on 2. > however beautiful list comprehension solution. > I will try to suit it for the python version i

Re: Converting tuple of lists of variable length into dictionary

2015-10-18 Thread Peter Otten
Beppe wrote: > hi to everybody, I must turn a tuple of lists into a dictionary. > > something like > > (['a', 'b', 'c', 'd', 'e', 'f'], ['g', 'h', 'i'], ['l', 'm', 'n', 'o']) > > note that the length af each list is variable > > must return > > a ['b', 'c', 'd', 'e', 'f'] > b ['a', 'c', 'd',

Re: Converting tuple of lists of variable length into dictionary

2015-10-18 Thread Beppe
Il giorno domenica 18 ottobre 2015 13:00:44 UTC+2, Peter Otten ha scritto: > Beppe wrote: > > > hi to everybody, I must turn a tuple of lists into a dictionary. > > > > something like > > > > (['a', 'b', 'c', 'd', 'e', 'f'], ['g', 'h', 'i'], ['l', 'm', 'n', 'o']) > > > > note that the length

Converting tuple of lists of variable length into dictionary

2015-10-18 Thread Beppe
hi to everybody, I must turn a tuple of lists into a dictionary. something like (['a', 'b', 'c', 'd', 'e', 'f'], ['g', 'h', 'i'], ['l', 'm', 'n', 'o']) note that the length af each list is variable must return a ['b', 'c', 'd', 'e', 'f'] b ['a', 'c', 'd', 'e', 'f'] c ['a', 'b', 'd', 'e', 'f']

[issue25432] isinstance documentation doesn't explain what happens when type is tuple

2015-10-18 Thread Georg Brandl
Georg Brandl added the comment: But without using the word "disjunctive". -- nosy: +georg.brandl ___ Python tracker ___

Re: Converting tuple of lists of variable length into dictionary

2015-10-18 Thread Peter Otten
Beppe wrote: > Il giorno domenica 18 ottobre 2015 13:00:44 UTC+2, Peter Otten ha scritto: >> Beppe wrote: >> >> > hi to everybody, I must turn a tuple of lists into a dictionary. >> > >> > something like >> > >> > (['a', 'b', 'c', 'd', 'e', 'f'], ['g', 'h', 'i'], ['l', 'm', 'n', 'o']) >> > >>

[issue15999] Using new 'bool' format character

2015-10-18 Thread Serhiy Storchaka
Serhiy Storchaka added the comment: No, it is orthogonal to Argument Clinic. Usually converting to Argument Clinic didn't change semantic. However these changes conflicted with proposed patch. Rebased patch is splitted on two patches. bool_cleanup.patch. It almost doesn't change the behavior.

Re: string class variable to sqlite3

2015-10-18 Thread andybrookestar--- via Python-list
cheers Mark, it was the syntax that was foxing me; I don't like the example of the select statement via the insecure approach because the writer is adding an element of ambiguity since the table has a field called and a variable also called #modifying my class to import sqlite3 class

Re: Trying to build Python

2015-10-18 Thread Jeff Archer
On Sun, Oct 18, 2015 at 5:15 AM, Tim Golden wrote: > On 17/10/2015 17:25, Jeff Archer wrote: > >> I am trying to build Python on windows. I have gotten the source in >> compressed form, Python-3.5.0.tgz. Attempting to follow >> PCBuild\readme.txt >> >> Ran the

Re: string class variable to sqlite3

2015-10-18 Thread andybrookestar--- via Python-list
I acknowledge the security points & also by the way I omitted using any Try Catch statements , because at this stage coming from PHP I was more focused on getting a select statement to actually work in python. Also I know the end use will be off line and is part of a python & kivy project to

[issue15999] Using new 'bool' format character

2015-10-18 Thread Serhiy Storchaka
Changes by Serhiy Storchaka : Added file: http://bugs.python.org/file40810/accept_bool.patch ___ Python tracker ___

Re: string class variable to sqlite3

2015-10-18 Thread Marko Rauhamaa
andybrookes...@googlemail.com: > cursor = self.conn.execute("SELECT * from wiki WHERE one LIKE '%s' "% >self.myString1) That's really dangerous. See: http://stackoverflow.com/questions/309945/how-to-quote-a-strin g-value-explicitly-python-db-api-psycopg2> Now,

Re: Problem with copy.deepcopy and multiprocessing.Queue

2015-10-18 Thread Ian Kelly
On Sun, Oct 18, 2015 at 2:46 AM, James DeVincentis wrote: > > I see, looks like I’ll have to use Queue.close() > > Didn’t think it would be necessary since I was assuming it would be garbage collected. Sigh. Bug, fixed. I'm not really following what the issue is here -- it

[issue25434] Fix typo in whatsnew/3.5

2015-10-18 Thread Louis Sautier
New submission from Louis Sautier: Hi, I noticed a typo in the doc for What’s New In Python 3.5, here's a patch. -- assignee: docs@python components: Documentation files: fixtypo.patch keywords: patch messages: 253155 nosy: docs@python, omelette priority: normal severity: normal status:

PyCon Namibia 2015

2015-10-18 Thread D.M. Procida
PyCon Namibia 2016 will be held in Windhoek, at the University of Namibia, 24th-29th January. for more information. Regards, Daniele -- https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list

PyCon Namibia 2016 (was: PyCon Namibia 2015)

2015-10-18 Thread D.M. Procida
D.M. Procida wrote: > PyCon Namibia 2016 will be held in Windhoek, at the University of > Namibia, 24th-29th January. > > for more information. Subject: corrected, sorry. Daniele --

[issue25434] Fix typo in whatsnew/3.5

2015-10-18 Thread Berker Peksag
Berker Peksag added the comment: Thanks for the patch, Louis. -- nosy: +berker.peksag resolution: -> fixed stage: -> resolved status: open -> closed versions: +Python 3.6 ___ Python tracker

[issue25434] Fix typo in whatsnew/3.5

2015-10-18 Thread Roundup Robot
Roundup Robot added the comment: New changeset 04ce28b11467 by Berker Peksag in branch '3.5': Issue #25434: Fix typo in whatsnew/3.5rst https://hg.python.org/cpython/rev/04ce28b11467 New changeset 93a1b79d0b19 by Berker Peksag in branch 'default': Issue #25434: Fix typo in whatsnew/3.5rst

[issue25434] Fix typo in whatsnew/3.5

2015-10-18 Thread SilentGhost
SilentGhost added the comment: Shouldn't the line above read "now accepts" rather than "how accepts"? -- nosy: +SilentGhost ___ Python tracker ___

Re: Problem with copy.deepcopy and multiprocessing.Queue

2015-10-18 Thread James DeVincentis
The problem isn’t with multiprocess.Queue. The problem is that socketserver.ForkingMixIn calls os._exit() after the request is handled by the forked process. Which I did not know until I dug into the internals of socket server.ForkingMixIn. This causes the Finalize() hooks inside of