Re: [Python-Dev] PEP 384: Defining a Stable ABI

2009-05-26 Thread Martin v. Löwis
Functions declared in the following header files are not part of the ABI: - cellobject.h - classobject.h - code.h - frameobject.h - funcobject.h - genobject.h - pyarena.h - pydebug.h - symtable.h - token.h - traceback.h >>> I don't th

Re: [Python-Dev] PEP 384: Defining a Stable ABI

2009-05-26 Thread M.-A. Lemburg
Martin v. Löwis wrote: >> Now, with the PEP, I have a feeling that the Python C-API >> will in effect be limited to what's in the PEP's idea of >> a usable ABI and open up the non-inluded public C-APIs >> to the same rate of change as the private APIs. > > That's certainly not the plan. Instead, t

Re: [Python-Dev] PEP 384: Defining a Stable ABI

2009-05-26 Thread Martin v. Löwis
> Now, with the PEP, I have a feeling that the Python C-API > will in effect be limited to what's in the PEP's idea of > a usable ABI and open up the non-inluded public C-APIs > to the same rate of change as the private APIs. That's certainly not the plan. Instead, the plan is to have a stable ABI

Re: [Python-Dev] PEP 384: Defining a Stable ABI

2009-05-25 Thread M.-A. Lemburg
Martin v. Löwis wrote: > Thomas Wouters reminded me of a long-standing idea; I finally > found the time to write it down. > > Please comment! > ... > Up until this PEP proposal, we had a very simple scheme for the Python C-API: all documented functions and variables with a "Py" prefix were part o

Re: [Python-Dev] PEP 384: Defining a Stable ABI

2009-05-18 Thread Michael Foord
Martin v. Löwis wrote: It also might make it easier for alternate implementations to support the same API so some modules could work cross implementation - but I suspect that's a non-goal of this PEP :). Indeed :-) I'm also skeptical that this would actually allow cross-implementat

Re: [Python-Dev] PEP 384: Defining a Stable ABI

2009-05-17 Thread Martin v. Löwis
>>> It also might make it easier for alternate implementations to support >>> the same API so some modules could work cross implementation - but I >>> suspect that's a non-goal of this PEP :). >>> >> >> Indeed :-) I'm also skeptical that this would actually allow >> cross-implementation module

Re: [Python-Dev] PEP 384: Defining a Stable ABI

2009-05-17 Thread James Y Knight
On May 17, 2009, at 4:54 PM, Martin v. Löwis wrote: Currently, each feature release introduces a new name for the Python DLL on Windows, and may cause incompatibilities for extension modules on Unix. This PEP proposes to define a stable set of API functions which are guaranteed to be available f

Re: [Python-Dev] PEP 384: Defining a Stable ABI

2009-05-17 Thread Michael Foord
Martin v. Löwis wrote: Dino Viehland wrote: Dirkjan Ochtman wrote: It would seem to me that optimizations are likely to require data structure changes, for exactly the kind of core data structures that you're talking about locking down. But that's just a high-level view, I might be wron

RE: [Python-Dev] PEP 384: Defining a Stable ABI

2009-05-17 Thread Dino Viehland
Dirkjan Ochtman wrote: > > It would seem to me that optimizations are likely to require data > structure changes, for exactly the kind of core data structures that > you're talking about locking down. But that's just a high-level view, > I might be wrong. > In particular I would guess that ref co

Re: [Python-Dev] PEP 384: Defining a Stable ABI

2009-05-17 Thread Martin v. Löwis
Dino Viehland wrote: > Dirkjan Ochtman wrote: >> It would seem to me that optimizations are likely to require data >> structure changes, for exactly the kind of core data structures that >> you're talking about locking down. But that's just a high-level view, >> I might be wrong. >> > > > In part

Re: [Python-Dev] PEP 384: Defining a Stable ABI

2009-05-17 Thread Martin v. Löwis
Dirkjan Ochtman wrote: > On Mon, May 18, 2009 at 12:07 AM, "Martin v. Löwis" > wrote: >> I fail to see the relationship, so: no effect that I can see. >> >> Why do you think that optimization efforts could be related to >> the PEP 384 proposal? > > It would seem to me that optimizations are like

Re: [Python-Dev] PEP 384: Defining a Stable ABI

2009-05-17 Thread Dirkjan Ochtman
On Mon, May 18, 2009 at 12:07 AM, "Martin v. Löwis" wrote: > I fail to see the relationship, so: no effect that I can see. > > Why do you think that optimization efforts could be related to > the PEP 384 proposal? It would seem to me that optimizations are likely to require data structure changes

Re: [Python-Dev] PEP 384: Defining a Stable ABI

2009-05-17 Thread Martin v. Löwis
>> Functions declared in the following header files are not part >> of the ABI: >> - cellobject.h >> - classobject.h >> - code.h >> - frameobject.h >> - funcobject.h >> - genobject.h >> - pyarena.h >> - pydebug.h >> - symtable.h >> - token.h >> - traceback.h > > What kind of effect does this have

Re: [Python-Dev] PEP 384: Defining a Stable ABI

2009-05-17 Thread Dirkjan Ochtman
On Sun, May 17, 2009 at 10:54 PM, "Martin v. Löwis" wrote: > Excluded Functions > -- > > Functions declared in the following header files are not part > of the ABI: > - cellobject.h > - classobject.h > - code.h > - frameobject.h > - funcobject.h > - genobject.h > - pyarena.h > - py