Re: Why Python3

2010-06-29 Thread John Yeung
On Jun 28, 1:58 pm, "OKB (not okblacke)" wrote: > Steven D'Aprano wrote: > > For the rest of us, you can do a lot with just Python 3.1, > > with or without C modules. Whether it does *enough* to be > > considered for deployment depends on what you're deploying > > it to do. I for one would not hes

RE: Why Python3

2010-06-29 Thread Dino Viehland
Terry wrote: > > IronPython targets Python 2.6. > > They plan to release a 2.7 version sometime this year after CPython2.7 > is released. They plan to release a 3.2 version early next year, soon > after CPython. They should be able to do that because they already have > a 3.1 version mostly done

Re: Why Python3

2010-06-29 Thread Martin v. Loewis
Am 29.06.2010 20:30, schrieb Paul Rubin: > "Martin v. Loewis" writes: >> And indeed, that's available, by means of the key= argument to list.sort. > > Unfortunately what's needed for more generality is the ability to supply > a comparison function, which Python2 also offers, but Python3 removes.

Re: Why Python3

2010-06-29 Thread Paul Rubin
"Martin v. Loewis" writes: > And indeed, that's available, by means of the key= argument to list.sort. Unfortunately what's needed for more generality is the ability to supply a comparison function, which Python2 also offers, but Python3 removes. I gave an example a while back of wanting to compa

Re: Why Python3

2010-06-29 Thread Martin v. Loewis
> I should point out that this wasn't a mere whimsy on Guido's part. > Mathematically, supporting larger-than and less-than comparisons on > complex numbers *is* a bug -- they're simply meaningless mathematically. > (Which is greater, 2-1i or -1+2i?) However, that's true for many other values t

Re: Why Python3

2010-06-28 Thread Terry Reedy
On 6/28/2010 12:25 AM, John Nagle wrote: Unfortunately, that's not what's happening in the development pipeline. Please do some research before posting year-old news as current news. > Unladen Swallow targets Python 2.6.1. It used 2.6 for development because that was the current stable relea

Re: Why Python3

2010-06-28 Thread rantingrick
On Jun 28, 12:58 pm, "OKB (not okblacke)" wrote: > Steven D'Aprano wrote: > > None of PyPy, Unladen Swallow or IronPython are dependencies for > > Python 3.x to be "ready for prime time". Neither is C module > > support. > >         I think this is being overoptimistic.  For me, "ready for prime >

Re: Why Python3

2010-06-28 Thread OKB (not okblacke)
Steven D'Aprano wrote: > None of PyPy, Unladen Swallow or IronPython are dependencies for > Python 3.x to be "ready for prime time". Neither is C module > support. I think this is being overoptimistic. For me, "ready for prime time" means "I can rely on being able to find a way to do w

Re: Why Python3

2010-06-28 Thread Steven D'Aprano
On Sun, 27 Jun 2010 21:25:49 -0700, John Nagle wrote: > Unfortunately, that's not what's happening in the development > pipeline. PyPy targets Python 2.5. Unladen Swallow targets Python > 2.6.1. IronPython targets Python 2.6. C module support for CPython 3.x > is still very spotty. We have

Re: Why Python3

2010-06-27 Thread John Nagle
On 6/27/2010 8:28 PM, Carl Banks wrote: On Jun 27, 5:12 pm, Terry Reedy wrote: I think that covers the main transitions in core Python. Nice post, but it's missing one thing. The main benefit of Python 3 for Joe Q. Scripter is this: The Python team doesn't have to spend any effort on mainta

Re: Why Python3

2010-06-27 Thread Carl Banks
On Jun 27, 5:12 pm, Terry Reedy wrote: > I think that covers the main transitions in core Python. Nice post, but it's missing one thing. The main benefit of Python 3 for Joe Q. Scripter is this: The Python team doesn't have to spend any effort on maintaining a lot of old obsolete cruft, and can

Re: Why Python3

2010-06-27 Thread Steven D'Aprano
On Sun, 27 Jun 2010 20:12:10 -0400, Terry Reedy wrote: > 7. Order comparisonS > > In early Python1, I believe all objects could be (arbitrarily) compared > and sorted. When Guido added the complex type, he decided not to add an > arbitrary order, as he thought that could mask bugs. I should poin

Re: Why Python3

2010-06-27 Thread geremy condra
On Sun, Jun 27, 2010 at 9:46 PM, MRAB wrote: > Stephen Hansen wrote: >> >> On 6/27/10 6:09 PM, MRAB wrote: >>> >>> Terry Reedy wrote: Another would have been to add but never remove anthing, with the consequence that Python would become increasingly difficult to learn and the i

Re: Why Python3

2010-06-27 Thread Benjamin Kaplan
On Sun, Jun 27, 2010 at 6:51 PM, eric dexter wrote: > On Jun 27, 7:46 pm, MRAB wrote: >> Stephen Hansen wrote: >> > On 6/27/10 6:09 PM, MRAB wrote: >> >> Terry Reedy wrote: >> >>> Another would have been to add but never remove anthing, with the >> >>> consequence that Python would become increas

Re: Why Python3

2010-06-27 Thread eric dexter
On Jun 27, 7:46 pm, MRAB wrote: > Stephen Hansen wrote: > > On 6/27/10 6:09 PM, MRAB wrote: > >> Terry Reedy wrote: > >>> Another would have been to add but never remove anthing, with the > >>> consequence that Python would become increasingly difficult to learn > >>> and the interpreter increasin

Re: Why Python3

2010-06-27 Thread MRAB
Stephen Hansen wrote: On 6/27/10 6:09 PM, MRAB wrote: Terry Reedy wrote: Another would have been to add but never remove anthing, with the consequence that Python would become increasingly difficult to learn and the interpreter increasingly difficult to maintain with volunteers. I think 2.7 is

Re: Why Python3

2010-06-27 Thread Stephen Hansen
On 6/27/10 6:09 PM, MRAB wrote: Terry Reedy wrote: Another would have been to add but never remove anthing, with the consequence that Python would become increasingly difficult to learn and the interpreter increasingly difficult to maintain with volunteers. I think 2.7 is far enough in that dire

Re: Why Python3

2010-06-27 Thread MRAB
Terry Reedy wrote: Some people appear to not understand the purpose of Python3 or more specifically, of the changes that break Python2 code. I attempt here to give a relatively full explanation. SUMMARY: Python3 completes (or makes progress in) several transitions begun in Python2. In parti